Baseball bat billets ?

[Daren]

This may belong somewhere else, but it will only take one right answer. The high school shop teacher dropped off a few nice white ash logs for me to use however I wanted, he wanted to get rid of them. Only request, saw and dry one into baseball bat billets. Our schools are hurtin' and he was going to turn some bats in shop class for demo and turn more and hopefully sell some to raise funds for our ball team (which needs stuff bad). I am glad to help out and said "No problem".
One problem, how big is a billet? 9/4 square x 40" ? Heck I don't know, and sure wasn't going to act like I didn't.

[Tom]

we had a member "Masher" who didn't stay around very long.  It's a shame because he was into making baseball bats and would have made an interesting long-term member.   He has a web-site that describes the making of bats and the sizes of the billets.

www.mashbats.com

It looks like some Interior designer got hold of his web-site.  What a pain in the neck it is.   There still might be some decent info there if you can fine it.   He used to tell you the whole story. 

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=10944.msg150054#msg150054

[populus]

You might want to consider your potential liablitly if you make bats that the kids use. Hillerich and Bradsby, the makers of Louisville Slugger, do extensive quality control on their billets and bats and have deeply experienced bat makers. They also carry heavy liability insurance.

For your own financial well-being, you may want to turn those logs into furniture.

[Daren]

Thanks Tom, I will check it out.
populus, I guess I should have mentioned the team is not going to use the bats. The boosters are going to personalize them and just sell them as a decorator thing for fundraiser. I imagine some will get taken out and played with. But if I worried about everything I sold as a liability, I couldn't sell anything (and that is why I carry a million dollars liability insurance and am Nelson Company L.L.C., a limited liablity corporation. Once they get my insurance, they can't touch me). How much damage could a 2"x4" do in the wrong hands, what if someone fell off a table I sold, or some kid choked on a chess piece I made...

[isawlogs]

   What ever hapened to the times when one could give things to a kid ... wether this kid was yours or not .. or to a school or organisation , and not have to lose sleep over what would happen if .... if for some unforseen reason they would get hurt with it ... gees all of us  here have been hurt at least once when we where kids ... and I doubt that our parents ever thought of  looking into liability , If you do get hurt .. chalk it up as a learning curve ... some are steeper then others .. Mine was very steep , but I made it this far without having to sue anybody . I have broken fingers with a hammer .. sure aint the fabricaters fault .. my other hand had the hammer ... I have broken bats and had them flying at first base ,  it happens its wood ...  

  I get a little peeved when this comes up ... I know its part of our lives now ... but it still gets me going .
     I'll stop herre my rannting is over .... but I could go on and on ....

[Engineer]

3" square, 40" long will be fine.  Bats need to have extremely straight grain.

[beenthere]

Some people love to have that fear of "liability" and avoid anything and everything. Must lead to a pretty dull existence, IMO.  ;) :
Not sure what could go wrong with a bat.
Daren, I don't think you should be worried about asking, because bats can be made in all sizes from little kids to big kids, and because these are being made as 'promotional' items, I think you would be wise to just ask what size billets the teacher wants. After all, if you make them for an adult bat and he is turning out the little ones that Hillerich and Bradsby hand out for 'favors', then this teacher may wonder what you were thinking of. Billets come in all imaginable sizes.
Wish you luck on your new endeavor. Should be fun. 

[Skytramp]

  I have made several ball bats, had one old lathe that we added six inches to the bed, just  for that purpose.  If possable they need to be quarter sawn.  Don't remember the exact dimintions, but just go to the store and measure one and make accordingly.  We left the chuck marks in the bat, so they don't need to be longer.  We made one out of willow once and you could really put a ball out there with it.  Don't remember ever using it in a game, but ---
SkyTramp;

[Daren]

He came by again tonight, he wants me to put together a little video tape of how logs get turned into lumber. The guy is new and is trying to ad some class hours. I think that is a great idea. I have a video camera and tripod. Sure taping it I will only saw 200bft in a day, but I took shop and it was boring. Who knows maybe one of those little monsters may get the saw bug. They buy the lumber someplace (not from me, but may start), maybe I will send a copy to all the local schools. I would have enjoyed that in class instead of the usual textbook stuff.
Engineer, I know about that part. I custom make ash and osage long bows. A ball bat is nothing compared to sawing (most split staves, but I saw enough I know good stock) for a 60# bow that I stand behind.
Sky, I turned a softball bat from sweetgum for a buddy 2 years ago. He is still using it. He is a really big guy and wanted a heavy ended bat and big grip. He has smashed the ball almost flat several times. I have no experience with bats, that is why I posted, he told me want he wanted and I made it. I couldn't get the one I made for him turned on a pitch without hurting myself.

