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Sumtin's brewing in the basement...

Started by Paschale, October 28, 2005, 01:41:25 AM

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Paschale

Got myself a batch of hard cider in the carboy!  Giddy up!

I found a cider mill that still doesn't pasteurize their cider, so I'm hoping it will just ferment the old fashioned way, without any added commercial yeast.  And the cool thing about this place is that they do some batches of cider with some cherries in the mix--so I bought two gallons of that.  Man...the mix is TASTY!  I added just a bit of malic acid to give it a little more zing, which the books I read recommended. 

We'll see how she does...I hope to have some in the bottles by Christmas!

BTW...I found a couple of books that were really informative.



Cider Book One




Cider Book Two

Neither of them has a huge variety of different recipes, but they both give in depth information about what you need to know to come up with hard cider, and gives you enough information to run and try different variation.  The second book has a lot of interesting historical information, whereas the first book is much more practical.  That one even includes information on making a still to make your own Apple Brandy!   smiley_hillbilly_tub_base

They also tell you how to make Apple Jack, which is done in the deepest part of winter.  You take hard cider, already fermented, then place it in a barrel.  In the morning, you crack through the ice to the "heart" of the cider, siphon off the liquid part into another barrel.  The next morning, you do the same thing...then the same thing, day after day, until there's nothing but liquid left over.  And apparently it packed a whollop in its day! 
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

bitternut

Boy, you bring back memories of my younger dumber days. Since I live in apple country there are quite a few people around who make hard cider. I remember my first experience with some of that apple jack. Stopped at a friends house early one Sunday morning before deer season to sight in our guns and afterwards his wife made breakfast for us all. We were sitting at the kitchen table and our host brought up a jug of some apple jack from the previous year. It tasted great and of course I drank a whole water glass full of the stuff. I remember feeling fine while sitting but when I got up from the table I fell right on the floor. Since I only lived a mile down the road they drove me home so they said. I don't remember much after hitting the floor. That stuff can sneak up on you real quick. I now know that apple jack is for sipping only. I am much older and wiser now.

johncinquo

My cider from last year is over 11% alcohol!  I laugh when the fellas who drink Miller lite all the time have one.  Ya tends to get a lil slap happy. 

Hey Pasc,  Did you try the mill on Lamoreaux, just East of M37.  Aseltines I think. 

I have the Berry wine in bottles now.  Strawberry, rasberry, cherry, blueberry.  Tastes a little like Kool-aid, with a lil kick.  Will have to let it sit through the winter to really see how its going to turn out. 

12 gallons of Peach wine in the carboys now.  Got a little carried away with that process, but the peaches were free for the taking.  I may have to try and make some brandy or something different with that.  Thats just entirely too much to try and bottle up. 
To be one, Ask one
Masons and Shriners

Paschale

Hi John,

I've never been to Aseltine's.  I'm thinking of checking them out.  I've seen and bought their stuff at Meijer's, and I'm not a huge fan.  I wonder if it's better at the source, so I'm going to check it out.  The unpasteurized stuff I got down south of K'zoo, at a place called Tree-Mendus orchard.  That's a fun place, since they have tons of heirloom apples.  I bought a few there to try, including one that was purportedly Thomas Jefferson's favorite apple, and Esponus Spitzenburg. 

I tried Hill Bros. Orchard--that's some tasty cider.  They have quite the operation, and I think primarily do commercial stuff.  But they have a neat little store there where you can buy their cider.  They're at 8158 Peach Ridge, NW.  There's a cider mill in Caledonia I'm going to be trying this weekend, and a cider mill down in Middleville that I'll take a look at on Sunday.  Apparently, they have a water driven cider mill.  http://www.bowensmills.com/

I found some really good cider off of 196, near South Haven, at the Dutch Farm Market--they've got big signs as you drive, so you can't miss it.  It's really quite good, and I think I might go down there and buy another five gallons to brew up a batch of hard apple/blueberry cider.

