"Peterson blade bounce?"

[TinMan]

Hey guys....

Im having trouble with blade bounce in the vertical cut on my ATS 8... I sent a Troy a PM hoping he would have the answer Im looking for, some easy fix..... He said he still has trouble with it and is taking 6  inch cuts and two passes to make his 8 inch cuts. Thanks for the input Troy, I appreciate it. Just hoping there is something I can do to help combat the problem. I just figure my 8 inch mill should make an 8 inch cut with no hassle. ???

Anyone have any more input or experiences with this they would care to share?

Helppppppp!! :'( :'(

Tracy

[jpgreen]

You're not playing funk music in the background whilst sawing are you Tracy?..  :D

[TinMan]

No! :D :D :D :D :D

[jpgreen]

Justa thought.......  :D

[Hammy]

Hi Tracy,

I am wondering if you have all the supports set up correctly. When you purchased your sawmill you would have received 2 centre supports, 1 with a diagonal and one with out. These need to be used if you are cutting long logs around 16-20 feet.

Your actual winch upright frames need to be spaced about 3 feet in from each end of the tracks. Centre supports get installed in the middle of these uprights and on each side of the track.

Each raise and lower of the unit the star knobs located on the centre supports require tightening.

Hope this helps, if you're still having problems feel free to call our toll free number 1877 327 1471 & ask for the Technical Dept.

Hammond

[TinMan]

Hammond

Using the the center supports helped a bit, but it seemed as if the saw carriage itself is what was doing the bouncing... :'(

Thanks

Tracy

[NZJake]

You need one of these babies... Tinman, you must be cutting some real hard timber? Give me a ring at the factory and we'll figure out your bounce issue. It could be that your vertical lock needs a little tweeking?

All else failing...This little device is designed for real hard timber. Gets rid of the annoying bounce should it show its face.

[TN_man]

Is there a name for this little device?
I am trying to tell from the picture, but it looks like some kind of a clamping device that runs from one side of the carrage head to the other. I s that right?

[NZJake]

Look at the device just under the sawdust shoot, It's just a bolt on idler wheel that adjusts up and down to run on your log (attaches to the corner bolt). Stops the centre unit from being pulled down into the wood. "Anti-vibe device".

[TN_man]

Okay, now I know what I am looking at. :
I hope Captain will have one in stock.
Thanks!

[TinMan]

NZJake

Yes we were cutting hardwood, but nothing out of the ordinary for around here... My vertical lock seems a little less positive than my horizontal :-\ Maybe a little tightening up on the left side half moon is in order ??? If that dont work, Im gonna need one of them little devices..... ;D

Thanks

Tracy

[jpgreen]

Tracy.. It looks like you have your tailer just like Troy does ancious and waiting there in your avatar, so better get back to sawin'..  ;D

[Jeff Meyer]

TinMan, I don't think we have talked but I am the regional rep for Peterson on the west coast.   First congrats on your new mill.  I will be more than happy to help you with questions or parts.  I have a good selection of parts on hand and have been running a Peterosn mill for 6 years now.  I just finished up at the Eugene logging conference and dont remember talking to you.  So here are some ideas about your mill jumping on you.  I have experienced this many times. I would be willing to bet that this happens more at the end of the log.  As you come back does it stop bouncing as hard? I have found that if it is the butt cut of the tree it is even worse.  So this is what I do.  If I am going to make a 6" or larger vertical cut I have my partner put a wedge in the cut.  There is a lot of tension in wood and the wedge keeps the cut open.  I have started a vertical cut 6" and have had the log suck my mill in and kill the motor.  I have also had it push it out very hard and fast.  I feel the bounch is from the tension in the stick.  Every stick is different.  I have a lot more ideas so if you get a chance give me a ring and I will go over them with you.  But don't worry this does happen to other people. My number is 707-476-2522       

[Troy]

As Tracy mentioned I still have problems with blade bounce while making vertical passes.  To date I have only cut red and white oak, lots of it, but nothing of the soft wood variety to compare to.  I have to go slow and feel my way through the cuts.  When I come to knots in the log or stressed areas it becomes more prone to pulling the saw down.  I can deal with that as it just makes sense, but what I do notice that bothers me is that milling vertical passes are much slower that milling horizontally though the log.  Is this common?  Blade patterns seem to be pretty good.

[jpgreen]

How's it going Jeff?

I wondered when you were going to post over here on the FF.

Snowin' like crazy on South Fork right now.

Pat..........


-and good morning from the left coast Troy.. 

[Jeff Meyer]

I bet it is cold over there.  I have been meaning of heading up to the Lake but there is a lot of snow I am sure. I am going to have a demo up there this summer and I will let you know.   


Troy:
I have found the opposite.  I like to always cut my large dimension with my vertical cut.  Reason for that is there is less area of wood touching my balde which is less resistance. 

