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newbie question #1

Started by meazlejr, June 19, 2005, 10:48:24 PM

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meazlejr

I am new to the forestry board and have a intrest in milling some lumber for myself. As weel as buying from local mills.  This seems to be a great resourse.  I am not new to the internet forum thing.  I am a member of several woodworking forums.  There a re newbie questions that come up often on those forums that can get a little old. like "what table saw should I buy?".  what are the newbie question that I need to stay away from here?  and what is the one thing you wish someone had told you when you got started in milling? Okay guys and gals be nice. This is my first thread to start over here.
Joe

J_T

Ask away  8) Even if we been over it some of us can't rember and may jolt us into learning sompthing new :D :D Jim the forgetter :D
Jim Holloway

pigman

Joe, since you are on several woodworking forums, what would be the best table saw for me to buy. ;)  Just joking. The fourm has a good search function that can answer a lot of questions. If you don't find the answer there, ask away. If new members didn't ask questions all we would talk about  is who liked grits and who didn't. :D  I don't know the answer  to most questions but there will be someone here that can answer almost any question, except what is the best sawmill to buy. ;D  If you have any pig questions I am the one to ask. 8)
Edit:  Jim beat me to it.
Things turn out best for people who make the best of how things turn out.

Tom

I don't think anyone here is short tempered about "newbie" questions.   There is so much information in past threads that older members wonder sometimes why new folks don't read more, but, we like new folks.  

There are some things that just can't be answered, like, what is the best something-er-other or how much should I charge when you don't even say where you are.   That stuff is pretty common sense though.

Welcome to the Forum.  Jump in with both feet.  :D

redpowerd

im a long term newbie, going on three yrs. theres never a question that the friends here on the ff cant answer, trust me. got some bug in my old barn beams, chewin away, ima gunna post up here with. betcha a day and these good freinds got it solved, times three.  this is the best place to be if you enjoy wood.

yep stick around and check out some "old" threads ;D
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

redpowerd

p.s. i didnt think that one buys a table saw but FINDS one
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

Rockn H

Welcome MeazleJr,  Is it just me, or is their alot of Arkansas flags waving around here lately? ;D

DanG

I noticed that Rockn.  I just figgered folks out there was beginnin' to get electricity. ;D
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Gipper

Hey meazlejr, welcome!!  I, too, would be considered a newby based on the number of post, though I have been registered for quiet some time.  I just have always felt I could learn more by listening than talking, or in this case, reading than typing.  Rest assured, the folks on this forum can and will answer your questions.  A lot of my questions have been answered before I ever got the chance to ask them.  Do a little searching and if you don't find it ask away and ye shall get your answers. :D

MULE_MAN

Welcome meazlejr

I don't think anybody around this Forum has any probably with newbie
question. And it stays a real friendly place . Jeff & the Board Moderator
try very hard to keep this a Friendly place.
We all learn from question & allot of pass threads you'll probably find
your answer,  I think you'll find this is one of the Best Forum out there
and several real good sponsor's here  8)
Wood-Mizer LT40HDG25 with Simple Setworks, debatker, 580 CASE backhoe

tnlogger

 Welcome meazlejr
Just remember no question is too dumb ;D
It might be joked about had fun with but this is one big happy family witch respects everone here and you will always get an answer  :)
I think arky's recruiting and trying to get the upper hand on us there southen boys  :D :D :D
gene

Ga_Boy

Welcome Meazlejr,

Just remember one thing when you are pondering if you should or should not post a question.

We were all new here at one point or another.

With that said please ask away, I might learn something. 8)




Mark
10 Acers in the Blue Ridge Mountains

Texas Ranger

Wait a minute.  Being nice?  Does that mean I gotta hold up on the Arkansas jokes till he gets his feet wet?
The Ranger, home of Texas Forestry

meazlejr

Alright guy's i have been eaten up as of late with the idea of milling my own hardwood for furniture making and might even want to do a little timber framing one day.  I live in town but have quite a bit of space.  I have been to see Scott Banbury (urbanlooger) befor he moved to his new shop.  There is a guy with a small band mill close by that has offerd to cut logs on the shares with me. I supply the logs he the saw and we split. I see tree services here throwing away big oaks maples and pecans.  I also have buddy that works for one of the largest construction companies in town.  My borther is an agri teaher and has logs donated (has 20" 16 foot cherry logs just sittin at the shop now) often.  He also coaches the school's foresrty and land judging team.  I have had trees offerd by coworkers too.  So despited my lack of timber I think I will be able to come by logs to cut.  cheap rough cut hardwood is hard to come by around here.  I would like to take adavanage of some of the these logs and even sell a few bf to some of the local woodworkers.  I have met many of them in my area.  There is also a comercial kiln a bout 35 miles away.  He charges about .20 bf to dry lumber.  I in now have aspirations to become a pro sawyer.  I am going to do a little work on the sahres with the local bandmill guy (he only saws for his own use) before I spend any money on a mill of my own. 

