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Woods vehicle

Started by Engineer, April 11, 2005, 08:25:26 PM

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Engineer

My dad has been trying to make up his mind about a new woods vehicle.  He's got about 30 acres which he uses exclusively for firewood.  He and I will both cut about 12-15 cords out every year for the next several years. 

He used to use an old Jeep CJ-5 with a hardtop that worked great for maneuverability but couldn't hold much more than an armload of wood and the chainsaw.  Right now he's got a ten-year-old Mazda B4000 (same as a Ranger) with a short bed and extended cab, and he's constantly running into things, a tree branch ripped the cap right off the back, the thing is full of scratches, etc.  He complains about it constantly and says he needs a smaller vehicle.  Dad isn't the kind of guy who likes well-defined and wide woods roads.  Most of his trails I can barely get my tractor down through, and it's only 4' wide.

I've been trying to convince him to get a Gator, one that will pull his dump trailer (it's a 4x7 foot box with a single axle) but I'm not sure that a Gator can handle a full trailer.  He usually puts half a cord of green firewood in it.  Also thoughts have been a short-box Toyota or Ranger, something with 4wd and no extra cab. 

Any ideas from you guys?  He still has the Jeep but it hasn't run since 1995 and there isn't much left of the body for all the rust....

Tom

I run a 1988 toyota long bed 4 wheel drive in the woods.  I back it up with a tractor that I leave at the house.   I figure I can always walk out and get the tractor.


The toyota pulls good and has air conditioning for those hot days in the swamp when you can't breath and need a respite from the mosquitoes.  Don't run it all of the time but it sure feels good on a break.  The bed will haul a half a cord with no trouble and I could pull a small trailer if I wanted.  Boggs can be fought by deflating the tires and I can carry a couple of air tanks that will pump them back up if necessary.

It also has a am/fm radio that is indespensible when have my sandwich. :)

The trick is to not go mudding but to just "grind" along.  Low range and second gear pulls me out of most problem areas.

twoodward15

man, it's time to downsize and slow down.  get a lawn tractor and one of the yard trailers for it.  3 trips will get you close to a cord.  Put some chains on it and some weight front and back and just cruise through the woods real slow.  It's nice to look around on the way in and out.  You won't get so tired either because you'll get more breaks driving around.
108 ARW   NKAWTG...N      Jersey Thunder

Faron

A Kawasaki Mule or Polaris Ranger would fill the bill, I think.  We were looking at them for logging and pulling a 150 gallon sprayer in the field.  I think either would have worked for us, but we ended up getting a 500 CC Arctic Cat 4WD ATV instead.  The Cat works better for spraying, I think, but I kind of wish we had a Ranger for feeding cattle and working in the woods.  I'm no expert, but I think the Gater is a little lighter duty than the mule or ranger.
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner.  Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote. - Ben Franklin

firtol88

My father in law has a Gator HPX 4x4 diesel that he won't stop braggin about. He has about 450 acres out in the boonies and says it's better than his 4 wheeler.

There's men who drink Guinness, and there's men who drink what's left when we're done with it.

* Note to Democrats, yes please flee to Canada!

Rockn H

You can get a Polaris Ranger for around 8000.  They are really impressive.  Since it doesn't seem like it would need to be street legal, you may want to look at a mini truck.  They are imported from Japan, and are about the same size as a gator.  They are 4x4 with drop down bed sides, full cab, a/c and heat.  Most sell for around 4500.  They are also name brand, that is, Suzuki, Isuzu, Nissan.  I'll try to find some pictures.  If you are interested I'll try to find some phone numbers of dealers I have collected for myself one day.


rebocardo

I have driven my 1997 Ranger regular cab 4x4 down ATV trails in the woods on my property, a stock 4x4 Ranger is no taller then someone's head on an ATV. So, I do not think smaller or an open vehicle is better if it gets your Dad wacked on his head by a branch. If you buy a Ranger buy a 1997 or earlier with a 4.0L and 5 speed so you get the beefy axles with MANUAL hubs.

