Homebrew Is A Brewin

[Grappletractor]

I've finally hunkered down and started my mill. My steel arrived early this AM. Here is a pic of one of the first cuts
I know this is going to be a long project but when I'm done I know I'm going to be proud of meself 

[getoverit]

Good deal!!

Keep us posted on your progress.. loads of pictures :P

[Shawn]

Wow! I just used a compound miter saw with a metal cutting blade. I now have to take it apart and clean out the metal dust. But it worked like a charm. Finished grinding burrs today and started degreasing and priming.
Shawn...

[highpockets]

Grappletractor I want to wish you all of the luck.  I wish you were closer, I'd help you.  Atleast you've got the metal for it.  I like the saw.  I have three of those.  One to think about is the spring that controlls the load on the blade of the metal saw.  I put a wheel on the tension spring shaft so I can tighten it when making cuts on thin metal.  Much faster that fooling with the present shaft. 

[Grappletractor]

I put a wheel on the tension spring shaft so I can tighten it when making cuts on thin metal.  Much faster that fooling with the present shaft. 

Photo please .
And thanks for the offer of help .

[jrokusek]

Wow! I just used a compound miter saw with a metal cutting blade. I now have to take it apart and clean out the metal dust. But it worked like a charm. Finished grinding burrs today and started degreasing and priming.
Shawn...

OUCH!  Isn't that a bit rough on the saw?   Not really made for that sort of thing but I bet it did make some nice square cuts.   Maybe that's where a Harbor Freight miter saw would be good?   :D

[Dan_Shade]

the metal saws turn slower than the wood ones.  i was going to try that once, but a friend got a nice chop saw for christmas

[Grappletractor]

Finished grinding burrs today and started degreasing and priming.
Shawn...

What are you using to degrease with , I am assuming you mean that thin film of oil that comes on new steel ?

[Grappletractor]

Results of first cuttings for frame . Seven pieces at 34&1/4" long ( sections between main frame beams ) and two two foot sections that will be welded to the main frame to extend it's length to 26 feet.
Metal cutting bandsaws are great, get it set up turn it on and walk off to do other things while it cuts away, each cut here took about 15 minutes .

[Grappletractor]

Another nice thing about the metal cutting bandsaw is it's thin kerf which if I'd have used another method of cutting I would have come up short on my last piece cut from this beam , as it is now I ended up with a scrap piece 3/4 of an inch long.

[jrokusek]

.......... as it is now I ended up with a scrap piece 3/4 of an inch long.

HUH!?!   I have enough scrap to haul in to the scrap dealer to recoup some of the cost of building my saw!  Of course lots of what I used started off as scrap from the scrap pile so I don't know if that counts or not.     8)

[Shawn]

What are you using to degrease with

I had a gallon of paint thinner from a painting project last year. It has mineral spirits in it. I keep old bath towels for just this sort of job. 1/2 of a towel soaked with thinner to clean, then other towels to dry off. Before I primed with self-etching primer, I gave them another wipe with a clean towel.


I have to download that program to post pics. I am taking pics along the way.

[Grappletractor]

I have to download that program to post pics. I am taking pics along the way.

You can do the same thing with Windows Picture and Fax Viewer, which if you have Windows XP I am sure you have.

[Shawn]

Grapple,
I have XP, where might I find this program?

[Grappletractor]

Oh sorry I meant to say Microsoft Photo Editor.If you right click on a photo you have saved in your PC a menu will appear and it should be in there.

[Shawn]

Here is a picture of my stacked steel. Look at that it worked!!!!!

[Grappletractor]

Shawn, nice looking pile of steel there. Will you be putting that buzz box in the background to work today ?

[Shawn]

No, unfortunitly. I was helping my wifes charity with some electrical work. Next weekend I'll be install a deck for a friend. I also have to power that thing up. I was going to make an " extension cord " but thats going to be $$$$$. I have to clean the remainder of my steel. I also need more primer an to drill my holes. I went to tractor supply today ( they have alot of cool stuff). I bought 4 lynch pins for my vertical guides. Due to the weight I'm going to make the cutter head dettachable from the carriage. Maybe when the deck check clears, I'll buy some wire. Also keeping my eye on the delphi situation.
Shawn...

[highpockets]

Shawn, I am curious about removing the cutterhead from the carriage.  Isn't that going to be involved?  Maybe I'm going to learn something here.  Keep us posted.   