Okay here is the newbie question:
what mills should I be looking at with the above in mind?

   I have gotten info from Norwood, timberking, and logosol.  I have been checking sawmill exchange, and we have a couple fo bandmill makers here in Arkansas.

www.mistersawmill.com

I have also looked at Lucas online.  There was  woodmizer lt40 in the local paper this weekend but 22 grand is north of my budget.
Sorry so long winded just want share my situation so you guy's can share inforamtin that I can understand and not stuff that is over my head.
Thanks,
Joe

meazlejr

let those jokes fly.  Can't live in Arkysaw without a thick skin.

Haytrader

 ::)

Well, alrighty then.....
Did ya hear the one about.......
OOps, just remembered there is a special place for jokes.

:D  :D

Oh, welcome measle jar...  ;D

Did I spell that right?
;)
Haytrader

MULE_MAN

I know what Mill I prefer, But your the one that has to run it & keep it running.
So not to slam any Mill I would have to tell you to keep researching & get the
Big picture on all the Mills out there. I know that's not much of a answer, But I just
don't think it's fair to any of are sponsors, To get on the soap box and brag a Mill
up !! There's probably Pro's & Con's in all of them .  :)  :)
Wood-Mizer LT40HDG25 with Simple Setworks, debatker, 580 CASE backhoe

Ron Wenrich

You have several choices in mill manufacturers.  Are you looking to be stationary or portable?  Is production a factor?  How much grunt work are you interested in doing?  What type of support equipment do you have?

The mill types are dimension mills, swing blade mills, band mills and chainsaw mills.  Those would all fit nicely on your lot.

If you are planning to go to the log to saw, then the dimension mills, swing blade mills and chainsaw mills may be a good way to go.  Band mills would require moving the log.  OK for smaller logs or if you have support equipment.

Chainsaw mills are low tech, but offer lots of waste.  Dimension and swing blade mills produce finished lumber without needing an edger or to put back on the saw to edge.  Band mills offer a little higher recovery. 

It depends on your situation.  Figure out what you need.  Better yet, get to see what the other types of mills have to offer.  If you can, get to a mill show this summer and see those mills in operation. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Rockn H

Try to visit some different mills, most sawyers don't mind spectators too much.  See how they work in real life and what the sawyers don't like about them, or what they would have done different if they had built it.  At 22K it sounds like the wm you mentioned must have been a full hydraulic model.  WM has other models that are cloce to the prices that were in the site you listed.  Don't count anyone out without looking at all the models and options available.  Personally, I would not consider any mill without power feed. ;D  One thing you don't hear much, but is a good question to ask is the thickness of the last board a mill can cut, some only go down to 2".

Rockn H

Quote from: DanG on June 19, 2005, 11:53:07 PM
I noticed that Rockn.  I just figgered folks out there was beginnin' to get electricity. ;D

About two months ago I almost fell out of my chair when the local news did a report on a community about an hour south of here, in Louisiana.  The community had just gotten telephone service.  An older lady was quoted as saying it might be more convenient to keep in touch now that she had a phone. ::) ;D ::)

oakiemac

There are a lot of different mills with different capabilities and different price tags. Don't jump on the band wagon (band wagon-get it?) just because they are the most popular. But also don't discount the band mill because some of those band mills are great machines.
Probably the best thing to do is get the videos from the manufacturers, then go out and see if you can find a mill or two in your area and help tail for a day just to see first hand how it performs.
I got a Mobile Dimension mill because I found one near by that was for sale at a real good price and I have a freind that used to own one and he had nothing but good to say about them.
The more investigation you do the better off you will be.
Mobile Demension sawmill, Bobcat 873 loader, 3 dry kilns and a long "to do" list.

