WHAT SET AND HOOK IS BEST ON HARD WOODS

[flip]

This is a question I have sort of delved into at one point.  I used some Lennox woodmaster C blades out of the box and found they don't cut very will in the hard woods I have.  I ordered 8 Munks blades from Menominee Saw and my cuts have been cleaner and I can cut faster.  Is there any certain set or hook I should ask for or what is working best for you?

I am using 7/8 on a 13'2" band 1 1/4 wide, should I pu it to 1 1/2?

Just wanting to know what the masses are using.

Thanks...Flip

[Fla._Deadheader]

After finding something that yer happy with, why change now ???

  I believe Munks are set at .022 and 10° hook angle.  ;) ;D

[Tom]

One of the biggest reasons one blade will out perform another, out of the box, is because one is sharper than the other.   

I use Lenox woodmaster C's and some of them don't cut the best 'out of the box'.    Once sharpened they cut great.   Tip damage during manufacture, during shipping or even while you have them will affect how they cut.

Blades should be treated like a fine knife to offer their best performance.

Hook and set will depend on you and your mill as much as it might on the wood you are cutting.   The rule of thumb is "the softer the wood, the more aggressive the blade".   Aggression being how hard of a bite the tooth makes (hook) and how wide the kerf (set).

1 1/4 inch bands with 7/8 pitch and sets in the .0020" range have been the mainstay of the industry for years.  Improvements have been created by using deeper gullets, taller teeth and driving the blade with more horses.

Unless you need the beam strength in your blade to carry more horsepower or to gain more stability in bad grain or knots, I would think that you could find a solution with the size blade you are using now.  Going to wider bands has ramifications greater than just putting the blade on the existing mill.  You may have to change to wider guides, wider bandwheels and run into horsepower problems on top of that.   It's usually the most economical thing to try to make the mill run on the size of blade it was designed before entering into that "new stuff" arena.

[woodbowl]

Flip,
   I don't ever plan to take off with a box of new blades ever again, thinking that I have what I need for the day. I have returned home early in the day with every blade in need of sharpening and set. Another problem is deformation due to the punching process. It takes a lot of face grinding to get this out. Even if your blades are preground, it may not be enough. This is a mfg problem that very few individuals know about. The punching process enters one side and deforms the side of the tooth as to not provide the relief needed for that side. It is very elusive and can not be seen very well with the naked eye. It is a slight roundness associated with the pressure of the die during punching. In effect, the result is side rubbing and will cause the blade to run toward the path of least resistance. Look for a shiny tooth tip on one side. For example, if it was punched on the outside, the blade wants to climb even if it is sharp, even if it is set, even if it is flat, even if it is rolled longer on the back than it is on the front and even if it is stiff, however stiffness has a greater influence to overcome than the previous. If you have ever had a blade that would not run right out of the box regardless of what you did to it, then 6 to 10 sharpenings later it ran straight as an arrow and you don't know why, chances are that you have ground off enough of the face to have the normal relief needed. On the other hand, the exit side of the punching is wonderfully and naturaly relieved. If the punching out process was alternated, this wouldn't be a problem. Fully ground teeth would not have this problem. When I now have a problem blade and everything else is right, the first thing I do is put several heavy face grinds on it and it changes from the sorriest running blade I've got into the best runner. Yea, I know........I ground away most of my hardness. >:( It dulls a little quicker now, but at least I can get some use out of it.

[flip]

Hmmmmm....

I don't have a sharpener or setter and the guys at Menominee tell me the Munks blades aren't really worth resharpening ??? ??? because they are relatively inexpensive.  So what you're saying is a guy really ought to invest in a sharpener and setter if he is going to do much sawing and to sharpen his blades a few times before pitching??

I havn't got serious enough to do the full monte yet but it looks like it's comming... ;D

[Gary_B]

  I only have a few of the monk blades, and really dont have any problems having them sharpen. Although I am lucky enough to have a amish fellow that has a sharpening service do the blades for 3.50. He has two sharpeners and setters running full time.  I would definely agree the blades cut just as good as a new one out of the box.

[Fla._Deadheader]

 I get 10+ sharpenings out of Munks Blades. Mostly, if ya don't overuse them, just a light touch to the face and tooth back will put them in perfect shape. Sometimes, ya gotta run them twice before yer satisfied.

  NEVER take the salesmans word as Gospel. His #1 purpose in life is to sell new blades  ;) ;) ;D ;D

[flip]

He said they charge .50/ft to resharpen, on my blade it would be about $7.00+shipping.  A new blade is $16.00, doesn't make much sense to sharpen them more than once unless unless you DIY.  I guess I need to get a sharpener and setter and start learning.

Ok, since we are now on the subject...What type of sharpeners and setters is everyone using??  How did you learn to use them and is there a way to learn the correct useage?  Can a guy get a used one?

[woodbowl]

So what you're saying is a guy really ought to invest in a sharpener and setter if he is going to do much sawing and to sharpen his blades a few times before pitching??

Flip,
   I don't know what I would do if I didn't have a sharpener and setter. Woodmizer is all I've ever used and it works good for me. The highest running blade I've got is a Monk and it has 36 sharpenings. This is not typical. Most of my blades break between 10 and 20 sharpenings. It's so limber I can only use it on forgiving wood. It started out 1.25" and now is about 1". Another advantage to having your own sharpener and setter is if you hit some nails, (and you will), you can be up and running and not have to wait for your blades to come in. Also, you can customize blades for specific wood types by changing the hook angle, and/or lower/raise the set.

[chet]

Flip,
I purchased a used woodmizer sharpener and setter and after a short learning curve I couldn't be happier. Unless of course my blades never needed sharpening.  :D   The setup paid for itself in less than a year.   8)

[steveo_1]

Hey Flip,
Check these guys out    http://www.dinasaw.com.au/
I bought a sharpener awhile back and it works great with the cyclone type wheel, it never needs dressing and after set up you can do a blade in about 5 minutes