iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

complete rookie with a dream

Started by fsbigcountry, February 06, 2006, 01:00:46 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

fsbigcountry

HI eveyone, I hope yall can help me. I live in east Texas and have inherited 100 acres thats pretty wooded. The big pines were cut about 5 years ago, but no pines smaller than 10 inches were cut and no hard wood was cut. So I have lots of pine in the 8 to 12 inch size, lots of oak all sizes ( I don't know what kind of oak but oak never the less) and some cedar. My wife and I want to build a house but she can't work, we are a one income family. We have always dreamed of a log home but never thought we could afford it. I work in maint. at a hospital, am a lic. electrician by trade and haved learned plumbing & hvac pretty good. I  can do most of the work myself ( if my back holds up) I'm 43.  My idea is to buy a portable mill and try to cut my own logs and lumber, thats where I need all the help I can get. Time is not that big a factor. I know nothing about logging, milling, or curing. I have a 35hp kubota to help out but no other tools have been purchased towards the house project. Any and all advice and information will be appreciated. I will be reading and posting on a regular basis. Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge with me.  Frank Sides 

Ianab

Hi Frank and welcome to the forum  :)

Sounds like you have a good start - you have some trees  ;) :D

Small tractor will be OK if you have reasonably flat ground and smaller trees, a logging arch may come in handy too.

There will be lots of opinions as to what mill you should get too  :D

Your back should be OK if you work smart and use cant hooks, winches and your tractor for the heavy stuff.

Cheers

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

TexasTimbers

Welcome Frank.

Quote from: Ianab on February 06, 2006, 01:30:22 AMThere will be lots of opinions as to what mill you should get too :D

Ianab nailed that one on the head, for example, my opinion is do not get a manual mill if you can afford a hydraulic one even if you don't plan to use it for any other reason other than building your house. That's my 2 bits.

Where in east Texas are you? I'm over here to the left of ya in Fannin County near Bonham, which is halfway between Paris and Sherman. I come out to the Lake Winnsboro area and log pine on occassion, and will also be coming to the Tyler area sometime in the near future to log some big pine like you referred to.
It's a long way to haul pine but it's free so it's hard to resist. :)

My wife and I started out wanting a log home, took a course in Washington State, bexame "Certified Log Home Builders" and halfway through the course decided it wasn't right for us, in this locale, and after further searching we became enamored with timber framing. I even bought a new Polyurethane reactor/proportioner to make our own SIPs and stress skin panels (and to sell a few here and there), so if you need some at some point .... ::)
Lotsa good info and resources on this forum. Good luck.
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

isassi

Welcome the the forum Frank, you will catch a lot of good advice here.

Cedarman

Welcome to the forum.

If you have enough cedar, you can make a bunch of 6x6 or 6x8 or 7x7 or 8x8 or whatever size would work.  Dry it in the shade.  I live in a cedar house so I know it can be done. 

You might build a shed first to store all the lumber as you mill it.  Watch for insects.
I'll add another penny for going hydraulic.


I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

snowman

 Hey frank, i'm basically doing same thing you are. My 1st instinct was the Lucas mill because ive recieved Baileys catalog for many years and was familiar with it. I talked to one of the Baileys and he was very honest with me, said it sucks on small logs. He suggested a band saw which im still investigating but if all you want is to build stuff for yourself look into logosol and wood bug chainsaw mills. You said you have lots of time ;D. They look kinda slow but order their videos , watch them work and see what people have built, it's really kind of impressive for the cost.

Mr Mom

     We all have dreams. Mine is to get a bandmill and saw wood for a barn and some other sheds.





     Thanks alot Mr Mom

solodan

I sorta agree with snowman.
I wouldn't say  that a swing mill sucks on small logs, I would just say that they really shine on the really big logs. I have a lucas 827 and cut alot of small logs, but 40" + are plentiful enough out here, and logs between 24" to 36" are most common. the ground is also steep. A swing mill was what fit my needs. If I only had those little skinny trees, I would probably buy a small band mill. I will probably  build one one day for the really small stuff. I agree with those who say get the hydraulics, but in you're case I don't know if the extra money spent makes sense. an 8" pine log is pretty easy to load and turn by hand. But you will get addicted like the rest of us, and then want the hydraulics later anyways. what kind of log home do you want? square logs? D-logs?  I think small logs work great for small  3 or4 sided cants, but If you are going to be cutting lots of your trim and finish 1x material then find a couple of big logs. I agree with Ian, that tractor will have no problem with those small logs. with small logs a hand log arch would useful too.

Lot's of info here.

Welcome.

Check out the FF toolbox in the lower left. lots of useful calculators in there.
These can save you alot of time.


Radar67

Welcome to the forum Frank.