Jeff

I have merged the newbie threads, as I envision "Newbie question #137"  and want to keep them all where we can find them. :D
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

meazlejr

thanks Jeff,
I wish I had thought of that
Joe

Rockn H

Jeff, you had me wondering for a second there. ;D ::) ::)

Ianab

Hi Joe and welcome to the forum  :)

Yes.. thats our version of the "what's the best table saw?" question  :D , but thats OK because just like that question the answer is different for different people.

Personal view... Look at the swingblade mills (Lucas and Peterson) for what you want to do. Why, portability, big log handling and a very capable machine for the money. Now if all you were going to saw was 20" cherry logs then one of the small bandmills might be a better option, but the first time you get offered a 4 ft dia log you will be wishing you had a swingblade  ;)

The swingblades will saw smaller logs perfectly well also, but they don't have a big advantage over a bandsaw, and the thinner blade of the bandsaw should give you better recovery.

Support equipment - I assume you dont have much? Another reason to go swinger, if you cant move a log easily, leave it on the ground and set up the mill around it. Takes about 15 mins and no sweat to move mill to a new log, compared to manhandling a big log onto a mill, thats the method I use. Small, easier to man handle, logs are just rolled onto bunks under the mill.

Anyway, thats my 2 cents worth  :D Try and see some mills running and spend some time helping the local bandsaw guy thats going to saw those logs for you. It will give you a good idea of how things work and what the different options are.

Cheers

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

meazlejr

Thanks Ian,
I figured that I was redoing a classic.  I am not asking what to buy but what to consider.  Lucas is the most expensive mill I have considered.  But it is on my list because it is cheaper than a mill and a tractor/loader and would give me  a shot at those big oaks that keep coming down around here.  I have never seen one in action and would like to.
Joe

maple flats

Then check with Lucas and Peterson on there web sites and ask when and where they will be demoed at a show. Or get the names of a couple of owners within reasonable driving distance and visit them, ask away and tail the mill to find out how you like it (If you are new, tailing means removing the sawn lumber from the log and stacking it where it can be handled for the next step, sale-stickering etc) Most owners are glad to show you what they have. You might also check to see if a FF member has one you want to check out close by, you know they will help all they can. A good sawyer is not afraid of competition, a bad one might be.
logging small time for years but just learning how,  2012 36 HP Mahindra tractor, 3point log arch, 8000# class excavator, lifts 2500# and sets logs on mill precisely where needed, Woodland Mills HM130Max , maple syrup a hobby that consumes my time. looking to learn blacksmithing.

sigidi

Hey there Joe,

G'day from down under.

I've let this one go a while to see where you're heading. By the sounds of it you want, big log ability, small log recovery, great finished product, portability for moving when needed to.... Ah mate just playing with ya ;)

Seriously, best place to find anything out is right here - Step 1 A++

Step 2 concerns? YOU WILL GET ADDICTED it may be when you cut your first board or when you smell sawdust it will happen ;D

Step 3 write down what timber is available to cut in your area, write down what you want to cut, write down what benefits you want from your mill. Lastly write down what you already have to assisst in sawmilling (this may be brains, or chainsaws - you get the idea)

Step4 with the above, knowing your budget, get looking at every mill made to suit your list, ones that fall a little out of your list, look at 'em too and decide if the things you feel that are most important are solved.

Step5 Use every mill you have stuck into a short list as compared to your list of above.

After that you will ahve made your mind up without us :D ;D ;)
Always willing to help - Allan

meazlejr

MF,
I would be willing to tail for any mill around for a day or 2 just to get some hands on OJT.  As far as competeing with other sawyers the closest one is 60 miles away that I have foud.  Part of my joing the FF was to find out if there was any closer.


Sigidi,
Thanks for the far away greeting and the step by step formula.  You left out step 6: find a marriage counselor when you wife finds out how much money you are going to spend She already thinks I spend too much time in the shop.  There are lots that apeal to be about the Lucas.  I only have an 8 inch Jointer you guys down under might say 200 mm planer. So  producing 24" wide board is not a great concern of mine. Cost and what happens what I some metal are my concerns with that approach.

Joe


meazlejr

I need to cear up my earlier post.  It reads " I in now intetend to pe a pro sawyer."  Should read: I in no way intend to be a pro sawyer.  Sorry boys I have fat fingers.
Joe

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