[Grappletractor]

Just a quick update to show my slow progress. Here's a picture of the bed all leveled up with crossmembers tacked in place .

[Grappletractor]

Here is a photo of my homebrew welding posititioner, pulley chained to overhead beam, cable from winch on four wheeler run through pulley back down and around side rail on saw bed. Four wheeler anchored down by Grappletractor himself   :D

[highpockets]

Grappletractor, thank God that you are still young and can work on the floor. That is a nice looking frame. 

[Grappletractor]

Thank you Highpockets ,

Yes I am doing this out of my new garage and I don't have much set up in there , in fact not even a decent bench. Yes, thank God that at 46 I am in pretty good health and can get down close to the ground as long as I don't have to bend straight forward , my gut interfears with that  :D
I been to your web site and seen your nice shop set up , wow that must be niced !
Must have taken you a few years to collect all those nice goodies in tools .
Please stop in any time you're up my way. I could use your brain power  ;)

[highpockets]

Grappletractor
It has been a long time getting all of this junk gathered up.  I returned from overseas the first time in 1980 and poured the slab for the shop before the house.  Been adding junk ever since. My ideas were that when I got ready to retire I'd have everything in place to do custom machine work.  I did not realize that iron was going to get heavier. As for coming up your way,  we are planning a visit to D.C. in June. Who knows, we may just wind up in your neck of the woods.  Thanks

[Grappletractor]

Grappletractor
It has been a long time getting all of this junk gathered up.  I returned from overseas the first time in 1980 and poured the slab for the shop before the house.  Been adding junk ever since. My ideas were that when I got ready to retire I'd have everything in place to do custom machine work.  I did not realize that iron was going to get heavier. As for coming up your way,  we are planning a visit to D.C. in June. Who knows, we may just wind up in your neck of the woods.  Thanks

Just let me know before you head out and I'll give you my address and phone number . Park your camper in my yard and we'll run water and electric to it , stay a while  ;D

[jpgreen]

Don't let him bring that big old dog..  ;D

[highpockets]

Thanks Grappletractor, we may just do that. How far are you from D.C.?  With the fuel prices, I may stay at home and wait for JP to bring me that sawmill.

[Shawn]

Presicion welding, Thats what sawyers who buy their mills get that home-brewed sawyers don't.
Been a loooooooooooooong time since I was burnin' some iron. I'm a little out-of-square by about a half inch.. I'll have to fix that.
Will update again next sunday.
Shawn...






Going to remove cross members to square up the carriage.

[jrokusek]

I'm not sure at what point it is out of square, but it may spring into shape when on the tracks.  When I was about done with my carriage I noticed that the v-groove casters on the right and left side came together a bit when I removed the temporary bracing that I thought would hold everything in place.  Well...it didn't.  I did some grinding and rewelding but still had a bit of the same problem.  I finally just mocked up the track and put the carriage on it.  Low and behold it settled right into where it was supposed to be in the first place.  The head went up and down just fine without binding so I wasn't real concerned about and it worked out just fine.  Since you just started maybe it is a good idea to fix it now, however.  Keep in mind I'm more of a woodworker than a metal worker....  ;)

Jim

[Shawn]

Jim, I too am a woodworker, steel seems a little more forgiving. Two reasons I want to Square it up. First, a half inch is alot to staighten out. I welded the 2 long rectangular sides. tached them first, checked for square, then finished welding them. Then I took one of them and welded the for post. Laid the other side down. Fliped over post and welded that side. And there was my problem. I should have tached it and checked for square. Secondly, my 2 lower crossmembers are 32" from the floor, as well as my width. Lower CM should be higher. Just another days work. It won't be pretty, But it will work!!!
Shawn...

[jpgreen]

Yep-

Tack her up square first.  That's the trick. Then some heat management's always a good idea.. 

I enjoy metal working. Wish I knew someone who was real good I could learn more from.

[jrokusek]

Jim, I too am a woodworker, steel seems a little more forgiving. Two reasons I want to Square it up. First, a half inch is alot to staighten out. I welded the 2 long rectangular sides. tached them first, checked for square, then finished welding them. Then I took one of them and welded the for post. Laid the other side down. Fliped over post and welded that side. And there was my problem. I should have tached it and checked for square. Secondly, my 2 lower crossmembers are 32" from the floor, as well as my width. Lower CM should be higher. Just another days work. It won't be pretty, But it will work!!!
Shawn...

