Banding green lumber

[Mesquite Man]

Would using lumber banding for green lumber be a good idea or bad?  The reason I ask is that I have a lumber banding tool, you know, the ones that place a metal band around a pile of lumber, tension it, and clamp it.  

I have cut a small amount of various hardwoods that I have stickered and air drying.  Would it not work to use the lumber bands to help keep the lumber from warping instead of the traditional weight on top?

Thanks for any suggestions or feedback.

Curtis

[Kevin]

I thought of that but there`s a considerable amount of shrinkage, if you could leave the ends long where you could snug the straps as the lumber dries it might work ok.

[Jeff]

I say yes and no. Yes: if you sandwich the lumber between rows of lumber you are willing to sacrifice. We band all our lumber. it will warp and twist between the bands.

On the no side, steel bands can react with tannic acid and cause stain, on softer wood and even some hard wood it can damage board edges as its tightened. Unless you buy the good stuff you will end up with cuts on your hads from handleing the stuff. You have to buy it and the clips.

[Mesquite Man]

My thoughts were to place a band over each sticker stack with a sticker on top of the stack to protect the top boards.  I am also talking about mostly mesquite, the most stable wood in the world, supposedly.

Also, I am a custom home builder by trade and do an average of $15k in purchases from my local lumber yard each month.  They will give me all the banding material and clips that I want, including the heavy duty plastic ones so no expense there.

Seems like it would work good for small quantities.

Curtis

[Tom]

I've seen it used on cypress and the stacks that weren't banded dried just as straight as those that were.  It sure does help in the material handling aspect of the job though.  No broken stacks littered all over the yard.

[Kevin_H.]

Off the drying aspect, but I use painted banding for my bundles of pallet wood, It seem to do an ok job of not reacting with the wood and staining. It does cost a little more.

[ARKANSAWYER]

Cutis,
  One time I saw a guy who had his lumber stacked on 6x6's every 2 ft.  He had large eye bolts front and back about 4 ft apart in them.  He took small nylon ratchet straps and put them on every 6x6 and tightened down the stack. as it dried he would just tighten them up some more.  He did put stickers on top of the 6x6's and a  sticker under the strap.   An idea?
ARKANSAWYER

[Frank_Pender]

Sitruc,
  When I first got started in milling (about 12 years ago) I sawed an awful lot of hardwood and bookmatched the whole log, stickered it in the process and banded to bundle.  As the lumber would shrink I placed wedges at each site of a sitcker and kept the bundle tight.  I had to place a wedge from each side of the bundle to keep uniformity in tension.  I was a great deal of labor intensive effort that never really paid off for me.   Today, If I think a stickered unit will tend to warp I will place 500 to 700lb blocks of cement on the unit.  In this way there is a constant pressure on the lumber.

[Mesquite Man]

Thanks for the info so far.  The 500-700# concrete blocks is what I am trying to avoid.  Seems like a lot more work to me than the banding.  Also, I am planning to build a solar kiln soon and  all the wood will be going into the kiln.  The bands will just be for a few months or so until I can get my kiln built.

Curtis

[sawmill_john]

Banding the green lumber only works until the lumber starts to shrink.  That is why weight works better, you have constant force applied to the lumber.  

Hey Frank what day looks good for me to come see ya?

John

[Bibbyman]

A guy south of me used web load binders and would tighten them up as the stack shrunk - much like what Arkansawyer describes but no eyebolts - just wrapped around.  Trouble is,  you'd need a bunch of them to do very many.  'Corse,  you could do just the top bundle.  I'll generally stack at least 3 bundles high.

I've thought of casting some concrete slabs say 4' x 10' or 12' and 4" or so thick.  They'd have to be light enough to handle with my loader.  I'd stack my farm lumber on sticks out in the yard and then set the slab on top for weight and cover.

[Jacar]

Hey Curtis

Of the mesquite I have cut this year I have had no problem w/ it warping.  I just don't think it will, unless maybe it is cut less than 1/2 ".  I have had no problem w/ red cedar either. The only wood I have problem with that I cut is oak.  As for as banding the way you are describing, though, I don't see a problem.  

I stickered 55 bd ft of 3/4 mesquite in my garage this summer and it dried just fine.  I had no weights on top of the stack.  There is a local sawyer who bands all of his pine and hardwoods to air dry and in kiln dry.  He swears buy it.

BTW.  I was in your neck of the woods earlier this week.  My 13 yr old son shot his first buck.  A nice little 6 pointer.  My nephew shot a 8 point from the same stand last weekend.  I was going to give you a call but my boys were having too much fun.

Good Luck

Jack

[Scott_R]

Bibbyman, If your loader can lift 2500 lbs then you should be able to manage a 12' slab. Let us know how it works. Scott

[LeeB]

How are your blades holding up to sawing mesquite? I milledddd some yesterday and went through 7 blades in 10 logs. Must have had a lot of silica in them. The logs came from around Lake Bucannon. LOts of granit in the area. LeeB

[Mesquite Man]

Lee,

I have only milled 50 or so bf of mesquite, 40 bf of ERC, and 12 bf of black walnut so far.  I am, however still on my 3rd blade.  I might be doing better but I hit a log stop with the first blade, and then pulled the blade off the wheels but not raising up far enough as I came back.  That didn't hurt it too bad but hitting the log dog a couple cuts later did it in!  Boy ain't this fun!!

[LeeB]

 :D Hitting the log stops is the first step to  becoming a real sawyer. Iv'e just about cut the wings off all of my dog screws. >:( Pulled off uncounted blades, and continue to screw up every time I run the mill. LeeB