White cedar / Arborvitae

[Saki]

Hey all. This gig is a little out of my expertise, so thought I would run it past you all. Have friends who live in a small town here in Indiana wanting to plant a screen/windbreak etc between them and their next door neighbor. Their yard is reasonably small, and they don't want to lose a lot of it with an extensive planting, but they would like to have something between them and the neighbors. My thought was a hedge of white cedar/arborvitae planted on maybe 5 or 6 foot centers along the edge of the property line. I even suggested having them ask the neighbor if that is something they would like to go halves and put right on the property line. My reason for the species selection was year round screen, and I know those trees tend to stay slender and don't take as much space as a lot of others.

Anybody got any thoughts? Good choice or better choice out there?

How about spacing and location?

Anything come to mind I haven't thought of?

Any thoughts appreciated. Saki.

[Glenn]

Last summer I planted just such a hedge, 150' long. I used white cedar and went with 1 foot centers.  Even the neighbors cat won't get through that.  I used trees 1-2 ft high and didn't lose any yet.  We'll see how they do after the snow melts.

[Nova]

white cedar/arborvitae

Height: 25 to 40 feet
Spread: 10 to 12 feet
Best used as a screen or hedge planted on 8 to 10- foot-centers

How small is their yard?  Is it dry, wet, good soil, poor soil, acid, alkaline?  Can be used as a hedge and a windbreak but will turn brown in the winter and if memory serves me, again in late spring when new growth starts.  Does better in wetter areas and has a very fibrous root system but only moderate drought tolerance.  I'll have a look in my books to see if there is something else that might fit the bill but knowing what their desired end height/size is would be helpful in narrowing down the choices.

Nova

[Jeff]

It doesn't turn brown. The many little "cones" will turn brown. Long as the species is compatible for your growing area its an excellent choice for the project you have in mind. I can take some photos tomorrow of just such a hedge/fence I helped plant 12 years ago kitty korner from my home.  1 foot centers is horribly close. We planted these on 6 foot centers as I remember and that was just right by the appearance of today.  The trees were purchased in 2 gallon sized containers and I reckon they were probably about 18 inches high. Today they are pushing 16 to 20 feet tall in places. They have yet to be topped to form a hedge but are a great wall of trees. Our ground is sand and gravel with very little top soil. These trees were taken care of their first two years with waterings during summer dry periods but after that, no maintenance.   

[Roxie]

They are considered wind tolerant  and make excellent screening plantings.  If you'd like a more natural look than a straight line, plant them 12' apart in a triangle pattern and use an odd number of plants.  For example: 

          X       X       X
               X       X

When the Arborvitae are established, other bushes can be planted in the shade and protection area (like rhododendrum and azalea) and it is very attractive and natural looking.

[mike_van]

I planted 150' of them 20+ years ago, what a waste of money- The deer used them all winter like a Macdonalds drive-up, so 5' up they were bare, many of the taller 15 - 20' ones got bent over by the wet stickey snow.  Every year I rip a few out & plant Spruce now. 

[Jeff]

Yep, if you have a deer population to fend off in the winter months, you can have probelms. Michigan Cedar prices are going up up up and regeneration is going down down down and our histroically high populations of white tailed deer are the reason. I better go get those photos. I think I can take one from my yward, but you only see the trees above the fence they are hiding from the other side. I'll try that first.

[Jeff]

I used the zoom on my camera to get this from the corner of my property.  The neighbor Tom, who lived beyond the fence (moved now) and I planted the row of cedar because he wanted to hide the view of the fence you see that belongs to Shannon. Shannon did not build the fence but is stuck with maintaining it since he bought the place (something he has not done as of yet). So, the fence is a whole lot uglier today and gets uglier with every advancing year and eventually will have to be replaced or just taken down while the trees that Tom and I planted, that the new owner is enjoying, get better looking every year and are increasing the value of that home and the neighborhood.  I'll take a picture from the other side when we go out today.

The fence is 8 foot to give you scale.

[shopteacher]

Check into a tree called Thula Green Giant. They are suppose to be very hardy and diesease resistant.

http://www.parkfastgrowingtrees.com/store/nfoscomm/catalog/index.php
"Thuja Green Giant is a horticultural marvel. Once established in your garden, this Western Red Cedar grows an amazing 3 feet or more each year, topping out at 30 to 50 feet high and just 10 to 12 feet wide. Resistant to pests, including deer and bagworms, it sports lush, dense evergreen foliage right down to the soil line. It's happy in any well-drained soil from sand to heavy clay, needs no pruning (but can be sheared to any desired size and shape), and tolerates heat and drought magnificently"

[Jeff]

Here is a photo from the front side as we drove by. We just had the biggest single snow even in the last 20 years here, 19½ inches in a little over 8 hours. Wet heavy nasty stuff. As you can see the cedars look pretty good.

[Nova]

Jeff - mea culpa.  I was not specific enough.  I think all cultivars have the potential to turn brown but some are more prone than others.  Also requires specific conditions that lead to drying out of the foliage i.e. low temps, low humidity, high wind, especially wind as those that are more exposed appear to be more affected by this.  Even then the brown usually only occurs along the edge of the foliage.  As for turning brown in the spring, I can't find my reference about this so it is possible that this also may be a cultivar specific (vice a species wide) trait or I am mixing it up with another evergreen . Your hedge looks great Jeff.  Do I detect a 'green thumb'?

Saki - there are other cultivars that actually range from 3 - 10 feet if the larger versions are a bit too big for your friend's yard.

Nova

[Saki]

Hey I just got back in from annual job training last week and had a chance to check the forum. Thanks to all for the input. I told my friends to check this site and search for arborvitae and they were amazed how many folks responded and that people were nice enough to take and post pictures ( thanks Jeff ), and share their knowledge. I am guessing they will use the info well.  Thanks All!!