Ah....I get it.  If I wrote a book on sawmill building the bulk of it would be, "Don't do this, don't do that, I did it this way but I don't recommend it, etc."

Jim

[wiam]

jrokusek,  I think there is that in a lot of home made mills.  I bet most manufactured mills did not get paint the first trip out of the shop. ;)

Will

[Shawn]

Good news! That 1/2" of wobble is a 1/4" wobble now. What did I do? Nothing! Gravity has done all the work. Carriage has been sitting in the garage since I worked it sunday. Hopefully by this weekend it will be square, then I can install braces.
Shawn...

[jpgreen]

 

Maybe add water... 

[Grappletractor]

Just another update... I've begun work on the log fence posts and operating mechanism.Since I don't own a milling machine I will be taking a few of my parts to an older man in town, he has offered to help with his mini-mill milling machine .

On another note I have just about completed negotiations with a factory in China who manufactures energy chain .If any one is interested in some for their mill let me know and I could increase my order to include enough for you .

[Qweaver]

Hey Grapple,
Good luck with the saw.  Looks like you have a good start.

A common saying in my welding shop is "tack and diagonal brace everything before welding anything" and while that is not always necessary, it probably is in your case.

Also a small space (1/16 to 3/32) should be left between the parts to be fillet welded so that as the weld contracts the parts are not crushed together which can add stress to the weld and also distort the metal and actually make the weldment smaller than planned.

Are you aware that the tee joints will pull in the direction of the weld, particularly if un-restrained by braces( see drawing )  If your tackup is a little out of square you can use this action to help bring it back to square.  If your tackup is square then liberal use of diagonal braces plus attention to weld direction will help keep it straight. 




Again, good luck and have fun.
Quinton

[highpockets]

Grappletractor, I am interested in this energy chain.  I bought some from ??? MSC Supply when I built my plasma cutter. It seems I paid some ??  $200 to 300 for about 12'.   I can't remember but it was high. 

[Grappletractor]

Grappletractor, I am interested in this energy chain.  I bought some from ??? MSC Supply when I built my plasma cutter. It seems I paid some ??  $200 to 300 for about 12'.   I can't remember but it was high. 

What are the dimensions of that chain ? The chain pictured above is 80x100 mm .If
you paid that price for the above chain then I will not even bother with China , can you provide a web link to where you bought it ?

[Shawn]

OK, It ain't pretty, But it will work...I hope! Welded first of 3 sections of track yesterday. Had to cut it apart today and make it a bit more narrower. This is not coming out the way I had hoped. I square it, tack it, square it again, check for square again, welded it, then throw something because it's not square anymore. A timberking 1220 is looking real good right about now.
Shawn...

[jpgreen]

I think your problem is heat now Shawn.

This is where welding experience comes into play.  Knowing where and where not to weld, and welding in alternate places so the heat doesn't throw your frame out of plumb.

A lot of times I tack work to a steel table as well, to hold it square while it heats up, then cools... then grind it off.  Also welding in a jig keeps thing in line, but if you put to long a weld in the wrong place, stuff starts bending, and the welding in the wrong place can weaken the peice.

Another option is carfully welding separate sections first, then welding those sections togther.  All the while limiting your heat.

I wish I knew of a good book to give you more info, but I don't.  Maybe someone will chime in on this and have a good suggestion.

[Grappletractor]

Shawn, go here for all the help you'll ever need from the interent concerning welding ............    http://www.hobartwelders.com/mboard/index.php?

[tcsmpsi]

Shawn,

I don't know if it may help or not, but welding fabrications is much like torquing sequential bolts (like engine headbolts).

When it heats, it's going to expand, and as it cools, it's going to contract, and if the expanding/contracting is out of balance, then the weld and/or the project will be too.

[jpgreen]

Wow!  That's an awesome website.  Thanks Grapp.

Already found answers to some questions I had in mind this morning..   8)

[highpockets]

That is a good site.  Of course I never really mastered a 7018 rod.  If I can't get it with the wirefeeder I normally pick up a 6011 or a 6013.  I can't remember anything breaking so it is good enough for me.

[Grappletractor]

Another update . but 1st lookie what Santa brought me ..........

[Grappletractor]

The motors and pistons to run the hydraulics that are on the frame ...

