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Author Topic: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...  (Read 1015 times)

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Offline Stuart Caruk

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Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« on: September 15, 2017, 07:32:02 pm »


So, my Barko has leaked slightly around a track motor since I bought it. I finally got around to investigating the source. It seems when someone replaced the rebuilt drive motors, they reused the old cracked crusty O Rings used to seal between the 4" thick block that splits the inlet hoses to the motor. I popped off the 4 nuts and loosened the block, cleaned out the old O rings and replaced them with new. Still leaked... tried different O rings in case I guessed wrong... still leaks, tried a 3rd time... same issue.

I'm pretty sure the block is a pilot valve of some sort. The only real way to remove it is to remove the hydraulic hoses and pilot hoses, and they will be a bugger to replace. Anyone have an idea of the appropriatte sized O Ring? What I have seems to match, and fit the groove, but it's possible the last mechanic used the wrong O Ring in the first place. It's starting to get annoying.

While were at it, does anyone have a video of a quick way to unload a log trailer with a live heel loader. My setup must be wrong, since I have to balance the logs to unload them from the center, or use the tops to swing them around, and occasionally they snap off and create mayhem. There must be a way to grab the butt, and somehow manipulate the log to get the heel on it.

Thanks,

Stu
Stuart Caruk
Wood-Mizer LX450 Diesel w/ debarker, Woodmizer twin blade edger, Barko 450 log loader, Clark 666 Grapple Skidder w/ 200' of mainline. Bobcats and forklifts.

Offline Riwaka

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2017, 10:48:51 pm »
Even 'o' rings that are supposed to be the same size can differ when they are supplied from different manufacturers.
There are online catalogues of the different 'o' ring sizes, otherwise you might need to go and find a 3d printer with some elastomer material.

How old is the Barko, it is likely to be slow compared to something fresh from the factory. Barko loader unloading. Loader position - behind the log truck and using the live heel.
  Barko 550 log loader

The big Madill 3800 log loader with a butt and top grapple.



Offline teakwood

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2017, 07:57:12 am »
Wow. the first vid. that's painfully slow!

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2017, 10:57:54 am »
Well, running it at idle will do that for ya.

Offline millwright

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2017, 03:09:16 pm »
The guy on the Barko must be getting paid by the hour.

Offline lopet

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2017, 07:30:59 pm »
To me it looks like he's just warming it up. Sounds like it's idling. 
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
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Offline Stuart Caruk

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2017, 11:21:20 pm »
O/K, so finally pulled the block off. Turns out there is another case drain line and the O Ring was cracked. Also found a brazed up hydraulic fitting on a very hard to get to hose, so it will wait until monday when I can get a new hose, before putting it back together.

Turns out that what I thought was a piloted valve block is... sort of. It's a 2 speed block. The real question now is... where do they hide the 2 speed travel control? It's either electric or mechanical, but short of pulling hoses to peek it's got to go to the cab somewhere. Anyone that drives a Barko no where to find it?
 
Stuart Caruk
Wood-Mizer LX450 Diesel w/ debarker, Woodmizer twin blade edger, Barko 450 log loader, Clark 666 Grapple Skidder w/ 200' of mainline. Bobcats and forklifts.

Offline Stuart Caruk

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2017, 06:48:39 am »
Well, I've proven once again that there's never time to do it right, but always time to do it over. After the 3rd try this sucker still leaked, so Carl pulled the entire block off. Here's a cool picture of what we found.





This is the hydraulic drive motor side of this block that connects the 2 hydraulic bulkhead fittings on the inlet side, as well as a case drain. It clearly contains a valve with a pilot line going to either side of the valve. I had thought it was some type of proportional flow control, but now I'm pretty sure it's a 2 speed block. I just have no idea what activates it inside the cab.... yet.

All 3 holes have the castings busted out around the O Rings. The tube fitting has a hunk missing that's allowing the fluid to simply shoot up beside the tube. Here's a picture of the inlet side of the block.



So far no luck in finding a part, and I need this to run. So, Carl grabbed a hunk of plate, threw it in the mill and faced off both sides. He added an O ring groove to plug the leak on the Tube fitting, and drilled and tapped a small hole to secure this plate in place. The other end will get squished between  the mounting bolts. He made a new O Ring Groove for the tube in this plate, and will add a couple more face grooves to allow the fittings to seal.




Personally I'd have contoured the plate to match the casting, but he's a get it done kind of guy, worry about pretty later, and since he's doing the work, I'm not going to complain. I'm just glad he's around. He's a handy dude.