If you want smaller, then try a Bronco II. I pulled much wood through a frozen swamp area where I had to fold my mirrors in to make it between trees where larger trucks could not fit or float on the surface. With the seats folded down I fit a good amount of birch in there, but, I would not recommend it for reg. wood hauling because you will end up breaking a window or trashing the interior.

It would be excellent for pulling a small trailer through the woods because it is very easy to turn, 94 inch WB, has 12" clearance under the transfer case with just P235s/75R/15 tires on it, and it is much shorter then a Ranger. The thing I liked was it was very easy to get into and out of on a trail because you sit fairly upright like in a chair. Good on gas when idling, and best of all, you can usually buy them for $1200 or so. Replacement parts are very cheap, even sheet metal. Again, get a manual 5 speed with manual hubs.

I would not use it to trailer ANYTHING heavy (like a 1/2 a cord of wood) at highway speeds though, that would be suicide in a BII. It would pull it out of the woods in low range just fine and at low street speeds (30 mph or less) as long as the trailer was short. I would not attemp steep downhills with a trailer loaded with wood at street speeds.

I have two customers that load their Rangers (both 2.3L 5 speeds  2x4s!) to the frame rails (1/4+ cord) of white oak. I say a small prayer everytime they pull out their trucks out that they do not break on the curb while the front wheels are almost off the ground. They keep coming back so I guess they survive the 1200+ pounds okay.

Those Gators are nice, but, I imagine at $6k+ brand new one you could buy a pretty good Jeep, Ford, or Chevy pickup designed to take the load. If I remember the Gator docs., they do not have locking diffs either.  Replacement body panels are probably pretty high. I looked into one myself and for me the 600 pound payload was the real killer. My equipment (saws, jacks, cables, etc,.) weighes that much!

Which is why I bought a 1971 Ford F-100 4x4. I built it up for off road and my tree work and I can literally put a ton of wood in it. I have used it for log skidding too. It is wide and tall (79W x 77H  with the roof rack) so it will not be on many ATV trails, but, it can carry a full 1/2 a cord of wood out of the woods without a trailer no problems. I do not skid that many logs, but, it has enough power so I have snapped 1/4 cable and have not noticed it until I realized I could not see the log moving behind me.

I bought a pre 1980 truck so I could get dead reliable starting (no computer) where I could replace everything electrical including the plugs and wires for under $100 in under an hour. Nothing stinks worse then being stuck a mile off road, deep in snow, loaded with wood, with a bad TPS or CPS or other sensor etc. in the middle of Maine where the nearest highway with stores is 12 miles away, open Mon-Fri, if they happen to stock that part anyway. Assuming you took along your hand scanner to find the problem.

For a woods work truck, I like pre 1980 Ford big iron.  Chevy or Dodge would work iffin you like those or an older Jeep J-10 (actually was a first choice of mine) if you can find it.

UNCLEBUCK

Check out sprucebunnys cool track machines , 2 cool machines I think you would like the smaller one for sure to get through 4 foot wide trails ,
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Rockn H


sawyerkirk

How about a little ford 9n? They are a great little tractor. As you know it dosen;'t take long to wipe out a truck in the woods. The thought of buying a Gator or other expensive toy to bounce off trees, just dosen't work for me. Just my opinion tho.

twoodward15

How about one of those bobcat 4X4 trucks that are like the gators only heavier duty?
108 ARW   NKAWTG...N      Jersey Thunder

slowzuki

I suspect budget plays a role too.  Those gators are good for tooling around in the woods and will pull a big load.  Combined, more than a Jeep.

Weekend_Sawyer

 My father had the same problem. Our hunting cabin in WV has lots of old logging trails and Dad just loved to ride around them. He would look to the left and rake something down the right side, back up until he heard the bump then take another cut at it. He honestly drove by feel. Our soloution was that whenever we needed firewoood we would widen the trails. Didn't always work, dad also enjoyed making new trails >:(

We were going to buy him Mule but his truck was more comfortable, like Tom said, had A/C and a radio and he did not often drive on the road.

It is not legal to hunt out of a vehicle in WV but we figured what the heck, what are they going to do to an old man. Dad didn't move too well. Once he fell asleep, ok lots of times, but this once he woke up and there were about a dozen turkeys around, when he opened the door to take a shot the door chime went off and away went the turkey's.

