White Pine Logs

Postman · August 05, 2005, 07:23:47 PM

My first Post. Have 4 nice White Pine logs on the deck. 22" the smallest, 32" largest. Any suggestions on what to cut. . . . Thanx

tnlogger · August 05, 2005, 07:39:23 PM

can't help with the cutting but someone will be along shortly ;D
welcome to the forum pull up a stump and sit a spell 8)

DonE911 · August 05, 2005, 09:00:24 PM

HMMMMM

well I need a horse barn for my wifes horse.... so how about cutting my up some rafters.. lets say 2x8x10'... then bring them on over ;D

just kidding.. welcome to the forum.

bull · August 05, 2005, 09:10:24 PM

the widest boards you can get 8)$$$$$
Welcome aboard

Don P · August 05, 2005, 11:18:17 PM

Welcome Postman,
I was over at NeLMA's website tonite. There's a good article on the original big white pines, the ones with the kings broad arrow, for ships masts. Just thought y'all might enjoy a good read.
http://www.nelma.org/udp.php?id=76

I still bring boards up to the house with nothing more to say than, "was once round"

D Martin · August 06, 2005, 07:48:22 AM

Hey guys. Question about eastern white pine suitability fo framing lumber especially roof framing,I was led to believe that it was not really strong enough unless you up the sise of the members from standard. I have a fair amount of pine on the property 20-30 in dbh,I was planing for some type of siding for a barn but have plenty for framing too. I know some bldg codes wont even allow ungraded lumber but I think I could in my town for a non living space. Anyone have any experiences whith this

DonE911 · August 06, 2005, 08:22:47 AM

If its just a barn you prolly can use ungraded lumber..... maybe not in your area, not sure.

If the wood is there, why not use it... who cares if you need to use a little larger piece than you would if you paid for junk stick from your local home improvement joint.

My wife raises cats and she needed a cat house when we moved up here... I looked on the property and found lots of large poplar.... guess what the cat house was built out of.

Timburr · August 06, 2005, 08:31:04 AM

A bit over-kill for a cat house eh! .... unless it's a big cat. ;D

Welcome aboard Postman. Is that your job or do you make posts ??? :D

DonE911 · August 06, 2005, 08:36:55 AM

Cat house is 12'x16' with a 8' roof..... its got 3 seperate housing units inside for 13 cats .... it was either the cat house or the cats in the house.... They aren't really big cats, but bigger and more of them than I wanted inside my house.

Don P · August 06, 2005, 08:44:54 AM

White pine is grouped with the "northern species" in span tables. This is a group that contains Western Redcedar, Ponderosa Pine, Red Pine, Eastern Hemlock, and the Aspens. They do have lower design values than say SPF, so you are right, upsizing a "weaker" wood is one way to get it back within its allowable working stress range, shorter spans is another. You could build with Balsa, it would just take some mighty deep rafters

.

White pine has the added problem of an often less than ideal knot structure. It grows 2-3 feet and sends out a cluster of branches, completely encircling the tree and next year grows 2-3 feet and does it again. Depending on where the lumber comes from in relation to those knot clusters, a board can be completely crossed by knot clusters every couple of feet. You can easily design for #2 white pine and when you grade thru the stack have #3 or #4 at half the intended strength. If there ever was a wood that needs good grading this is it. When I see a broken timber its usually white pine and by a bad knot combination. When you get into trees of the diameters you are talking about, there can be a fair amount of good framing lumber in them. So I guess the answer is, stay within the limits of strength, and don't push the grade.

This link is to CWC's Spancalc, http://www.cwc.ca/design/tools/calcs/SpanCalc_2002/
We use 30 psf for roof load here (every region varies!) I ran SPF 2x6 @ 16" on center and maximum span was 13'5", northern species was limited to 11' 5".

I must type too slow...now we's talkin about cat houses :D

oldschoolmiller · August 06, 2005, 09:49:31 AM

I would make a repeat on the, "cut the widest boards possible quote", if it is good clear material, or minimal knots, then stick it and makew sure you have plenty of weight on top to keep them from cupping too bad. Around here we use cinder blocks, or I-beams, good luck

oldschoolmiller · August 06, 2005, 09:51:01 AM

Thick is good too, material that wide would make some great tables, post some pics when you get them 8)

Postman · August 07, 2005, 05:03:15 PM

Thank-you for welcoming me to The Forum and your input on cutting White Pine. . . . . Postman

bull · August 08, 2005, 07:02:36 AM

white pine is fine for framing.. My barn/workshop and sheds are all framed in white pine. Stick built w/ real 2xs...
also all sided w/ white pine. Roof sheathing, wind bracing all white pine... Also the building inspector loves it .
He grew up in town and his family ran a saw mill cut nothing but white pine... He and his brothers built over 100 houses in town all white pine and all green right off the mill..

Husky · August 08, 2005, 06:45:25 PM

saw it soon before the pine borers get into it.

Tony_T · August 13, 2005, 02:14:02 AM

When working at a comercial mill we did the following. After getting the slabs off: the clear is cut into 5/4 (furniture material) , knotty into 4/4 (siding), and center sections into 6 X 6 s (sent off for pressure treating for landscape ties.)

Lenny_M · August 13, 2005, 08:17:32 AM

D Martin
If you need I can help you out with the grading of framing lumber. Lumber doesn`t have to be stamped in N.H. I can issue a certificate that you sumitt with your building permit saying it`s #2 or better and your good to go.
If your mill is regestered in N.H you can take the test for the grading of Native N.H. lumber. If intrested I can send you the phone #. We took the home study rather than the 1 day coarse. the state will send the booklet and all you have to do is take the test. takes about 1/2 hour.
The state is now looking into letting you take the test at home and mailing it in.Don`t know if it is started yet.
Lenny

Lenny

beenthere · August 13, 2005, 10:24:01 AM

Lenny
You can issue a certificate without looking at each piece of framing lumber? Or did I miss that step in your reply?

Lenny_M · August 13, 2005, 10:49:27 AM

Beenthere
I look at each peice
My standards are much better than what the state considers #2.
Some of the junk the state called #2 Iwould throw in the #3 pile.
My wife got 2 wrong on the test for that reason
The person that gave the test said most mills in this area tend to grade higher than the standards set by the state.
Lenny

beenthere · August 13, 2005, 11:09:29 AM

That is good, and I hear you on the appearance of pieces that grade #2 but don't look so good. Can I assume your State is adopting the standards of NELMA (Northeast Lumber Manufacturers Assoc.) ?

Do you grade for the construction grades or also do the stress grades as well? I'd be curious as to how any liability would stack up if a piece failed, or if the State has a law that protects you from liability.

D Martin · August 13, 2005, 05:36:07 PM

Lenny M What do you mean by registered. It is not a mobile unit so I dont tow it, If you mean registered as a buisness it is not that either. I would love to be able to grade though so if you could post the # and some more info that would be cool Where did you grow up? I grew up in Penacook over near Concord NH. Weare isin't too far from there. well thanks for any info

Lenny_M · August 17, 2005, 11:45:19 PM

D Martin
I grew up in new boston. N.H.
Ck into it. In N.H. All mills are to be regestered with the Dept. of forest and lands.
Cost about $ 16 a year and you get a plate and sticker every year. They have sent me back a ck for that amount every year??Don`t question a good thang. ;D
The Grading is part is through the Dept. of agg,foods and markets. No cost ;D
Ck out N.H. native lumber law. The info is on the web.