Radial Milling

[Arthur]

Have any of you tried this???

http://www.radialtimber.com/start.htm

[Tom]

That website doesn't describe the manner in which they accomplish total radial sawing.  Radial sawing is a form of quarter sawing that was accomplished by circle millers in the USA years ago.  It is labor intensive, wasteful of product, inhibits the ability to saw around defects, and finally, depends on the validation of an argument that vertical grained boards are "best".

I am always leery of arguments that pre-suppose their own premise.

Supposing that vertical grain was the only product desired, this radial sawing would probably produce the most boards of any method.  I know of no way to accomplish it, in a production atmosphere, short of end dogging and perfect logs.

The website is a sales tool for the company's lumber rather than an instructional paper on the procedure, so, it is really of no more use to the validation of the procedure than the diagrams already available describing quarter sawing by radial means.

My efforts at attempting a pattern like this have not been successful.

[Percy]

Not too often, the pith is dead center. Makes for funny lookin triangles usin their think. :D :D :D

[Arthur]

Tom

We all ready radial saw for split posts.  Traditionally the split post where just that split by hand.   They then moved to using chainsaws and wedges to split the post off the log.

We use a roller system to enable the log to turn the 6" or 8" distance for the post size and then saw in the vertical turning the log for each post.  When finished the posts are split off the log with a steel wegde.

Only seen these sort of posts here in Australia.  A few sawers use hydraulics to split the posts but I find we can produce 150 to 200 a day with ease.  Last Bloodwood we did gave 180 posts 8"x6" on the taper.  At $8 each its not a bad days living.

I havent tried the weatherboard yet but will soon.  These types of boards look good but I personally dont think much of the other boards.

arthur

[VA-Sawyer]

Arthur,
Would you happen to have any pictures of that ?
Rick

[thedeeredude]

This is how they make clapboard siding, but for normal lumber I would think its  a waste.  What can you make with a piece of wedge shaped wood?

[rebocardo]

The only thing I found really interesting:

"Copyright ã is claimed on all configurations and representations of timber sawing patterns, sections and products and the relationship between circular, triangular, rectangular, trapezoidal and other shapes that were first designed, aligned or depicted by Andrew Karl Knorr between 1987 and 2004. This copyright claim includes the image all or partly presented by the designs, alignments or depictions when converted to timber in use."

Yea, whatever. Last time I checked your country was part of the Berne convention and that is not covered under copyright.

[Arthur]

VA-Sawyer

Do you want pics of the split posts or the log roller???

rebocardo

The question is about radial milling NOT copyrights or what the man is claiming.
 
Spliting the log pre dates milling so I am interested in the overlap and any technology in the milling world which uses radial milling and those with experience with it!!!!

If you want a discussion on copyright start another post on the subject.

arthur

[Brad_S.]

Way back before I even dreamed of owning a sawmill, I saw Norm or Steve (maybe it was Bob Villa) on This Old House take a tour of a clap board mill in New England that utilized this sawing method, as thedeerdude mentioned. Since I wasn't in tune with the sawmill world at that time, my recollections of it are vague. It may have even been powered by a water wheel.

The first step involved turning the log on a lathe to true it up. The log was then indeed end dogged, and it either passed over the blade or the blade passed under it, I forget now, but the log was then indexed slightly and then the next cut was made, just as you described for making your posts. I don't remember how the clapboards were removed from the core, it may have even been something like a MD with edger blades incorporated. I do remember that with the right equipment dedicated to doing that job, it looked extremely efficient of both time and material and any other way of making clapboards would yield a lesser product and more waste. The round core was then sold as a post.

[thedeeredude]

go to www.woodsiding.com and then click on the link at the top "Why Vertical Grain", this has a good picture of the end dogging.  If you click on "Quartersawn Siding", it explains how they cut and dry the clapboard.

[Arthur]

after visiting the factory in Victoria, Australia and looking at the milled logs it appears that the boards are just split off and trimmed on a bandsaw for straight edge.

They actually ship the log complete to the customer banded so the sidings dont split off hemselves in transit and it is then down to the client to split off as they are being used.  This also has the benefit of having matching grains for those who what to do that.

The larger wedges are remilled for the flooring and can be squared for left with the 22.5degree bevel.  The bevel actually helps decking with drainage.

Can not be done with all woods.  Those which tend to split on the grain like the bloodwood  dont always stay together.  All depends on the log you get.

I like the idea from Granville Manufacturing Company of creating a perfect round first.  Would give a very uniform siding.

[Jenna]

So this is an old thread, but I thought I'd put in my two cents.

As a current employee of Radial Timber - specifically it's technology and development side Radial Corporation - I can honestly and educationally state that one of the very first forms of Radial Sawing was developed by the vikings when they were building their longships.

Andrew Knorr, the developer of this technique is of Viking ancestry, so you can see where he got it from. If you want some more info on this, go to: Landline Article

Radial sawing has proved to produce the least wastage of all methods of sawing and allows saw millers to convert young plantation trees of 5+ years of age into usable planks of wood with minimal wastage. Conventional sawing methods would produce such an amount of waste that you would get very little quality timber from plantation trees, and most of the trees would end up as woodchips due to spring and bowing in the timber. Radial sawing actually helps to prevent spring and bowing from occuring as it gows along the natural grain of the wood.
For example, when you chop firewood, it naturally splits radially down the length of the piece that you are cutting. It is a lot harder, time comsuming and wastefull to cut directly across one side of the tree just to get a decent piece of timber.
It also produces a consistent growth ring orientation and less residual stress in the timber.

Other plus's are:
- Low grade logs could be handled locally for processing instead of being sent out of the region for processing.
- Efficient use of natural resources and reduced wastage has the potential to reduce environmental impact.
- Less capital intense machinery needed for harvest.
- Produces more boards than Conventional sawing.
- Increases the amount of timber available for the furniture and craft industries.
- It is a consistent and repeatable process.

If you take the time, as I have over the past two days, to research and go through every website on the net dealing with Radial Sawing (there are about 200 websites at the most) then you will find detailed information, diagrams and statistics relating to the process, implementation and end product.

All in all, Radial Sawing is the way into the future of sustainability in the environment and in the effective use of plantation timber with minimal wastage being made in the process.

[Jenna]

Sorry, go to Landline Article for more info. I stuffed it up a bit.

[beenthere]

Welcome to the forum.
Sounds like you have some interesting knowledge of radial sawing of logs.

How about some more information about you, and your involvement in the process?  Such as "produces more boards than conventional sawing". Are the boards produced the same as the conventional boards, and if so, how? 
All sounds a bit unreal at first, but hope you can teach us more. 

Pull up a radial-sawn bolt to sit on and show us how it's done, either commercially or as a small mill. If small mill, how does it work?  We like pictures, and you can set up a gallery of your own to post some.

Thanks