The best cider I've found anywhere near Grand Rapids though is at Kingma's Market on Plainfield in GR.  I knew at one time where they get their cider, but I've forgotten.  I think I'll ask them the next time I'm down there.

Oh, and bitternut, that apple jack--the reason it packs such a whollop is apparently because it hasn't been distilled.  It has all the alcohol, plus a bunch of other stuff in their that really sets you back.  Here's what that second book has to say about apple jack:

"The main drawback to applejack has been its legendary kick, which long ago earned it the affectionate nickname "essence of lockjaw."  Overimbibing results in a hangover of epic proportions, and in serious drinkers can even cause a condition known as apple palsy.   ;D  The thing that gives applejack its bad reputation isn't so much the alcohol it contains; although it can vary greatly, it is always lower than twice-distilled liqours like Calvados, whiskey, and many other spirits.  No, the problem is the way it is made, by freezing instead of distillation by heat.  The distillation process separates out the various components of a fermented liquid such as hard cider or sour mash, and the distiller's goal is to save the pure ethyl alcohol while discarding most of the other impurities, or "fractions," that are usually present in the first or last parts of the run of liquid from the still.  But applejack is made by freezing, and there is no similar separation of these "heads" and tails."  They all end up in the liquor that is contained in the core of the barrel.  In other words, as the ice on the outside of the barrel gets purer and clearer, the applejack not only becomes stronger in proof, but also more concentrated with fusel oils and other impurities.  A very small amount of these substances is necessary in liquour to give it character and flavor.  Too much of them, though, can prove very unhealthy."

That might be why your friends had to take you home.   ;)
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

ohsoloco

Paschale, are you putting anything else in with the apple cider to make hard cider?  I tried making some a few years ago from homemade cider.  Simply put five gallons of the stuff in a carboy and threw in some wine yeast.  That stuff was terrible  :P  Absolutely no body or flavor.

beenthere

ohsoloco
Did you put the vent tube into water so no air could get back into the cider?  By 'homemade cider', I assume it was not boiled first, and was fresh cider.
My father made several attempts at making 'jack' and most were not good (too easy to get 'mother' going or that it turns to vinegar), but there were a few successful batches. And I only remember the heacaches the next day. It would drink easy, and be much like cider, but have the alcohol aroma. When it hits, look out.  ;D
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

ohsoloco

Yes, it was fresh, homemade cider (not pastureized).  I had an air lock on the top of the carboy as well.  My first attempt at making anything was just throwing a bunch of cider, grapes, and sugar in a large cut-off barrel (the one we're now making sauerkraut in) for a few days then putting it in carboys w/airlocks.  Man was that stuff sweeeeet (like kool-aid with a kick).  Cider alone just didn't turn out  :(

Paschale

Quote from: ohsoloco on October 28, 2005, 09:23:05 PM
Paschale, are you putting anything else in with the apple cider to make hard cider?  I tried making some a few years ago from homemade cider.  Simply put five gallons of the stuff in a carboy and threw in some wine yeast.  That stuff was terrible  :P  Absolutely no body or flavor.

Well, I checked the sugar content, and it looks good to go.  There's enough sugar in there for the yeast to gnaw on something.  Two of the five gallons are "cherry cider," with some cherries that went into the pressing of the cider.  I have an airlock on the thing, and I sterilized everything really well too.  Oh...and I did add some malic acid.  I'll reevaluate it when I rack the first batch into the secondary fermentation.  I might add a little more sweet cider at that time, and when I bottle it, I plan on adding some sugar to cause some natural carbonation.  I've read of adding concentrated apple juice too as a sweetener to give it more flavor and body.  I guess for my first batch, it's as much as anything an experiment.  I'm willing to gamble five gallons of cider to see what happens...and if I get some vinegar out of it, that's not such a bad thing either.
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

Paschale

I woke up this morning to a nice, steady plop-plop in the carboy.   ;D  It's cool knowing that some wild yeast from just south of Kalamazoo is making this puppy go, and not some store bought yeast.   ;D  I just hope it doesn't turn into vinegar!   ::)
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

johncinquo

If you use fresh fruit, or even some ciders that have not been pasturized or purified, then you can have it turn to vinegar or spoil easily.  Adding Cambden tablets or powder will kill off unwanted germs, crud, whatever and help to keep it from turning.  It kills off the natural yeast as well though.  I add the cambden, then let it sit several days before adding the new yeast. 

