Archive




TimberKing Sawmills



Please visit this sponsor

The Largest Inventory of Used Chainsaw Parts in the World

Toll Free 1-800-582-0470

LogRite Tools


Forest Products Industry Insurance

Norwood Industries Inc.

Sawmill & Woodlot Magazine



Wood Processing equpment. Splitters, Processors, Conveyors

Your source for Portable Sawmills, Edgers, Resaws, Sharpeners, Setters, Bandsaw Blades and Sawmill Parts

EZ Boardwalk Sawmills. More Saw For Less Money!

STIHLDealers.com sponsored by Northeast STIHL

Woodland Sawmills

Margeson Insurance

Peterson Swingmills

Pacforest Supply Company

Forestry Forum Tool Box

Author Topic: energy from Horse Manure  (Read 2006 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online D L Bahler

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
  • Age: 2010
  • Location: Central Indiana - Berner Mitteland
  • Gender: Male
  • Hopp Schwyz!
    • Traditional Swiss Carpentry
energy from Horse Manure
« on: March 28, 2013, 05:16:06 pm »
we have a decent sized horse farm, with12 horses right now which is actually lower than we have been. these are good sized horses weighing in at an average of 1200 pounds each and usually around 15 to 15.5 hands in height. so they put off a lot of manure. just the 7 in our box stalls make more manure than is eaasy to handle.
we are also in the process of starting a cheese business (not horse milk! no!) and will be adding up to  a dozen milk cows in the mix in the next year or two. so, there will be even more poop... all of our waste right now is solid, we dont put it into a pit.
im looking at the options of using these waste to generate energy. our cheese house itself will not have any electricity, and we want to be as off grid as we can be. this means low energy consumption first of all, and then alternatvive options ofor what power we do need.
so the question here is, what are some possibilities of a manure/biomass fuel source
we have options as simple as making a huge pile and running circulating pipes to draw off heat, to complex ideas like building a modest digester to produce methane or even more complex fuels. then there is also the option of running a biomass furnace powered by dried manure -horse manure has a high solids content , and super high nitrogen. this means it burns good when dry.
so id like to see what some of yall can come up with. personally, i prefer a biomass furnace powered by horse poop and other farm wastes. i thin k a digester might mean too much money and too much headache.

Offline Ron Wenrich

  • Forester
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11331
  • Age: 65
  • Location: Jonestown, PA
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2013, 06:37:13 am »
I don't think you have enough livestock for a digester.  I saw where it needed about 150 head of cattle to become feasible for all your electric needs.  If you wanted to just use the methane for heat or a lower amount of electricity, than you could construct some smaller digesters to use.  I know the local dump was making electricity from methane to run a diesel genset.  Lower volume of methane would result in a lower amount of electric generation.

Burning involves drying.  Again, if you're looking at heat, you could pile it up, and run those circulators like you described, then burn.  But, you won't be getting electricity off the mounding process.  I don't know how much you can get from the burning to make electricity. 

The only thing I know about wood biomass is that an annual capacity of 10,000 tons is needed for 1 Meg of electricity.  That converts to 10 tons of wood per kilowatt.  You would have to know what your electricity needs are going to be, then see if you can match that to your output.  Start from the demand side of your equation to work back to see if you can match that with your supply.

 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline wesdor

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 569
  • Location: western Illinois
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2013, 08:51:35 am »
Several years ago a friend lived in Orange City, Iowa.  He introduced us to some farmers that digested manure and captured the methane,  if I recall correctly, they had converted a tractor to run on methane.  At the time I thought this was a process used by a lot of farmers in the area.

You might want to check out that area and see if it is still happening.  Or better yet, maybe we have a member in that area that can give us some additional information

Offline mad murdock

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
  • Age: 49
  • Location: NW OREGON Near Carlton.
  • Gender: Male
  • The woods is the best "office"!
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2013, 10:30:05 am »
I know of dairies in Wisconsin that use the animal waste to produce methane as well. I think that a methane production for energy will cost less than any other type of energy use from manure. When the manure is broken down by the bacteria and ready to cycle fresh manure, the old stuff is ready to use as fertilizer.
'64 Garrett 15A, Granberg Alaskan III, Logosol Timberjigg, Husky 372XP, McCulloch 10-10 auto, Poulan wild thing, Stihl 075, Mac 10-10A(x5),7-10A, PM700, SP81E, JD AMT626, Plus more toys

Offline Paul_H

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6217
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Enderby,BC
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2013, 10:31:00 am »
Quote
That converts to 10 tons of wood per kilowatt.

Ron,
is this to produce a kilowatt hour or a constant kilowatt for a year? My truck will drive .6 miles per pound of wood so I'm wondering what those numbers mean.
eg  tregar  meste  på  Tulla, for  ho  var  krulla  i  ulla.

