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Author Topic: Wood Processor on the Slide  (Read 3463 times)

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Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #40 on: September 24, 2017, 08:55:06 am »
I ran the processor for about one year with idler rollers on the front of the infeed path.  I also used a winch mounted on the saw frame to drag in stubborn logs.  Although this method worked it was definitely cumbersome and time consuming.  I had a source of potential power at the end of the belt drive.  All I needed to do was to connect a chain to the shaft and "borrow" some its power to drive live pulleys.  This modification was a valuable change to the design overall.  It became apparent that as much of the transfer system as possible must work with powered drives in order to work seamlessly with stubborn logs.  The live rollers were custom homemade.  I cut out 10 gauge metal sheets and welded them around a 1" bar.  See Pics 40 and 41.



      

Pic 40

 

 

Pic 41

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Offline dave_dj1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #41 on: September 25, 2017, 06:35:12 am »
That looks like an awesome upgrade  8)
I would do something similar if I ever build one.

Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2017, 12:53:58 pm »
The hydraulic circuit was originally designed based on the requirements of single draw power.  In other words; the losses of the circular saw were not considered as a draw on the engine since the pump loading and the saw loading would take place independently.  This assumption was based on the fact that gravity could drive the saw into the log. 
In general the system works as designed.  It is very fuel-efficient.  2 tanks per day (14 qts over 8hrs) It does however seem to feel a little under-powered at 15 hp especially when the blade gets dull.  :'(.  The blade has lasted quite long between sharpenings (over 6 months between changes).
The hydraulic circuit temperature has not been measured yet but so far has not suffered any damage from heat.  There is no heat exchanger installed but steel lines were used on 90% of the piping connections for heat flow purposes.  The pump gets too hot to hold a hand on and the tank gets hot to the hand.  It is definitely a potential issue.  I have a tank level indicator that also shows temperature. It will be installed soon - until then I will take care from prolonged usage in hot weather.
A filter module was included and a 7th valve line requirement (for a live deck) has been accomplished by a pair of 12V switched valves.

See Pics 42,43,44



    

Pic 42

 

        

Pic 43

 

 

Pic 44
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Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #43 on: September 26, 2017, 12:54:32 pm »
The belt feed conveyor worked better than I had originally imagined.  In the end I would have liked it to be longer than the 10' belt length (which resulted in the live roller conversions).  There was only a single issue with the construction that was noted over time. 
Directly over the log clamp the thin material of the original belt frame was crushed under the extra load.  The belt was removed and a thicker section of 1/8" sheet was added for strength.  The circular saw requires a healthy log clamp and this extra capacity is a requirement.
The belt works well for the logs and slabs alike.  An extra horizontal surface was added at the front of the processor to allow for loose slab material and bent logs to sit on if needed.  See Pics 45 and 46.

 

        

Pic 45

 

 

Pic 46
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Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #44 on: September 28, 2017, 11:50:13 am »
The sliding frame is supported by 4 adjustable load runners on 1" welded bar on top and 4 standard load runners on the bottom .  It has worked well since the first tests and remains in good functioning order.  I added some redundancy to the bracing (in case the angles on the frame ever became weakened and were to let go).  In general this system is very stable and  makes for accurate cuts.  There may be a long term need to limit the loading on this assembly with pressure relief valves on the lever arm cylinder and the sliding frame cylinder.  The assembly setup is shown in Pics 47, 48, and 49.

 

 

Pic 47

 

 

Pic 48

       

 

Pic 49
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Offline hedgerow

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #45 on: September 29, 2017, 09:15:19 am »
Nice looking setup. I am surprised the single belt pulley set up has lasted. When I built my buzz saw I tried running one belt in the beginning and with a 15 Hp engine and a 36 inch blade it liked to eat up belts. I switched  to a double pulley belt set up and haven changed belts in years now.

Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #46 on: September 29, 2017, 02:52:36 pm »
Hi hedgerow:
Funny you should mention that.  I had originally started with two belts in both belt positions - but then I installed a single belt clutch on the engine and had it work fine with only one belt running there.  I then tried a single belt on the final drive for the saw and it also worked fine.  I have been running them this way for about 2 years on the same 2 belts.  They look like they need to be replaced now - but that is not too bad all things considered.  I also have no spring for slack - the belts are tensioned tight- I should install a spring lever pulley to allow for slack  On a side note - I intend to try to run a 20 hp twin to see how much difference some extra power will make to the saw performance, I may then be entering back into the double belt territory.   
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Offline dave_dj1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #47 on: September 29, 2017, 03:42:19 pm »
Got any pictures or video of it with some real wood on it? Those little pecker poles are no challenge! LOL

Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #48 on: September 29, 2017, 09:11:07 pm »
Got any pictures or video of it with some real wood on it? Those little pecker poles are no challenge! LOL

Hi dave_dj1:

I have been shooting video - still need to compile some of it.  I have done some big wood.