[just_sawing]

Number one sawyers don't make base ball billets just as they don't make hammer handles. My family (before me) use to sell to the handle mill (Same as a base ball mill) and all billets had to be rivied not sawn. If you had a saw mark they threw it in the burn pile. My cant hook handles I still cut to lenght and then split out the squares to turn. It is the only way to get the strenght.
Fun project if aproched with a good froe and beatle.

[Engineer]

Well, I was going to add that the BEST baseball bat blank should be riven and not sawn, but there's two reasons why I didn't:

First, the claim is that the bats won't actually be USED ( :D) just decoration.

Second, I seriously doubt that the major manufacturers use riven billets - they probably have very precise sawing standards and have a lot of rejects.  Taking care in the sawing process, or even sawing oversze and then resawing to perfect the grain pattern, should work just fine.  The lathe operator has the final control over the grain of the bat as well - you can trace grain from one end of the billet to the other, mark it and center it. 

I don't see any problems with a properly sawn billet.

[pigman]

I seem to remember a show on tv about the Louisville Slugger bats and they were using riven billets. Of course it could have been a dream since I once dreamed  that I  was good looking. :

[old3dogg]

Hey Daren.
Cut the green square to 3 3/4 x 3 3/4 x 37. This will give you enough wood to work with after its dry. Keep in mind that Ash needs to be around 12% MC to make a strong bat. Hard Maple needs to be around 7 or 8% MC. Red Oak makes a good bat but can be very brittle. If not for MLB play you can soak the handle in some kind of oil to give it more bend. RO can really "slam" a ball.
Soft Maple has been used in soft ball bats.
Straight grain, no heart wood and no knots if you want to use them as play. Most any type of wood will work if you just want to hang them on the wall for show.

[dail_h]

   I agree with just_sawin,rived is better. I'd probably buy a ticket to watch sombody rive a bat billet outta sweetgm.

[Daren]

I wasn't going to post anymore, cause I didn't want to stir it, I asked for opinions and got them, but... I am sure rived is better, but I ain't rivin' nuthin'. If you have a straight grain sawn billet and the grain goes from center line of one end to center of the other, there is no difference IMO. It is going to be turned down to 1" at the handle and 2 5/8" or 2 3/4" on the other end, there is alot of open grain in the taper. As long as the grain from the handle goes all the way to other end, and is centered, it will be sound. Like I said, these are DISPLAY bats, that I am sawing for free. I did check out the link Tom posted "Masher" used sawn billets from what I could tell, and his bats are used by the pros. These I have been aproached about are not going to be in the hands of a 240 lb steriod user, if they get used at all it will be some brat smacking rocks or walnuts at the neighbors house.
I think I saw a show about Babe Ruth that said he used Oak, if it didn't break it was a homer.

I'd probably buy a ticket to watch sombody rive a bat billet outta sweetgm.

Me too.  ;)

[UNCLEBUCK]

I wonder if Lud ever got around to making his "Ludville Slugger" yet ?

[HORSELOGGER]

Daren, I hear that the best pot stirrin sticks are made from rived billets smiley_nananana smiley_nananana

[Daren]

HORSELOGGER you are full of it.  :D Thanks alot for your help with that.

[Sawyerfortyish]

Daren I used to saw ash for a small bat maker. The size I sawed were 31/4x 31/4 They also had to have at least 7 growth rings per inch in the end grain to be strong enough for a bat as well as being clear with no knots . I dont remember how long but I think around 42" sounds about right . I didn't saw anything to length the bat company did that as well as rip the slabs. Most of the ash I slabbed at 3 1/4 and tryed to saw the heart out and throw that away. As for being sued because of anything some cockroach of of lawyer can dream up. You can't live in fear about everything. I sell thousands of board feet to several local schools for woodshop use I've been doing it for years and never had a problem.

