Sierra Club way off base in lawsuit to halt aspen

[Jeff]

What da ya think about this? Only had written permission to publish this on the MFRA site so I should just link to it there.

Click here

[timberbeast]

I still can't figure out why certain groups of humans cannot understand that they are part of the natural cycle of flora and fauna.  For a supposedly knowledgeable group,  they sure are filled with major inconsistencies and contradictions.

[Tom]

I find it hilariously amusing that the management of trees has produced more deer which has caused more deer/auto collisions.

Just ask a proud auto salesman how many more cars are being sold today as compared to 1950.   I'd like to see those figures too.  Why, if the sale of automobiles were curtailed,  then the deer/auto collisions would decrease.  I'll bet that if there were only one vehicle on the road,  the chance of it's being involved in one of these collisions would be practically nil.

Of course, if it's the management that is in question, then it must be the State Highway Patrol's fault because they are the ones that are supposed to be controlling the automobiles.

[CHARLIE]

OK...let me get serious here. It is a well known fact that aspen is the favorite tree for beavers to chew on. So it is the beaver that is responsible for the overpopulation of deer. I'm going to write my congressman and the Minnesota DNR and request that we start eradicating the beaver. Another thing those "Evironmentalist Whackos" don't understand is that it is not deer overpopulation that is causing their collision with motor vehicles. It is the stupidity of the the deer. Here in Minnesota, the DNR has found (after an extensive study)  that the whitetail deer have seen Mule deer riding on the fenders of cars coming back from Colorado. They think that's cool and beats the hell out of walking. So they are just trying to jump on the fenders of cars passing by so they can catch a ride.  Just deer stupidity.   So if we eradicate the beaver, we'll have more short lived aspen trees and less deer. DOWN WITH THE BEAVER!!!!!

I think the Sierra Club needs more Sawyers, Loggers and Foresters as members and as officers.

[psychotic1]

My 2 cents:

It seems to me that most of these groups have gotten themselves to the point of being a mini bureaucracy of their very own.  So in order for the high-salary people at the top to justify all the donations the millions of deluded and ignorant (ignorant, not stupid) people on their roles, they have to file lawsuits and give press releases and make a big noise.  Just because that noise is all clash and bang with no melody or lyrics doesn't matter, just as long as it's loud enough..   Thanx for letting me sound off.

bruce

[Ron Wenrich]

A frivolous lawsuit, but, as long as they have filed suit, hasn't all actions stopped?  They win!  It only cost them a few bucks to file suit, but they can control the management activity.

Until somebody can come along and knock the financial wind out of their sails, they will continue to set policy via the courtroom.  Some they will win, some they will lose.  But, they have the control, not us or the USFS.

I spoke to one of these enviro types.  Their intent is to shut down the USFS, then move on to the state level.  After that, they would go after the private landowner.  Scary thought.

[swampwhiteoak]

Sierra Club, gosh don't get me started :-/

The Sac-bee did a great set of articles on enviro groups and the Sierra Club is mentioned many times.  You can read the articles here.
http://www.sovereignty.net/p/ngo/sac-1.html
http://www.sovereignty.net/p/ngo/sac-2.html
http://www.sovereignty.net/p/ngo/sac-3.html
http://www.sovereignty.net/p/ngo/sac-4.html
http://www.sovereignty.net/p/ngo/sac-5.html

Lawsuits like this one are featured prominetly in article 3.

They are about two things, getting donations and promoting a neo-socialist ideology.  It is truly sad that most of the population assumes that this group is doing good things in the interest of the public.  

Posted by Ron W

Their intent is to shut down the USFS, then move on to the state level.  After that, they would go after the private landowner.

You couldn't be any more right.  It is sad because I consider myself very environmentally conscious, that is one of the reasons I got into forestry in the first place.  But reality left these groups a long time ago.  It seems they forgot what renewable resource means.

[Ron Scott]

Ron is correct. The Sierra Club has an objective to close timber management on National Forest system lands. Just look at the "downfall" in timber management on the 3 Michigan National Forests.