Jon
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

DanG

EZ-GO now has a 4wd golf cart that will tote a 1500lb cargo.  Looks like just the trick to me. :)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Murf

Around here an old small Japanese (Kubota and such) compact tractor seems to be a popular choice.

You can nice one for a couple grand and talk about pull power, those little diesels hooked to farm lug tires through a way-down-there geared tranny would just about pull a politician's hand out of your pocket.  :D
If you're going to break a law..... make sure it's Murphy's Law.

Ironwood

I have a lot of experience with a Gator. I have borrowed a client's gator's (8 each) to collect Iromwood around their 500 acres here in hilly Pa. I am impressed. They have Polaris 6x6's (2each) and a Mule (older 2wd) a Goldini 4x4 side and rear dumping articulated ($35,000)and numerous other cool vehicals (Argo 6x6). The gators are the hands down favorite among the 6-8 caretakers. The only issue with the 4x6 is  the heavy deep snow. They bought their first Gator HPX 4x4 a while back. I recently bought one as well. I have been outfitting it with custom racks hitches and saw holders, meyers power angle plow, head ache rack and all the goodies. The roll bar and full body cage (to protect from damaging the body panels if i slide sideways with a load)will have to wait as I need to get in the woods asap for some project wood. The HPX 20 hp Kawasaki engine is a cold starter and shouldn't idle too much as it loads up. A bit of a hassle but what a great machine. I have large inverted vee tire chains for the really nasty going. It does have a locking rear diff. and four wheel drive. Tthe deisel engine a a$1800 option may be the way to go, I hate deisel fumes though. It is by far a n expensive tool, but for what I do it is awsome. You could also rig up a small trailer with electric brakes to load up beyond the standard rating. I have since looked around and unless you want to spend 35,000 on the Bobcat version, it is great. This HPX also has a full suspension, liquid cooling, and good ground clearence (thing does some amazing climbing here on our property) BEEN TESTING IT ;D ;D ;D


  The other radvantage is the avaliblity of service and parts well into the future with JD.

                                    My wife agrees that it is an awsome vehical for our 20 acres and my work, and she is .....well tight with the money so that  endorsement is pretty indicative of how nice and functional  a machine it is. Good luck, Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Gipper

Just bought the Kubota RTV900 two days ago and with only four hours on it, I can tell it is an awesome utility vehicle.  Several companies make a similar one, and it was a very difficult choice.  I wanted the diesel which narrowed it  down considerably.  The bobcat and Pug and a couple others were a little more than I wanted.  Also a little more money than the ones I looked at.  The Club Car XRT1500 is a very nice machine, as well as the Kawasaki Mule, which were the other two I considered.  The two models I looked at were also diesel.  Two nice features about the Club Car are: (1) totally automatic - just put it in gear and go.  Differential lock is automatic as is 4 wheel drive. (2) more leg room.  It's cargo bed is smaller than the Mule or the one I bought.  A plus to the mule was a little more storage space.

The thing that sold me on the Kubota was the engine/transmission braking on down hill drags.  I don't know how steep the terrain is where you would be using it, but here I have some very steep ground, though everywhere I run it in the hills there will be dozer roads.  It also has a slightly larger cargo bed and on the worksite model I bought, the hydraulic dump for the bed is standard.  The cargo bed capacity is 1100 pounds.  It also has a couple more inches of ground clearance.  I can see one mistake I made is not getting the mud tires, rather than the standard worksite tires.  It's rained the two days I've had it, so I have plenty of mud to run it in. >:(  It could be the vehicle you need, if the jeep is beyond use.  Can the Jeep not have a larger cargo box built into it?

redpowerd

get the jeep goin.

a cj is just a bit wider than the uv's described, but in my opinion gets down tight trails easier. ive had a ranger 6x6 for about 6 years and they just dont turn like a jeep, im sure the 4x4s turn easier with the open diff in the back and the shorter wheelbase. them 6x6s ride nicer than anything ive been in off road, and the weight of them combined with the full skidplate gets them over small trees and pulls big loads better than a jeep.
depends on your budjet, we all know woods arnt very forgiving, and replacement parts to keep a uv in the woods can break you quick. wearas fixing a jeep is cheep!

