NO is still taking on water

DonE911 · August 31, 2005, 08:42:44 AM

The authorities need to start plugging those leaks or soon they will be building a new NO on a dry lake bed. The water will eventually erode the Mississippi River banks and start dumping the river into NO also.

Those breaks are so big now, I dont see how they are going to stop them. Its going to take thousands of the 3k sand bags to even slow the water down.

Weekend_Sawyer · August 31, 2005, 08:52:27 AM

I feel bad for all of the folks that are now homeless.
Looks like New Orleans is becoming a large lake.

Jon

hardwood · August 31, 2005, 08:55:10 AM

Not to worry. As of this morning's news, the Corps of Engineers is "assessing damage", "working to speed the process", and "eyeing prospects for various options".

DonE911 · August 31, 2005, 08:58:49 AM

Yeah right >:(

Did you hear the PO'ed mayor yesterday evening. He said " there are too many freaking cooks in the kitchen" ;D

Now this morning he was much more politically correct, but I think he knows the city is doomed even if they get the water out. I feel bad for every single resident of that city.

hardwood · August 31, 2005, 09:06:21 AM

It's an amazing Catch-22. The folks that are there can't get out, and those who left can't get back in. It's almost impossible for me to imagine what it must feel like to be in either of those situations. And with every passing hour, it seems like the problems are getting worse instead of better. Very sad.

DanG · August 31, 2005, 09:11:21 AM

They need about a half-dozen ForestryForum members down there to straighten out that situation. The sandbags are washing away as fast they are dumped in. They need to sink a couple of barges in the hole.

Yeah Hardwood, that is a sad situation to be sure. We have a lot of refugees in our area, and they'll likely be here for a while. I'm trying to think of the best way to help some of them out a bit.

Watching tv as I type. The Coast Guard and Army continue to pluck people off of rooftops with helicopters. It has finally occurred to someone that they could use boats for this job. :

DonE911 · August 31, 2005, 09:36:34 AM

DanG,

Correct me if I'm wrong, but sinking a barge in the hole is not possible because the water isn't deep enough. They could sink it in front of the hole, but that would only cause the water to flow around the ship and increase the pressure..... making the break bigger,faster.

I would think they would need to construct a steel double DanG inside the break.... the type of double DanG they use to build docks in marina's. It could hold enough water back so those 3k bags would sink and eventually form a new levy... it would probably still leak some, but not enough to overcome a good pumping set up.

Yeah some FF guys could go down there and fix it right up for them. Sometimes the simplest solution is the right one. ;)

DanG · August 31, 2005, 09:47:27 AM

The barge idea may or may not work. ??? I'm not sure where the breeches are. To me, the lake isn't the big problem, 'cause it will go back down naturally. The river is a different story, because of all that water that will be coming down the river soon....REAL soon.

I can't help but think that if they would get the Corps of Engineers outta there and turn it over to those rivermen, things would get better. :

ronwood · August 31, 2005, 09:48:18 AM

Can anyone tell me why you would build a city (New Orleans) in an area that far below sea level? Seems to not make any sense to me.

Ron

DonE911 · August 31, 2005, 09:54:58 AM

The biggest leak is comming from a canal that is open to the lake. They could double DanG the mouth of the canal and fix the levy, but still the same problem with stopping the water from eroding around whatever they use to double DanG it up.

NO is an old city, it sprang up when the river was down, with man messing with the river and the lake they decided to levy off the city instead of letting nature take its course and city grew even larger.

Same story all over the world. The yellow river floods and kills thousands quite often, but that doesn't keep people from living on top of the river or stop governmnnts from trying to change its course or harness its power.

Mother nature has a way of making things her way.... Katrina was just one of them.

Dan_Shade · August 31, 2005, 10:24:50 AM

they should probably move the city now, but i doubt that will happen.

tnlogger · August 31, 2005, 10:46:32 AM

it's a sad thing all right. but wait untill the the one living in motels run outa money where will they go then. now there is a lot of closed US bases that could be put to use. ???

GF · August 31, 2005, 11:06:14 AM

I have been looking for photos of the levee breaches but cannot find any, do you know of any websites that may have the images?