I would get a mill before I started cutting trees. As long as the trees are growing, you will have less trouble with bugs, decay, and many other problems to worry about. Check out the sponsors on the left side of the page and decide what you need in a mill first. For your mill, you need to consider how much you want to spend and get the biggest one you can afford. Hydralics is always a plus, it will save you a lot of time and your back  :D. All of the sponsor mills are good. Do some searching in the archives, there is a lot of information on the site. Use the search button at the top of the page. Hope this helps.

Stew
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

ely

no do not get a saw and start lopping trees down. something will happen and delay you in getting a mill and the trees could rot. you have a good plan to start with. maybe start by picking out the house site and removing the trees from it. have them milled by another person to build you a saw shed and a drying shed that waty you don't lose any wood to the elements.

DanG

Welcome Frank!  Boy, have you ever come to the right place! 8)  No need to repost your intro on each board, 'cause most of us read and post on all of'em. ;)
By all means buy a chainsaw, but don't start cutting trees down yet.  You will find plenty of info about that purchase on the Chainsaw Board.  If you start cutting pines now, you will just be giving the bark beetles a better place to breed.  Wait until you have your sawmill.  Ely has a good idea about hiring someone at first.  That'll give you a good chance to be around a mill for a little bit, and you'll learn a lot if you hire a good sawyer.

Do your homework!  Read as much of this forum as you can, and watch as many saws and sawyers as you can find.  Don't jump on the first mill you see.  They will all look fantastic to the uninitiated, but there are lots of differences that would make one a better choice for you than another one.

If you have 100 acres, you're gonna need a tractor anyway.  Go ahead and study up on them, too.  With that much land, I'd be looking for at least a 60hp tractor, and bigger wouldn't be a bad thing.  Try to find one with 4wd and a loader if you can afford it.  That being said, I've skidded bunches of logs bigger than yours with a 2wd pickup.  They do get awfully dirty that way, though ;)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

fsbigcountry

Thanks for the quick responses guys, I'll keep studying and asking questions.

ely

also i live about straight north of kev-jay in oklahoma, if you ever decide on a field trip you are more than welcome at my place, bear in mind i am no professional but between me and my dad we can show you exactly what not to do. :D

SwampDonkey

Quote from: Cedarman on February 06, 2006, 07:55:40 AM
Welcome to the forum.

If you have enough cedar, you can make a bunch of 6x6 or 6x8 or 7x7 or 8x8 or whatever size would work.  Dry it in the shade.  I live in a cedar house so I know it can be done. 

You might build a shed first to store all the lumber as you mill it.  Watch for insects.
I'll add another penny for going hydraulic.


I know where there is a cabin on the Renous River (the river is incidental) and they used totally northern white cedar. An old friend of mine took me there to show it to me after it was built. Then he takes me out in the yard where there where sugar maple and started pointing out all the birdseye in the tree bark.  :o  8) At his other camp on Robinson Ridge was another grove of birdseye maples. But, that's getting away from the thread.

If all I was going to do was build a camp and maybe some out buildings I would go manual and least expensive. Otherwise, you'll beat the purpose of cost savings and you might as well hire the wood logged and milled. Now if you figure on making a part time venture from milling your own lumber after the camp is built, by all means go hydrolic. Just my common scense kicking in. ;) Without favoring any brand or mentioning names, I know a good manual can be had for less then $4000 CDN.
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

SwampDonkey

Quote from: DanG on February 06, 2006, 01:45:08 PM
've skidded bunches of logs bigger than yours with a 2wd pickup.  They do get awfully dirty that way, though ;)

DanG, that reminds me of an elderly feller here in his 70's that goes to the woodlot every day with his old beat-up ford (his skidder ;D ) and a set of block and tackle. He parbuckles his logs up onto the bed rails of pickup. And uses a pulp hook for his 4 foot pulpwood. His yard is full of firewood of all sizes, down to 2 inches. Across the road from his house he has a 'working load' of 4 foot softwood pulp. Over the years if he hired anyone to log his ground he went behind them and picked up everything he can market. He can afford all the puttering around because he has a guaranteed income: Old Age, Supplement and Canada Pension. :D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Qweaver

Hi frank,
I'm currently sawing to build a timber frame home in WV and had the same questions as you when I decided to do this last winter.  I had a old 30 HP Ford TLB and bought a used WM LT15 (manual) and started felling trees and sawing last spring. 
I'm sawing mainly 16" to 22" poplar logs but I've also sawn several trailer loads of pine of similar size.  If you lift the logs with the Loader close to the top pivot I don't believe you'll have a problem handling your logs.  I don't know what your budget is, and it would be great to have a hydraulic mill and a big tractor, but that is not what I have... or want.  I want to be able to easily trailer my tractor and a $15,000 hydraulic mill makes no sense for me either.  I'm 61 with a less than perfect back but I'm able to handle even the occasional 24" log. 
I just bought the 60" LogRite cant hook and it's a must buy!!!  So...bottom line, get the best that you are willing to spend for, but don't buy more than you need if you don't mean to make this a vocation.
BTW, We have a house on Dickinson Bayou just north of Texas City and plan to winter in Texas and summer in W.Va once the Timber Frame is done.
This is a great place to get good info and have a good laugh now and then. :D
Quinton
So Many Toys...So Little Time  WM LT28 , 15 trailers, Case 450 Dozer, John Deere 110 TLB, Peterson WPF 10",  AIM Grapple, Kubota 2501 :D