[jpgreen]

Well welcome to the forum Jeff..  8) 8) 8)

We've got to get together and do some fishing at Ruth lake.. 

Fella's... Jeff has 300 acres there not to far from me, and he's a recent father of triplets.. that's "THREE" (3) new additions.

His Peterson milling crew is set for the future..  :D

[Jeff Meyer]

Fishing will start to pick up soon and we will plan a day.  Hope you can hang on.  Top speed on Ruth 72mph.  Good bass fishing.  I attached a pic of the babies.  They just turned one last week.  Can't wait till there old enough to help on the ranch.  I tried to attach a photo of them but the pic is to large. 

[DanG]

Getting back to the problem at hand, blade bounce is a common problem with swingers and dimension saws, mainly due to the low number of teeth on the blade.  In a deep cut, the tooth is on the upswing when doing the major part of the cutting, and tends to pull the saw downward. When the tooth exits the wood, the track pulls the saw back up, then the next tooth pulls it down again, setting up an oscillation.  The MD manual explains this very well, and includes the plans to build a "track rider shoe" that works just like Jake's device.  It essentially supports the saw on the log to keep the saw from being pulled down.

I get track bounce on my MD when making a long, deep cut.  The D&L doesn't have this problem, to my knowledge because the saw is supported equally for the entire length of the cut.

[getoverit]

I have the bounce problem every once in a while also, and like has been mentioned before, it is usually in the last couple of feet of the cut. I have always thought that it was possibly because I wasnt sawing exactly with the grain of the wood that caused it, but maybe not.

Anyway, placing the braces towards the middle of the track has almost eliminated the problem. This is what my setup looks like right now, and I have sawed about 15 logs from the same location with it.



Notice the braces in the middle of the rails...



by the way, when I lower my rails to the next depth, I tried making heads and tails out of the guage on the head of the winches, but found this is just as quick, and a whole lot accurate:

I bought a roll of that magnetic tape like you would stick those refrigerator things on the door with, then cut off pieces about an inch long. The uprights are galvanized, so the magnets will stick to them. I stick a piece of the magnet at the top of the red slide on the rail like this:



and then I lower the rails down to where I want them, using an aluminum yard stick I picked up at the hardware store for less than $2.



This gives me a VERY accurate cut each time I lower the rails.

I have been cutting a LOT of hickory, cutting mostly 5/4 by 8 inch boards, most of them 9 ft long.



The hickory is some of the hardest american woods, and the ATS with a 13hp Honda cuts through them just fine. It does slow a little in the knotty areas, but I have no problems cutting the hickory. If I forget to tighten the locking screws when I move the rail, it starts the bouncing blade syndrome. I just lock the carrige down, go tighten the locks on the middle braces, and I'm back in business with no bounce.

I have alos been cutting up some VEARY old pine logs which are so old that they are practically dry when I cut them. I have been working on turning our old hay barn into a workshop, and decided to go ahead and use the pine 1X8 to panel the walls of the workshop. Just thought I would post a picture on my progress on this project so far>




Hope this helps !

Ken

[jpgreen]

Nice looking setup thar Ken..  8) 8) 8)

[getoverit]

Thanks  ;D

I have figured out that it is a lot easier to move the logs than move the mill, so I cut some 4X6 pine that extends out past the edge of the rails, then I just drag the logs onto the 4x6's and roll them into place for milling. It is hard to tell in the pictures, but the sawdust pile got pretty deep before I dug it out and put the sawdust in the chicken pen. I think I'm going to move the mill to a spot with more shade and better room soon, keeping in mind that I can just drag the logs over to the mill with the tractor. You have to raise the rails on the mill in order to get to the top of the next log anyway, and rolling the logs under the rails is easy enough to do with the LogRite Peavy's. Now when jpgreen's log dogs get here, I wont even have to worry about the log moving any more ;D So far, that has been my only problem.... logs moving when I get down to the last couple of inches of the log... it wont happen soon !!

While I was typing this post, I looked out the window and saw that I had some helpers out there with the sawdust... just thought you might like to see the free sawdust spreading help I got?






That is a flock of turkeys, in case you dont recognize them... the gobbler is HUGE !

[jpgreen]

I've been wanting a turkey now for a long time.  The coyotes keep beatin' me to the punch Ken.

Your new pups will be there tomorrow..  8)   8)

[TinMan]

Thanks for all the input guys ;D

Nice to meet you Jeff, thanks for the Ideas. The bounce seemed to occur anywhere in the log, and got worse as the day went on. Change speeds didnt help, it did it when I went slow or fast. In fact if I pulled into the log pretty hard and kept on it, it didnt seem as bad. After I sharpened it seemed worse. DanG, what you said about the blade pulling down in the deep cut makes the most sense to me as the problem....I think Im gonna need that little device.... ;D

Thanks for the help guys, I appreciate it

Tracy

[Jeff Meyer]

Well, sorry I couldn't be more help.  Let me know how it goes.

Thanks

Jeff