IndyIan · August 31, 2005, 11:27:52 AM

Hi Ron,
I've read an explanation on how NO got so low below sea level. Basically the city started on the natural levees created by the mississippi river. But as people put up man made levees and dams this prevented sediment being deposited to bring up the level of the land when the river flooded. Also the removal of ground water to dry the place up and natural settling dropped the level of the land more. So what started out as a few feet about sea level is now many feet below...

Someone from the Army Corps should go to Holland and see what they do to keep the Atlantic out of their backyards... It wouldn't be cheap to build but I'm guessing it cheaper than rebuilding the city...

ronwood · August 31, 2005, 11:44:59 AM

IndyIan,

Thanks for the explanation.

Ron

Rockn H · August 31, 2005, 12:34:23 PM

Yeah, due to the levies stopping the natural doposits of river sediment the city is now 5' below to 17' above sea. The mayor now says it will likely be 2months before the water can be under control and pumped out. With all pumps running and no leaks, they can only pump an inch per hour.

In Monroe La just south of us. Refugees have already ran out of money. Monroe opened up its Civic Center for them and the Red Cross and Volunteers are helping with food and water. One man in Mississippi has opened his land for a make shift camp ground free of charge for those that brought a camper or tent.
Just heard, they are finally boating the folks out of the super dome to busses going to the Astro dome in Houston.

Greg · August 31, 2005, 12:36:36 PM

Quote from: Dan_Shade on August 31, 2005, 10:24:50 AM
they should probably move the city now, but i doubt that will happen.

Absolutely it will. Insurance companies will dictate it, if doing business there at all in the future...

Furby · August 31, 2005, 12:41:44 PM

AOL has pics of them, one is 500' long and they are working on the barge thing right now.

I'm thinking they should just let it go!
Don't move the city, let it pass into history and move on.
I know tons of people would disagree with that, but what happens after they clean everything up, fix the levees, and say we won, only for Ma Nature to come back and say I don't think so.

Try this link for pics, look through the slide show.
http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20050824033709990005&ncid=NWS00010000000001

Rockn H · August 31, 2005, 01:12:18 PM

CNN now says the latest info has it taking 3 to 6 months to get the water out of the bowl (NO). Corp of Eng are still trying to come up with a plan to fix the levies. Flood water is expected to rise another 15'.
Seems hard to believe the lake is that much higher, but I guess the lake is still taking on flood water that it will pass on to the city.

Rockn H · August 31, 2005, 01:16:24 PM

Well the same channel just showed the Louisiana emergency management saying that the water has equalized and the flooding has stopped. They also have secured enough slings to start dropping the sand bags with when they arrive.

mike_van · August 31, 2005, 01:36:07 PM

If this tragedy happened in China or Bangledesh, there would be tens of thousands of CIVILIANS filling, lugging, stacking sandbags, mud, straw, whatever it took to stop it. Most of ours down there are too busy looting or sitting around waiting for the government, FEMA and the Red Cross to save their asses. I do feel sorry for the victems of this storm, it's a terrible thing, but people can help out, keep law & order. There are thousands of able bodied people there just waiting for government "aid" that will then bitch about it taking so long. >:(

tnlogger · August 31, 2005, 01:48:23 PM

we just got 2 tour bus loads of disabled victems from NO at our local hospital came over the scanner. we just called in the extra EMS crews to help handle the load.

Tom · August 31, 2005, 01:52:09 PM

Yes, and the concern is that they don't plug the hole too permanently because they won't be able to let the water back out when the lake drops. It's a complicated issure.

Furby · August 31, 2005, 01:54:06 PM

While you are probly right to a point, the feds and what not are simply not allowing anyone down there to help that is not "trained".
The local red cross here, took many, many untrained volunteers and sent them down to Florida last year.
This time around they will not send anyone that don't have proper training and are not going to "train" any.
At least that's what is being reported.

I honestly can not belive how many people have been trapped in their attics and what not, needing to "chopped" out. :

Murf · August 31, 2005, 02:47:57 PM

Last I heard they were planning on filling shipping containers with sand and using them to plug the holes until the levees can be rebuilt properly.

I suspect they're going to be pumping for a very long time before they see pavement again in certain areas. :