ironmule2004

How feasable is it to do this?  Will you save that much money after you buy all the equipment?  I just wouldn't think that you could come out cheaper going about building a house this way.  Of course, if this is just for your own satisfaction then I wouldn't think twice about it.  I would go for it!  It could lead to something else besides building your own house.  I am not trying to discourage you for sure.  I thought about buying a small mill to keep the "butt" cuts off of the large tree-length logs that we haul to  the mill.  I know that they are beating me out of my money on the "clear butts" (paying the same for everything) so I would like to keep the prime stuff for myself  and send them the junk!     

IronMule

DanG

I'm counting on you being wrong about that, Ironmule. ;)  I'm planning on saving megabucks on my house by doing the entire interior with my mill.  We were just talking about flooring prices on the Drying and Processing board.  Looks like unfinished flooring is going for an average of $3 sq ft.  I already have enough stock in the shed to do the floors..just gotta kiln&mill.  Wall panelling is going for about the same.  Got some of it air drying, some in the log yard and free trees lined up for the rest of it.  Oh yeah, the ceilings will be pine...got plenty of that.  Kitchen cabinets and bathroom vanities will be coming from the mill, too.  Yep, siding too.  Trot down to Lowe's and price out all that stuff, then tell me the mill won't save you money on a house.  Besides all that, he can probably sell the mill afterwards for almost what he has in it, if he's willing to part with it. :)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

ironmule2004

I was mostly asking a question since I'm really not a lumber man.  I was just looking at it from the outside.  You don't need to build a house with your own lumber to prove me wrong.  A spoken word usually does the trick!  :)

Thanks,
IronMule   

DanG

Well, I do need to build a house, but to get out of this crappy trailer rather than to prove anybody wrong.  I'm just sayin' that I hope your suggestion was wrong, or I'm in big trouble. :o   ;)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

solodan

Quote from: DanG on February 06, 2006, 11:01:29 PM
Trot down to Lowe's and price out all that stuff, then tell me the mill won't save you money on a house.

Yeah,
I made the two hour trip down to the Blue store and the Orange store, a couple of weeks ago. The prices are cheaper there than some of my local lumber yards for some lumber, but the clear 1/4 sawn Doug Fir is still $5bf.
JP green posted a few days back that he may be getting into some 60" DF
Well, one log from the butt of one of these trees would pay for his mill.

Ianab

If you just look at the 4x2s that go into a normal new house, then chances are you aren't going to save much.

But if you have a sawmill you find you will use a lot more timber in your house instead of manufactured materials. Dang's hardwood floors, Unclebucks solid wood doors, JeffB's pine outbuilding, my solid kitchen doors and breakfast bar. "Normal" people would have to shell out $$ for MDF, plywood or tin for these things, and they probably wouldn't consider using a 6ft long 20x2 board for a bar top, even if they could buy one.

Cheers

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

SwampDonkey

Quote from: ironmule2004 on February 06, 2006, 09:53:09 PM
I thought about buying a small mill to keep the "butt" cuts off of the large tree-length logs that we haul to  the mill.  I know that they are beating me out of my money on the "clear butts" (paying the same for everything) so I would like to keep the prime stuff for myself  and send them the junk!     

There is a mill here that would refuse the treelength if they saw that you bucked off the but logs. I never thought it was any of their business if I wanted to increase the value of my wood I sell.  ::)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

SwampDonkey

Quote from: DanG on February 07, 2006, 02:56:21 AM
Well, I do need to build a house, but to get out of this crappy trailer rather than to prove anybody wrong.  I'm just sayin' that I hope your suggestion was wrong, or I'm in big trouble. :o   ;)

I've seen people here purchase a farm with woodlots, sell stumpage and clear their land all off. Then, buy a mill and have to buy all their wood to saw.  ::)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

ironmule2004

I have been around conventional residential construction most of my life, and you are exactly right!  A lot of other materials besides lumber make up the cost of a house.  True if the lumber was a available then you wouldn't use the sheetrock etc.  No doubt, building these "all lumber" houses as you guys are talking about would be very expensive if all the lumber was bought.  I was looking at it from the way that I have always seen houses being built around here.  I really doesn't matter if you are right or wrong.  If you are hard headed like me, you will make it work with hard work.  I wish the best for anyone willing to work for something they want in life.   
   As far as the "butt" cuts, the mill I haul to has a 12" min and 36" max on the "butt",  a 7" min on the top, and a random length with the minimum length being 25'.     

IronMule   

Thank You Sponsors!