They have a desire to establish the "Great North Wilderness" here in the Lake States. Stopping the harvest of aspen and timber salvage sales will be a good start following the "below cost timber" issue of National Forest timber sales.

As a side note: Joseph Scarnati (R), a Pennsylvania state senator representing counties around the Allegheny National Forest, has introduced an ecoterrorism bill that aims to make environmentalists pay for damages to timber companies whose business is interrupted by protests. Environmentalists say the bill is a shallow attempt to intimidate them by aligning legitimate protestors as terrorists.

 

[Ron Wenrich]

They tried to shut down logging in the Allegheny NF by saying the Indiana bat was being endangered.  Then, one of the law schools down around Pittsburgh signed on for free legal work.

It was found that most of the bats were living under bridges and in old mine shafts.  Case was thrown out, and logging was resumed, to the best of my knowledge.

[Ron Scott]

A 22 year old woman who climbed 150 feet up a tree to protest a timber sale fell and died from her injuries before rescuers could reach the remote site in the Mount Hood National Forest, Oregon.

The timber sale she apparently was protesting had been canceled three days before her death last Friday, and the protesters expected to leave the area within a week once the U.S. Forest Service had completed all paper work to its cancellation agreement..

This was after a 3 year protest of the Eagle Creek Timber Sale.

Tree sitters live in plywood platforms attached to the upper limbs of trees slated for logging. At least two others have fallen in the past year.

[Corley5]

What a bunch a morons .  I've yet to see a tree that was worth dying for.

[Frank_Pender]

If Measure 64 had passed in Oregon a couple of years ago, I would have been unable to cut about 80% of my timber due to this type of thinking.  The 80% is above the 24" DBH part of the issue and would have prevented the harvesting.  
 As to the closing of the Public forests by these Whackos, many folks do not realize that these forest lands provided $  resources of the local schools in many states and has caused havoc for many  school districts losing the timber tax benefits accrued from the harvesting.   So, it is not just the timber industry itself being affected.  There is definetely a trickle down affect right into the classroom of our future.  
 

[Paul_H]

It is very true about enviro groups trying to draft more Druids to fund their causes.Like the media ,they need to pull at heartstrings to loosen pursestrings.

What might have started out as a noble cause,became a source of a healthy salary.To be protected at all costs.Truth and common sense are the first to go

[Tillaway]

Well said Paul.  There are several enviromental publications originating in Mendocino county California that are both funny and frieghtening to read.  The one that is the most educational, as far as how environmental activists (tree sitters and ground support) think and how the groups act is called "The New Settler Interview".  This is a magazine that prints interviews they have with various folks active in this cause as well other "alternate" behaviors.

I have had the opprotunity to read many of them and it seems falling out of the trees is a common problem.  One that comes to mind is the one were "Byrd" coudn't fly.  It was a long article but I will try to give you the short version of one of the stories (not the one where he fell out of the tree) that I thought was funny.  Although I'm sure "Byrd" wouldn't think so.

High in the tops of the Redwoods of Humbolt county there was a "tree village".

All the tree village residents decided to leave the village and run into town for a few days.  It seems they were a little bored since Pacific Lumber Co (Palco) had been ignoring them lately so they thought it would be safe to leave.  Byrd and I will call her "sky", because I can't remeber her name, volunteered to stay and hold down the fort so to speak.  The next morning Palco shows up with their climbers and securtity people and proceed to climb the trees and tear out all the platforms, ropes, everything.  Being good tree sitters Byrd and Sky followed their training and locked themselves to the tree.  Sky stuck her arms in metal pipes that had chains runing through them and locked herself to the chains.  Only she had access to the locks and chains preventing the Palco climbers from removing her so, they left her on the platform.  Byrd on the other hand bolted for the very top of the tree with a Kryptonite bike lock.  He climbed far enough up to be able to put the bike lock around his neck and the top of the tree.  This is a redwood mind you well over 200' tall.  Palco's climbers had no desire to go up that far, redwood is very brittle, and they were only there to remove the objects not the people.