now that i have the 4x4 IH for the woods, the ranger is reserved for lighter duty chores.
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

Engineer

Problem with the jeep is that there isn't much left besides the drivetrain.  Needs new body, new radiator, battery, brakes, tires, gas tank (he ran it for years with a one-gallon metal can jammed next to the passenger seat), suspension, pretty much the only thing that's left is the engine, tranny and seats.  And we're not even sure that's any good.  It ain't been out of first gear since 1981.

I suppose I could look at it as a future project, and just work with my tractor and his dump trailer for the time being.

Ironwood

Engineer,

  Got to tell you that I finally got all my racks and welding far enough along to get a little "agressive " in the woods this Monday. I was on 100 acress near Confluence Pa. My buddy got the acreage as a birthday gift from his wife! Anyhow it is a huge side of a valley and very steep and was logged about 15-20 years ago. The old skidder trails go straight up gaining 500 or more feet above the creek below. We cleared some sapling growth and vine off the trail as we went. The Gator 4x4 HPX climbed some impressively steep terrain. He had been reluctant to even try it with his 4 wheeler. I will say that it has been dry here , no rain for 2 weeks so it was good footing but still, the darn thing was awsome. I had never pushed the Gators I had borrowed from my client's for obvious reasons. The thing climbed it several timess throughout the afternoon , as I shuttled loads down. At one point moving about 400-500lbs of cherry burl down to my truck down in the valley. If it were slimey I think tire chains would have worked to make it even more agile. I think my buddy may go buy one to use as he was as  thouroughly impressed as I . The only drawback for a less strong person or elderly may be the lack of power steering, although my client HPX had it added on at the JD dealer because he is handicapped and  makes him better able to control the Gator.   

  I am very pleased and unless you are willing to use a bigger vehical or willing to spend more than 15K, this seems to be a good choice. I would never have taken a tractor on the terrain I was on, just too steep for even a top of the line unit with all the chains and good brakes :)

PS. Found the biggest Cherry burl I have ever seen up on that ridge. :o It was not on his property but I will try to buy it later this summer and drag it out next fall or winter. 24-30" dbh tree with a 5-6' diameter burl extending 5' up the trunk at about a height of 12'. I will tryr to post a photo when I get down there next. I may try to drag it out with the Gator.

FARON,

  The ranger and Mule are of similer weight and stature to the HPX Gator. My client has two Polaris Rangers and they are used for moving Maple Suger sap out of the wood in the "mud " season. The caretakers don't use the HPX as it is the newest to the fleet. They use the older 6x4's with the 10-18 hp engines.  The 6x6 Rangers are nice but feel a little bulkly in the woods. I think the HPX would work equally well due to the 4x4 as it is necessary for the slime and snow of late winter sugering. The 6x4 Gator is mnot good in deep snow.

TWOODWARD15

  The Bobcat is a cool vehical but starts at around $32,000  if the local Bobcat parts guy told the truth last month when I inquired. Sales guyss aren't in on Saturdays and that was his best guess. Too much for me.                

                                   Reid Crosby
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

babylogger

1985-86 nissan! they will go anywhere, and if you dont think they will just push them! mine would only hold 1/2 of a face cord of wood though. that was the bad part! also look at the frame on them if you ever get a good deal because even though they are a fabulous work truck, they are noted for the frame rusting out right by the gas tank and in the front by the rt front tire ..i think. or buy a volkswagon rabbit they fit everywhere lol the other choice is a ford f250!!! they go everywhere too...except my dad doesnt know that!!!! lmbo
love logger

MemphisLogger

I'm with Tom,

My little 4 cylinder Toy 4x4 is an excellent woods vehicle that never gets stuck (8000lbs winch helps in the tough spots)  8)


Scott Banbury, Urban logger since 2002--Custom Woodworker since 1990. Running a Woodmizer LT-30, a flock of Huskies and a herd of Toy 4x4s Midtown Logging and Lumber Company at www.scottbanbury.com