Offline Al_Smith

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 7656
  • Location: Northwestern Ohio in the center of a giant corn field
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2013, 06:55:52 pm »
I have no idea how much methane you could get out of it but well composted horse manure makes wonderfull fertilizer for the garden .

That is provide they were bedded with wheat straw .I'm not so certain sawdust bedding would work so well .

Online thecfarm

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 17849
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Chesterville,Maine
  • Gender: Male
  • If I don't do it,it don't get done
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2013, 08:19:36 pm »
No, sawdust,shavings does not work the best unless it is composted quite well. When I had a truck I was using it for mulch around my lilacs and some other bushes.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Offline Ron Wenrich

  • Forester
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11331
  • Age: 65
  • Location: Jonestown, PA
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2013, 05:56:33 pm »
Paul

That's the rule of thumb for a continuous production for a year.  But, that's for boiling water and making steam to make electricity.  Has to do with btu/lb

I don't know what the trade off would be for gasification.  You're working on wood gas, if I recall.  I believe that's destructive distillation. 

Does your mileage vary by species?
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline Paul_H

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6217
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Enderby,BC
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2013, 07:14:48 pm »
I can't say there is a noticable difference in power but Birch is denser than Fir so there should be more miles per bunker full in the truck.
eg  tregar  meste  på  Tulla, for  ho  var  krulla  i  ulla.

Offline mesquite buckeye

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3512
  • Age: 62
  • Location: Tucson, AZ
  • Gender: Male
  • Trees are good- even ones with stickers
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2013, 08:07:38 pm »
When is this thread turning to food? ;D
Manage 80 acre tree farm in central Missouri and Mesquite timber and about a gozillion saguaros in Arizona.

Online D L Bahler

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
  • Age: 2010
  • Location: Central Indiana - Berner Mitteland
  • Gender: Male
  • Hopp Schwyz!
    • Traditional Swiss Carpentry
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2013, 09:31:47 pm »
we always use horse manure with shavings on our garden


and it makes some mean tomatoes

Offline muddstopper

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 279
  • Location: Western NC
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2013, 09:35:44 pm »
When is this thread turning to food? ;D

Now just because this thread started out talking about horses, it doesnt mean we are all going to Burger King for a whopper

Offline John Mc

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2538
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Monkton, Vermont
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #12 on: April 01, 2013, 11:30:48 am »
Several farms in Vermont are using digesters to produce methane and burn that to generate electricity.  Here's a link to the Blue Spruce Farm's page on their "Cow Power".  One of the links from this page mentions that a single cow produces enough manure to light two 100 Watt bulbs for 24 hours a day. This equates to 144 kWh per month.  I'm not sure how many cows you'd need to generate enough economies of scale to make it worth investing in the equipment.  I've not seen a residential-scale digester.
 
Small time fire-wooder in a neighborhood cooperative.

If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Offline Al_Smith

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 7656
  • Location: Northwestern Ohio in the center of a giant corn field
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #13 on: April 01, 2013, 07:37:57 pm »
There might be some merit to wood chips and tomatoes .As a matter of fact the last two years I've set out about a half dozen in one section of my wifes raised bed flower garden which is heavily mulched with hardwood shavings .Those things will grow an easy ten feet tall .

Fact they do better than in the regular garden .Beef steak tomatoes the size of soft balls .I can only assume it's from the acidity .

Offline Ron Wenrich

  • Forester
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11331
  • Age: 65
  • Location: Jonestown, PA
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2013, 04:51:56 am »
It could have to do with soil aeration.  Normally, decomposition robs the soil of nitrogen.  I know one guy that had mulch made from particleboard, and the extra urea in the mix caused the tomatoes to take off. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline Al_Smith

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 7656
  • Location: Northwestern Ohio in the center of a giant corn field
  • Gender: Male
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #15 on: April 03, 2013, 08:23:26 pm »
Well giant tomatoes or hardwood mulch aside I doubt seriously if a bunch of horse manure would make up much energy in terms of generated  gas ,methane or whatever .

Might do better to spread  on the hay field to grow green grass to feed the horses as to spend a kings ransom to light a half dozen light bulbs just to be not paying the power company .Not to mention blowing both youself and the equines into the next county if the gas got loose .

That horse stuff can be rather deadly if not handled right

Offline Radar67

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3912
  • Age: 148
  • Location: Collins/Seminary, MS
  • Gender: Male
  • Cuttin Wood Now For My House Later.
    • Stewart Photography
Re: energy from Horse Manure
« Reply #16 on: April 04, 2013, 12:09:44 pm »
all of our waste right now is solid,

Did you mean to say sold here? If so, have you considered continuing to sell the manure and using the money to install a wind or solar system to produce your energy?
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J