Natural yeast can be cool, but that has its drawbacks.  First, it shows that you have naturally occouring growths in there, so if natural yeast is present, then so can be natural funk.   Also, natural yeast has a very low tolerance for alcohol.  The alcohol basicly kills off your yeast, and stops further fermentation.  I prefer to use a champagne yeast for cider and some wines, as it has a higher tolerance, and can be saved out of the bottom of the fermentor and used again if you want to, for other batches or experiments. 

We should all get together for a professional sampling over the winter!
To be one, Ask one
Masons and Shriners

Paschale

Hi John,

I had read that about the natural yeasts, that they can be a little intolerant of alcohol.  I'm hoping to beat the odds, and I just gotta give it a go the old fashioned way at least once.  I just found another place down near Kalamazoo that doesn't pasteurize their cider, so I think I might try another batch, but this one just with straight cider and none of the cherry cider in their.  I'm thinking of doing a third batch, using a champagne yeast too, though I'd need to get another carboy!  But with this sort of thing, I'd hate to have to wait until next year to find out if my first two batches were failure, and have nothing to show for a fall of brewing.  Though there's always beer to be made too... ;D

I like your idea of a winter tasting!   smiley_beertoast  I'd enjoy trying those fruit wines of yours too...
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

SwampDonkey

A co-worker from a past job is big in the wine making process. He made some apple wine one time and tossed out the apples once they were done work'n. The dog got into the fermented apples and well.....you can take it from there. :D  He also tried rubarb wine with success. We found some old patch of rubarb growing up through the alders on an old homestead. He took some for wine and dug some up to transplant in his yard. They grow quite large when threatened by shade.

Wish you success with your cider Paschale. :)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Buzz-sawyer

Paschale
Last fall I used bread yeast for my apple jack......I think I gave ya the recipe?......Any way it WAS good ...but I still want to try the chapagne yeast.
    HEAR THAT BLADE SING!

Paschale

Quote from: Buzz-sawyer on October 31, 2005, 06:02:17 PM
Paschale
Last fall I used bread yeast for my apple jack......I think I gave ya the recipe?......Any way it WAS good ...but I still want to try the chapagne yeast.

You sure did give me the recipe Buzz...but I can't find the DanG thing anywhere.   ::)  I think yours had raisins in it.  I'd like to try that recipe, and do what you're thinking of doing and try some champagne yeast.  I'm planning on making up a couple more batches, actually...I want to experiment this year with different recipes/approaches and see how they turn out.  Otherwise, you're waiting from year to year to try different things.  I plan on popping a couple vanilla beans and a few cinnamon sticks in one batch too.   :)  You got anything brewing right now yourself there buzz?
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

Modat22

My grandpa (rest his soul) used to make something called apple scrumpy. He'd take cider anc freeze it on the porch and drain off what didn't freeze.

That stuff would remove paint from the walls, remove unwanted nose hair and pickle eggs.
remember man that thy are dust.

Buzz-sawyer

Pascale
I am getting ready for a big batch......Well, to me!
I aquired a 5 gallon water cooler bottle and have "Saved up" long neck bottles..so soon ............ :D
    HEAR THAT BLADE SING!

Paschale

Hey Buzz,

I'm wondering if you can post that recipe you gave me...one more time.   ::)  I've combed my emails and in my computer, and I can't find it anywhere.  Can you post that recipe here in the forum, so I won't lose it?   ::)  Sorry I lost it...  I've got two batches going right now with natural yeast, and now I want to do one with an actual recipe.  I think I'm actually going to end up doing five batches this fall.   8)  I'm going to experiment a little bit this year--my thought was if I just do one batch a year, it'd take me five years to learn what I'll learn this year.