IndyIan

Suzuki sidekick's or vitara's have real 4x4 with low range, and they are narrow too.  They also go by Geo tracker, chevy tracker and Asuna sunrunner.  They definitely need a trailer for bigger loads but should be much cheaper than a new gator or atv and pull much more. 
I use an atv with trailer in my woods and it is  trade off between the amount I can haul and how much work i need to do on my trails, not much...  Also I can get up steep stuff that wouldn't happen with a 4x4 truck. 
Ian

Ironwood

IndyIan,

  What does "real" 4 wheel driove mean? The gator's and most other utilitity types have locking rear differentials with a front limiteed slip. Doe it get more real than that? Can you steer this "real" 4 wheel drive? Tracks with a hyrostat drive would be way cool but I don't think I want to know the $$$. The Gator can get pretty crazy climbing and does real well, although the comment earlier by Gipper about a a Kubota with controlled decent would be nice.

Gipper,

   What did that set you back?


UrbanLogger,

  I lovethat "skidder". I did use a 1985 Toyota with a factory Knaphide flat bed around our place for years. It was two wheel drive but with "cleat " chains all the way around there was really no stopping the thing. I could dig a ditch with the rears if I really gunned it and let the mud fly. Finally the clutch frame and everything else went south. No shame in that truck though I insanely loaded it with heavy mud incrusted root balls I had dug with a trackhoe, things must have weighed 2500lbs or more as the trackhoe was feeling some pain lifting them. I really thought it would fold the frame. No shame!


                   REID
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Ernie

Anyone remember the ww2 surplus brengun carriers in the early fifties, they would go anywhere
A very wise man once told me . Grand children are great, we should have had them first

Scott

Where those the rigs that looked like a box on tracks? ???

Ernie

You got it in one, They would go through almost anything 8) 8)
A very wise man once told me . Grand children are great, we should have had them first

Ironwood

Well, Priced the Kubota. Over $10,500 diesel only. Hydro for braking would be nice as would power steering, but still like the Gator HPX. $7500 including $1000 off for demo model.  Still feel like I made the right decision. Dump kit for the Kubota $1300 Gator = $950, don't need it but still makes me feel good to have bought GREEN. Not to mention the Gator looks better! ::) ::),

Engineer,

  Let me know what you do I'll be curious to see. REID
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

caryr

We drive this in the woods every day! AM/FM/6 disc CD changer, AC, heated leather seats, seats seven with room for saws/supplies in the back. What more could you want  ;D.



I looked at the Kubota RTV900 when they first came out and agree they are nice machines, but without some after market armoring they should be kept on maintained trails. There are too many important things within the reach of a stray stick.

Take care,

Cary

Ironwood

For those interested, I found a cool website for UTV's as the Gators, RTV Kubota, and Mules and such are called. They have some nice products that are not available anywhere else.  It is www.hunterworks.com

                         Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Gipper

Reid,

Price was in line with what you found out!  I added the winch and top, and should have chosen the mud tires rather than the standard ones, which would not have increased the price any.  They are a little pricey, but I wanted the diesel because I buy diesel fuel in large quantities for my other equipment and I like the additional power at low rpm.

With the winch, top and tax, mine was 11,500 out the door.  (Yep, I paid the taxes because I don't derive any income from farming, so I did not take the tax exempt clause.  :() The Mule, XRT 1500, and Gators I looked at, comparably equiped were about the same money.  The worksite model I chose has the hydraulic dump and power steering included as standard, though I'm sure included in the base price somewhere  :D

firtol88

Quote from: Reid Crosby on April 27, 2005, 08:03:36 AM
For those interested, I found a cool website for UTV's as the Gators, RTV Kubota, and Mules and such are called. They have some nice products that are not available anywhere else.  It is www.hunterworks.com

Nice link I'll pass it on to the Father-in-law he has been making noise about wanting a winch for the afore mentioned gator.
There's men who drink Guinness, and there's men who drink what's left when we're done with it.

* Note to Democrats, yes please flee to Canada!

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