[glaze]

I wasn't going to post anymore, cause I didn't want to stir it, I asked for opinions and got them, but... I am sure rived is better, but I ain't rivin' nuthin'. If you have a straight grain sawn billet and the grain goes from center line of one end to center of the other, there is no difference IMO. It is going to be turned down to 1" at the handle and 2 5/8" or 2 3/4" on the other end, there is alot of open grain in the taper. As long as the grain from the handle goes all the way to other end, and is centered, it will be sound. Like I said, these are DISPLAY bats, that I am sawing for free. I did check out the link Tom posted "Masher" used sawn billets from what I could tell, and his bats are used by the pros. These I have been aproached about are not going to be in the hands of a 240 lb steriod user, if they get used at all it will be some brat smacking rocks or walnuts at the neighbors house.
I think I saw a show about Babe Ruth that said he used Oak, if it didn't break it was a homer.Me too.  ;)

Daren

I see zero problems with using a straight grain sawn billet with the grain going from center line of one end to center of the other(no voids in the wood). 

However I have zero experience with riven wood, so I'm going to ask a few questions.  Are the guy's who use riven wood billets for baseball bats(and other items) splitting the wood green?  If the wood is green then after you riven the wood into blanks then how do you stack it up and dry it since the pieces would not be all the same size.  Just wondering how you guy's keep green riven wood from warping?  I actually would specifically want to know this for hard maple/sugar maple.

Thanks

Mike

[wle]

does anyone no what type of tool it would take to make the CUP in the end of the bat?

[thedeeredude]

The one bat factory I know of uses a saw and from what I gather it is like a long piece of pipe with teeth cut in the end so it pops out round bat blanks. 

[Dodgy Loner]

Just a few observations:

-I've been to the Louisville slugger factory, and they do, in fact, use riven billets to make baseball bats. 
-Skytramp mentioned earlier in the thread that the blanks should be quartersawn.  This defies logic, because once turned round, it doesn't make a bit of difference where the flat edges used to be.
-Sawyerfortyish, with ring-porous hardwoods, including ash, trees that have fewer rings per inch are stronger.  This is because the earlywood rings are voids which weaken the wood.  This is in contrast to softwoods, which are stronger when there are more rings per inch.  If the bat manufacturer required at least seven rings per inch for ash bat blanks, they were either misinformed or they were more concerned about weight and flexibility than strength.

There is no way to ensure that a sawn bat blank will be as strong as a riven one, but for the purpose you describe, I don't think it would hurt to saw the blanks as long as you ensure that the grain is as straight as possible.  I'm sure the manufacturer(s) won't be offering a warranty that must be honored in case of product failure, and besides, it's for a good cause ;).

[metalspinner]

It seems to me, as it would to anyone watching a baseball game, that wooden bat design today garauntee's it's failure in a short time.  Have you noticed the new rule in MLB that the batter must have a second bat ready to go in the ondeck circle for when his first one breaks?  Many of the bat failures I have noticed while watching the Braves play ( ;))on TV shows the split running out of the side of the bat.  A few do split along the length of the bat.  Some just break off right at the handle.  Manny Ramirez of the Boston Red Sox recently used a bat that he new was broken because he, "liked that bat."  : >:(  I cannot believe MLB has allowed bat manufacturers to thin down the handles of their bats the way they do.  Perhaps this is just another blind eye they have turned in hopes that nobody will take notice.  One day that flying spear that used to be a baseball bat will enter the stands and kill someone.  Talk about a liability waiting to happen. :  I'm glad I cannot afford to sit in the close seats.

I remember hearing that Pete Rose could go an entire season without breaking a bat.  Is this an urban legend? :P

[pigman]

.

I remember hearing that Pete Rose could go an entire season without breaking a bat.  Is this an urban legend? :P

I am not sure if it is true, but is possible since he choked half way up on the bat handle and was a not a power hitter.