Removing and reconstructing a P&B barn.

[Tremel]

Hello folks,

It's been awhile since I've been on the board.  I've been working around the farm and still clearing and cleaning.  My goal to build a new timberframe home is still around 3 ~ 4 years.

In the mean time, my neighbor has an opertunity to tear down a post and beam barn.  The beams are all oak and are in really good shape.  The entire barn appears to be in good shape and he wants to move it before the developers toss a match to it.

My neighbor knows that I've been reading and studying timberframing and has asked me for advise on moving this structure.

Since I have never done this before, I'm asking the group this very same question.  The barn is around 30' x40' x ???. 

What is the best way to go about dissasembling and rebuilding this barn.  How do you mark/lable the beams?  Should we reuse the pins, or buy new?

I will be cutting all new siding for him on my mill and new tin will be installed for the roof.  He wants to tear the building down before Winter, but we think we may be able to do it this spring.  This will buy us some planning time.

Any thoughts?

[beenthere]

Would be great to have pictures.
Last night I looked at new pics in the gallery, and there were some some of raising trusses with a 'clever' wood outfit that reminded me of a catapault to raise the trusses. Hope the member gets a chance to post a story to go with those pics. But thinking some rig in reverse to take apart the barn might be in order.
Do you have access to some scaffolding to get up to the 'top' ?

[Jim_Rogers]

In order to accurately label a frame for dis-assembly you need to create an accurate drawing of the frame. This drawing will contain all the labels for each piece. To create a drawing you'll need to accurately measure the frame.
Most of the time the frame has shifted some due to rot and other circumstances so you may have to measure the frame at the tie beam level for the width and at the plate level for the length.
This will give you the most accurate measurement for your reconstruction of the foundation for supporting the barn/structure in it's new location.
Each bent should be drawn and labeled. Each broad wall should be drawn and labeled. Each floor level should be drawn in plan view and labeled. And each roof plane should be drawn and labeled.
When you label a timber in the drawing the label should go on the same timber in the structure in the same spot. That is if you label each post on the layout face at the top, on the drawing, then the label on the post should go in the same spot on the actual post in the frame.
I've taken a course taught by the guild on labeling and taking apart a barn for reconstruction. It was a great experience.
Then to help even more, each wall, bent, floor, roof plane, should be photographed. These will show all the labels in place and where everything was while it was standing.
After you have stripped off all the siding and roofing and have exposed the frame then you can start your drawing and labeling.
Removing the siding shouldn't be that hard, I would remove the roofing and then the roof boards first so that the wall boards will hold the structure together, and firm while you work on the roof.
Renting a "man lift" may help you to remove the roof boards from the inside if you can get up to the roof (that is if there isn't a lot of second floor boards and joists in the way).
Once you have all the frame stripped and labeled you then have to find the last piece and remove that first. You'll have to study the frame and see what was the order in which it was erected and establish the reverse order to dis-assemble it.
You may have to rent a crane to lift off rafters and to lower bents.
There are methods to do this, while other timbers are supported with temporary bracing.
It could take you guys some time to understand this process and do it safely.
I have a friend who does this for a living and it could/would cost between 10 and 12 thousand dollars to take down a barn correctly and safely, depending on all the site variables.
Are you going to have to dispose of all the debris or will the owner do that?
This can be a big expense if there is a lot of junk in the barn/structure.
Are you aware or not of any of the trim boards are painted with lead paint?
This can be a problem if you need to get a permit from the town/city/county to remove the barn. They may require a plan that shows how you're going to deal with lead painted wood. They may not.
Nothing is free........
I'll help you all I can, with answering questions.
I would plan on using new pegs when you're ready to reconstruct the building.
Where is this building? state? town?
If it's near me/us maybe we can help with some more detailed advice.......
Jim Rogers
Jim Rogers Timber Designs
Jim Rogers Sawmill
117-R Jewett Street
Georgetown, MA 01833-1833
800-422-6250
www.jrsawmill.com

[Jim_Rogers]

I have some photographs I took during that course, but I don't have them in this computer at this time.
I'll have to transfer them and reduce them for posting in a gallery, unless you just want me to send them to you via regular email.
I won't be able to post them in a gallery until some rainy day, maybe Friday, this week.
Jim Rogers
Jim Rogers Timber Designs
Jim Rogers Sawmill
117-R Jewett Street
Georgetown, MA 01833-1833
800-422-6250
www.jrsawmill.com

[mark davidson]

a common system for identifying timbers in our area is to go to the local farm store and buy a package of animal ear tags.... lots of colours, shapes and sizes(watch out, some of them will have pesticide impregnated into the plastic). nailing these plastic or metal tags into a pocket or mortice will help them stay on through the handling process.

another good method is to use a scratch awl and go for roman numerals on the unseen sides of the timbers...

I just finished taking down and storing a 22x36 shed(frame only, no rafters) in two days, I made 500 bucks for me and my tractor....a barn is definitely another story....

[Tremel]

Thanks for all the input, everyone.  Both online and email.  I haven't seen the barn yet.  It belongs to my neighbor's mother.  Her property is being sub-divided and sold.  The barn is in the way of development and the original plans are to burn it. 

Like I said, I haven't seen the barn, but my neighbor said that it was about 30 x 40 in size.  All oak frame with pine floors.  I have a sawmill, so the goal is to reuse the frame and possibly the flooring.  We will cut all new siding and install new tin for the roof.  I'll post pictures once I get a chance to go out and look at it.

The good news is that we have access (For free) to various types of equipment.  Including a cherry picker, dozers, tractors, etc...

We'll be taking tons of photos and I'll be drafting everything up on the computer.  We'll also be tagging everything, as everyone mentioned.

Thanks again for all the help and I'll be sure to post any updates.

[beenthere]

This should make for a very interesting project. When will you get started, and is there a deadline to finish 'removing' the barn?
Sure would like some pics of what you will be faced with. Not having seen it yet, I hope you have no surprises.

[ARKANSAWYER]

  Hard hat and tentus shot (SP?) are in order.

  One trick I use when taking down frames is I put 2x6's  down the sides after the siding is removed and put them in a "X" pattern on the last bay to be removed.  They are lag bolted on with washers under the heads.   Then I take off the roof and perlins/rafters and every thing but the frame and braces.  When we are ready to take down we just unbolt the 2x6's and take each bent down in order.  When we get to the last two we put some braces back down to the ground behind the last bent and stake well then remove the last two set of braces and bents.  I know what it will take to remove the 2x6s' but sometimes when you remove old members it takes alot of force and you can knock down the bent in the process.

[Jim Haslip]

A telescoping boom Forklift would come in pretty handy, too. Preferably an all wheel drive unit.