After the Palco people left, Sky unlocks herself and is left on a platform with nothing but a jug of water and no way to get up or down.  Byrd on the other hand pulls the key to the lock from his pocket and proceeds to..... drop it. OOOPss Byrd is stuck locked by his neck to a tree top!  Sky can't climb down to hunt for the key.

Several hours later the village residents show up only to find the village is gone leaving only a few anguished calls for help coming from the tree tops.  The residents now have no way up so they dispatch some folks to find more climbing gear while the rest of them look for the key Byrd dropped.

Some climbing gear arrives the next day and Sky was rescued but they still haven't found the key yet and Byrd is still locked to the top.  They decided to cut the lock but they didn't have a hacksaw so someone was dispatched to town to get one.  This is when they found that you can't cut a Kryptonite lock with a hacksaw.  They tried all day as a matter of fact.  It was finally decided that they had to cut the top out of the tree.  This was a very big decision and took hours of soul searching and discussion to reach.  Since they had ruined all the hacksaw blades someone went to town to procure a saw to cut the tree top.  The tree top was only about 3 or 4 inches in diameter where Byrd could get the lock around the tree and his neck. The top was quickly severed and Byrd was free, the only problem was, he still could not get the lock off his neck.  He wore it around town for over a week before he found some one that would remove it.

[Ron Wenrich]

 

As my Dad used to say, If their brains were dynamite, they wouldn't have enough to clean the wax out of their ears.

[Paul_H]

Picturing that knucklehead wandering around town with a bike lock around his head,made me   right out loud.Then I thought,to him it was probably a badge of honour.To most of us,the shame,and humiliation would keep us out of sight for awhile(like a dog with a chicken tied round its neck)  

Most certainly a Byrd Brain

[Ron Scott]

Sierra Club Aspen Lawsuit Thrown Out of Court

A Federal District Court in Michigan recently handed forest wildlife and the Ruffed Grouse Society a major victory. On June 17th, the Court for the Western District of Michigan dismissed a lawsuit filed by the Sierra Club that called for a halt to the management of aspen habitats on National Forests in Michigan, Minnesota, and Wisconsin.

[BCCrouch]

Unfortunately, the tree-hugging, socialist, eco-freaks of the Sierra Club will be back again and again until we have 1) more judges willing to take a stand against unthinking preservationism; 2) a public willing to deny the Sierra Club funds from donations and memberships until they wise up; and 3) laws that preempt such legal harassment.

Ron Scott, you were in the USFS during its transformation from a proper resource agency to a preservationist plaything for the far left Greens, correct?  You saw things go to Hell in a handbasket, so what would it take to bring the USFS back in line with its proper mission of resource management?  My experience with the Huron-Manistee Friends of the Forest meetings while interning for MUCC convinced me that those bureaucrats had already made their plans and were simply going through the motions to satisfy the letter of the law.

[Ron Scott]

To name a few:

Initiate some firm Congressional direction, management discipline to follow direction, and retention of experienced professionals.

Put management of the resources ahead of politics and personal agendas.

Restore accountability in practices and unit costs.

[Paul_H]

Very well said Ron.The same,would work well in our neck of the woods.

[BCCrouch]

Ron,

Might you know the last year one of our national forests in Michigan actually met their production goal?  I believe it was back in the 1980s, but don't quote me on that.

[Ron Scott]

About 1986. I don't believe they even have production goals anymore. At least none that their management is accountable for like it use to be.

Production use to be a job performance item with budget accountability. I've been asking the Huron-Manistee National Forests for their Unit Costs since 1995. It still receives a deaf ear.

There is suppose to be a new accounting system one of these days. Taxpayers should be interested in knowing where their money is going and what it costs to do the National Forest management.

[BCCrouch]

That's what I thought.  Gifford Pinchot must be rolling over in his grave about now!