Hopefully this will work. If anyone knows the function of this block, or where it's control is, I'd love to know.
Stuart Caruk
Wood-Mizer LX450 Diesel w/ debarker, Woodmizer twin blade edger, Barko 450 log loader, Clark 666 Grapple Skidder w/ 200' of mainline. Bobcats and forklifts.

Offline GRANITEstateMP

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2017, 09:02:13 am »
Stuart,

  I'd say you got yourself a pretty handy helper in Carl!  If you can't find it make it!
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Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2017, 10:42:25 am »
Why not just flycut the block itself and step in new oring registers?  Was it too thin?

Whats the black tube and why is it cracked?

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2017, 10:47:40 am »
The hex plug in the left hand side with some kinda spool in the bore.. Is that a spring type relief? Or a solenoid of some sort?  Show some other angles so we can figure out what this thing is.  Cracking  like that screams over pressure to me.  And therefore fixing this part without remedying the cause will just explode your next weak link.. Maybe get someone hurt. 

Have there been any hydraulic mods done?  Add on valves or relief valve tweaks?  Id want to get some gauges on there and see that im not exceeding my hoses thanks to some prior owners stack of washers under the relief valve spring making it coil bind.

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2017, 10:54:58 am »
Its hard .. No actually its impossible to look at one part of a seriously complicated hydraulic system and tell anyone what it does.. So without seeing where plumbing comes from and goes to.. None of us who havent worked on one in the past are going to get very far.


Are you sure that isnt a hydraulic park valve instead of a 2 speed travel?   If the A and B ports are blocked you cant roll without springing a leak.  Like a pilot actuated load check basically

Offline lopet

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2017, 08:25:15 pm »
Yup, Carl is a keeper, you better take could care of him. 8)
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

Offline Stuart Caruk

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2017, 04:10:08 am »
If you look closely at the picture above, the tube isn't cracked, the casting has a tiny hunk busted off. Just enough for the fluid to squirt up between the machined casting and the OD of the O ring. The new plate is all made and installed. Fired it up with no leaks. Sadly Carls heading back to Saskatchewan Sunday. On the plus side, he's leaving a bunch of stuff here, so I suspect he'll be back. He wants to play around on my new LX450, which is delayed even longer now I hear... sigh...
Stuart Caruk
Wood-Mizer LX450 Diesel w/ debarker, Woodmizer twin blade edger, Barko 450 log loader, Clark 666 Grapple Skidder w/ 200' of mainline. Bobcats and forklifts.

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2017, 07:23:27 am »
I saw the edges blown off the o-ring registers but also looked like a crack in the pic showing the tube fitment.  Maybe it was just paint playing tricks.

Is there a chance that this solenoid spool in that block is a tow valve?  If you allow fluid to circulate through the A and B ports of a motor, itll facilialtate free wheeling.  I have heard of some excavator having a "neutral" of sorts from a buddy who does equipment moves, and its also common to incorporate such a bypass in hydrostatic tractors for repair towing.  Bobcats have you pull out the "tow valves" which is a pain.

Offline Riwaka

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2017, 03:46:11 pm »
Was the make and model of hydraulic control valve identified or in records?

Offline Stuart Caruk

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2017, 05:25:52 pm »
Well I found that it really is a direction control valve, used to control the track rotation from the piloted steering valve. Sadly, after making the plate and putting it all back together there is still a very small tiny leak. Time to either replace the spool valve block or make another one. Is there such a thing as a place that has a Barko boneyard or used parts, or where do people go for decent prices on new parts?
Stuart Caruk
Wood-Mizer LX450 Diesel w/ debarker, Woodmizer twin blade edger, Barko 450 log loader, Clark 666 Grapple Skidder w/ 200' of mainline. Bobcats and forklifts.

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2017, 12:30:31 am »
where do people go for decent prices on new parts?

LoL.  They go to church.. To pray for the dealer to be merciful on them!

Offline Stuart Caruk

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2017, 02:16:46 am »
Got that covered then... still hoping to find some used parts.

I find myself in the same situation I used to find my customers in Aviation in. They would go buy a Cessna Centurion, pressurized even at a great deal. Like around $200k for a $600k new aircraft. Only problem is when maintaining it, they were still maintaining a $600k aircraft.

My Barko has served me well, but I guess now it's time to fix it, and it's going to be more than a $13,500 loader.... Yes, I got a good deal.
Stuart Caruk
Wood-Mizer LX450 Diesel w/ debarker, Woodmizer twin blade edger, Barko 450 log loader, Clark 666 Grapple Skidder w/ 200' of mainline. Bobcats and forklifts.

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Barko 450 Log loader hydraulic leak...
« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2017, 08:00:29 am »
Therein lies the rub.