 

 

The machine is quite slow with the big stuff - but it still cuts it.  I have a 20 hp engine sitting on the bench ready to try out to address this issue. 

I have also been adding guards and safety devices.  I want to get these figured out before I release alot of info on the machine.  So far I have a working brake that is activated by the release of a hold to run switch.  At the same time the brake is activated the throttle is electrically switched to idle.  This was a required change since accessing the splitter bay is a necessary ability based on the crooked logs I cut.  (Lots of fresh ash around here).  I also added a big guard with 1/2" bullet proof plastic.  You can see the brake and the guard in the photo.   
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Offline dave_dj1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #49 on: September 30, 2017, 09:22:49 am »
I love it, looking forward to the video.  8)

Offline Ox

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #50 on: September 30, 2017, 11:01:19 am »
 :P :)
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #51 on: October 02, 2017, 12:28:30 pm »
A video of the basic operation.



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Offline dave_dj1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #52 on: October 02, 2017, 05:09:22 pm »
Awesome, you should be proud  8)
Get yourself a stool and relax while the machine is doing the work.

Offline Bradm

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #53 on: October 02, 2017, 06:03:10 pm »
Interesting concept on the build and I think I see a few spots directly related to your blade where you can pick up some more efficiency.

First, change the tooth top geometry from the triple chip that it appears to have (it looks like this is a 72 or 80 tooth truss and component saw blade) to an ATB (alternating top) with a nail cutter grade.  You will dull up faster but should have less carbide damage overall resulting in longer term savings.

Second, increase the side clearance on the blade from the 0.022" (quite standard on a truss blade) to .045".  This will reduce rubbing and binding, from the both the log and the cut round, on the steel plate of the blade freeing up HP and maintaining RPMs.

Third, get the blade tensioned for the RPM the machine runs at.  It appeared that the blade had some wobble to it and I thought it sounded like it was "chopping the air" a bit.  The sound was hard to hear though as the background music masked the cutting/idling sounds.  Any chance you could post a video without the music?

And fourth, though not overly critical, drop the tooth count to about 60 teeth.  This will give you a slightly bigger gullet to handle more sawdust load.

Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #54 on: October 02, 2017, 08:47:55 pm »
Awesome, you should be proud  8)
Get yourself a stool and relax while the machine is doing the work.

I have been throwing around the idea of a chair - seems like a very good idea. smiley_idea 
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Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #55 on: October 02, 2017, 09:08:14 pm »
Interesting concept on the build and I think I see a few spots directly related to your blade where you can pick up some more efficiency.

First, change the tooth top geometry from the triple chip that it appears to have (it looks like this is a 72 or 80 tooth truss and component saw blade) to an ATB (alternating top) with a nail cutter grade.  You will dull up faster but should have less carbide damage overall resulting in longer term savings.

Second, increase the side clearance on the blade from the 0.022" (quite standard on a truss blade) to .045".  This will reduce rubbing and binding, from the both the log and the cut round, on the steel plate of the blade freeing up HP and maintaining RPMs.

Third, get the blade tensioned for the RPM the machine runs at.  It appeared that the blade had some wobble to it and I thought it sounded like it was "chopping the air" a bit.  The sound was hard to hear though as the background music masked the cutting/idling sounds.  Any chance you could post a video without the music?

And fourth, though not overly critical, drop the tooth count to about 60 teeth.  This will give you a slightly bigger gullet to handle more sawdust load.

Thanks Bradm:
I appreciate your comments - I will look more into this.  The machine does need some service in general.  The load runners are hopping abit right now on the slide and the saw drive belts need replacement.  (I took them off tonight).  I believe this blade is running pretty smooth - I will look at another non-music video for you to hear the sound.  It may be running a little slow with this engine - I need to check the RPM again (I messed around with the engine speed - there is only on or idle setting) - Ill confirm that later this week.    Thanks for your write up - definitely interested in as much improvement as possible.  I have several spare blades to try out different sets on.   The blades are XL 4000 28" Panel blades.  I believe they are 60 teeth - Ill confirm.
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Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #56 on: October 03, 2017, 10:40:33 am »
Hi Bradm:
Here is the no music version:



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Offline Bradm

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #57 on: October 04, 2017, 06:04:16 pm »
Thanks for the video without the music but I think my ears were playing tricks on me.  What I thought was a chop was more from the blade bogging down than anything else.

If you don't mind sharing, where in Ontario are you?

Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #58 on: October 05, 2017, 11:03:52 am »
Hi Bradm:

I am just north of Guelph.

The blade has 72 Teeth my mistake.  XL 4000 part #L52M68072-40.

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Offline jmur1

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Re: Wood Processor on the Slide
« Reply #59 on: October 16, 2017, 11:37:04 am »
I am now working on a sliding tray insert for the slab saw.  I will have an update shortly.

 

 
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