[Grappletractor]

Here is what I've got done since last update,,,


Legs for four corners of mill


One of the three log stops

[Grappletractor]

Close up of log stop and piece I made to weld on for pivoting

[GF]

Before you weld those to the frame solid for your log stop, you might think about welding a slide solid to the frame and have those slide up and down in the slide.  Tried to draw one below.  this would allow you to square it up with the deck should it get out of square.

[Grappletractor]

Thanks for the suggestion but it's already part of the plan . ;D

[Shawn]

Thanks for the tips everyone. I used pipe clamps to square up my rails and plywood used as spacers. Not too tight or the plywood would bow and throw everything off. I started with just the 2 rails. Squared both to themselves. Everything else is square to them. I used fan to help cool it off quicker. It blow air across the top and not directly on it.



There is my Forewoman inspecting my work. By the expression she is giving me, ??????????


I have a Tecumseh 11HP sport engine (go-kart). It has an electric start and dual alternator. Green wire has 11Volts at idle and Wide Open Throttle. Red wire has 9V at idle and Increases Voltage with engine speed to 25V at WOT. Can anyone help with connecting to battery with voltage regulator?
Thanks again for everyones help and input!
Shawn...

[jpgreen]

Looks like progress is being made..  8)

I was trying to manipulate some bending steel myself today, with clamps and welds...  ;D

[sawguy21]

Sounds like that red wire would go to an external voltage regulator then the battery. 11 volts from the green wire is odd. It may be the charge wire but should be 13.5vdc

[BBTom]

The green wire may have a diode in it that drops the voltage just a tad.  I ran into that on an old international tractor once. 

[highpockets]

Looks good guys.

I am confused about dual alternators. Why?   11 volts seems like it is a little low for charging and for sure 25 is too high.   If this is coming straight off the windings, the are you checking a.c. volts?  I'd try to locate a schematic from the manufacture. 

[Shawn]

This is the engine I have, except I dont have the yellow wire.

Long Link shortened (admin)

[sawguy21]

Well that splains the low voltage at the green wire. It is grounded to shut the engine off. : The red wire would need to be hooked to an external voltage regulator. I suspect you will find that yellow wire hooked to the B post on the starter solenoid. It will come from a diode or or more likely a voltage regulator on the engine.

[sprucebunny]

Thanks for the welding link, GrappleT

Looks like you're coming right along good on your mill 

[Grappletractor]

Thanks for the welding link, GrappleT

Looks like you're coming right along good on your mill 

Thanks and your welcome . Hey how'd ya like the rain at the expo, I was there Saturday afternoon and it was not nice .

[Shawn]

Update from post # 51

I have been looking for a voltage regulator. Maybe automotive type, nope because I can't find pin-outs. I happen to come across the illustrated parts diagram with the VR. Huuummmm?! Let's take the flywheel shield off and take a look. What did I find in there??????  Red is from internal voltage regulator. But 25 volts? Maybe i'll hook up battery to it tomorrow and check it then. It might be full-fielding. Trying to charge with no battery. BTW, Green wire is for remote shut off button. Really wish I had manual from the shop that sold it to me.

[Shawn]

Well, It's been awhile, and I've been working away and here are the pics. I need to come up with a different type of wheel for the carriage to roll on the tracks. I'm a little out of square. When the cutter head gets about 10-12 inches from the top it binds on guides. Gonna try it out tomorrow on some scrap logs. My wife said she would watch from the house with her finger on the 9-1-1 button, just in case. Still have to make the guards and maybe paint. This thing is HEAVY! I don't see how I'm every going to make it portable.

This is a great group of folks with varying opinions. Please weight in with all you got. Good or bad!!!

[jrokusek]

I like your blade guides.  Did you buy them or did you turn them yourself?

It's funny.....when my dad and I were debating where to place my homebuilt sawmill my wife piped up too and yelled, "NEXT TO THE HOSPITAL!"

Jim

[Shawn]

Jim,
My brother-in-law made them for me.

Well, it cuts! Pretty good too. I need to get a v-belt because it's starting to wear and it squeals on throttle up. Most importantly I figure why there are log dogs on sawmills. Wow! Anyhow, my wife and Mother-in-law were having a fit because I was going to run it without  the guards. I told my wife " Don't worry. If there's an accident. you'll be a millionaire" She didn't find the humor in it.