So this is my list so far:

1. Natural yeast cider, with two gallons of "cherry" cider included.
2. Natural yeast cider, 100% apple
3. Buzz's recipe.   ;D
4. A recipe for sparkling cider I found in a book.
5. Another batch where I experiment, either with adding some cinnamon sticks, or else some other dried fruit, such as blueberries or elderberries, or possibly a vanilla bean, or perhaps a mix.

I'm gonna have more than I know what to do with...so I think I'll make some honest to goodness apple jack this winter too, freezing the stuff until it won't freeze anymore.   ;D
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

Tom

Y'all remember that there is a place in the knowledge base for Recipes. :)

sawguy21

Quote from: Modat22 on November 03, 2005, 07:58:04 AM
My grandpa (rest his soul) used to make something called apple scrumpy. He'd take cider anc freeze it on the porch and drain off what didn't freeze.

That stuff would remove paint from the walls, remove unwanted nose hair and pickle eggs.
:D :D :D :D A man I worked for would do that with homemade wine if he got a bad batch or one he didn't particularily like. He would use the stuff to fortify his good ones. He made a great pear wine but I sure could not drink much in one sitting. It had a mean kick.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Paschale

Tom, you're right!  I always forget about the Knowledge Base... ::)

If Buzz'll post his cider recipe, I'll be sure to post it on over there. 
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

UNCLEBUCK

Paschale I bet you could make a still out of one of your  old trombones that you dont use no more ?  Paschale"s got hooch ! :D
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

sawguy21

Quote from: UNCLEBUCK on November 15, 2005, 06:12:55 PM
Paschale I bet you could make a still out of one of your  old trombones that you dont use no more ?  Paschale"s got hooch ! :D
:D :D :D :D :D :D What you been quaffing to come up with that?
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Paschale

Quote from: UNCLEBUCK on November 15, 2005, 06:12:55 PM
Paschale I bet you could make a still out of one of your  old trombones that you dont use no more ?  Paschale"s got hooch ! :D

yeah, maybe...but I wouldn't wanna drink anything that came through any of MY old trombone tubing.  I'm not that adventurous!   ;D
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

SwampDonkey

Nothing to do with your trombone Paschale, but I was talking with the fuel guy this season when he delivered my oil, second trip. He had to come back a second time as when he was here the first time he could only pump 20 litres in before the whistle shut off. Anyway, he was saying he's been bitten several times this season my spiders in the pipes. When he pumps fuel into your tank the other pipe expells air and out pops the spider on his arm. Anyway, that was his excuse for not filling my tank the first time, he was suggesting there was a spider in the pipe blocking the air. Now I might not know everything in the world, no even close, but I don't know of any spider species in NB that would be 2 inches across.  :o

Don't inhale any spiders from your trombone Paschale! :D :D :D :D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Paschale

Well, tonight I sampled some of the hard cider.   8)

I have two batches sitting in the carboy, one that's part cherry and apple, the other straight up apple, both using natural yeasts.  They're both pretty tasty, especially the pure apple one.  I think I'm getting close to bottling, and I may experiment with adding a little priming sugar to see if there's still some active yeast.  I can imagine in a month or two popping open a cold bottle of home brewed hard cider--can't wait!   8)

I just mixed some for a third batch--this one mixed with a gallon of pure raspberry juice.  There's a place that's just wrapping up pressing their cider, since they keep their apples in cold storage.  When I was there, they mentioned to me that they also press raspberry juice, and that they had some in the freezer.  Well, I thought this would be the perfect thing to try!  I'm going to use a champagne yeast in this one, so hopefully I'll be guaranteed a sparkling cider. 

Anyone else tried some of their hard cider yet?  And how about tapping into some canned goods from this summer?  Any reminders of warmer and sunnier days sure is a welcome addition to these cloudy days!
Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

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