Author Topic: dissapointed with wm (Read 2134 times)

wlf89 · « **on:** January 29, 2012, 10:11:25 pm »

never tried a wood mizer, so had them send me a blade to try, would not cut out of the box.
had to sharpen it after 1st slab, green pine at that.

anyone evey get a blade like this??

Magicman · « **Reply #1 on:** January 29, 2012, 10:13:22 pm »

No sir I have not. Did you contact WM about it?

I also noticed that virtually every post that you have made you were complaining about blades breaking, etc. You may very well have a sawmill alignment issue.

cypresskayaksllc · « **Reply #2 on:** January 29, 2012, 10:14:31 pm »

Call WM. They will make it right

Jeff · « **Reply #3 on:** January 29, 2012, 10:18:54 pm »

Yea, I have, when I dropped it in the gravel when trying to open it. That would be my fault though.

So, the title of the topic, was that just to draw attention? Was it really warranted for one blade that may have been sharp but perhaps the wrong pitch or profile for the wood on the mill? Wood-Mizer is one of our great sponsors. They and the other companies on the left. They all deserve some consideration when you name a topic because with out them, the forum would not be here, you would not be able to ask for help from the thousands of years of combined experience here.

I hate to get on my soap box for such a new member, but this one kinda ground me the wrong way. You deserve every consideration when asking for help with a problem or an answer to something like why that blade would not cut right out of the box, and the forum sponsors deserve the same in return.

wlf89 · « **Reply #4 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:04:20 pm »

i have emailed them, will see what they say tommorow.

(quote)I hate to get on my soap box for such a new member, but this one kinda ground me the wrong way. You deserve every consideration when asking for help with a problem or an answer to something like why that blade would not cut right out of the box, and the forum sponsors deserve the same in return.

i talked to them before ordering, they told me what would be best for softer woods and sent me a blade.
pitch and every thing else was alright, just wuuld not cut.

just wondering if anyone has ever got one from them
or any one else that would not cut..

i just thought is was strange for a big name like them
to send a dull blade.

LeeB · « **Reply #5 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:07:51 pm »

Wouldn't cut at all, cut poorly, dip or rise, tell us what would not cut is describing.

wlf89 · « **Reply #6 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:12:48 pm »

i am 99% sure there is nothing wrong with the mill.
thats why i ordered a blade from a different company.
i have checked and triple checked, and set it up to the book.

Quote from: Magicman on January 29, 2012, 10:13:22 pm

No sir I have not. Did you contact WM about it?

I also noticed that virtually every post that you have made you were complaining about blades breaking, etc. You may very well have a sawmill alignment issue.

wlf89 · « **Reply #7 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:17:52 pm »

it would cut straight, just real slow. like it has cut 5 to 600 feet already. almost had to forse it through. after i sharpend it, it ziped right through.

\

Quote from: LeeB on January 29, 2012, 11:07:51 pm

Wouldn't cut at all, cut poorly, dip or rise, tell us what would not cut is describing.

Okrafarmer · « **Reply #8 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:21:55 pm »

Umm, not to be smart, but-- you wouldn't be the first one to put a blade on backward. I've done it before.

Did you check to make sure the teeth are going in the right direction? Sometimes the blades come from the manufacturer bound inside-out and you have to flip them right-side out to use them.

Okrafarmer · « **Reply #9 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:22:44 pm »

Oh, sorry, didn't see the last post. I guess that wasn't the problem....

wlf89 · « **Reply #10 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:25:05 pm »

no, that is just how i felt. like a bad first inpression.
but im sure they will make it right.

[quote author=Jeff link=topic=55862.msg808503#msg808503 date=1327893

So, the title of the topic, was that just to draw attention?

tyb525 · « **Reply #11 on:** January 29, 2012, 11:25:36 pm »

Maybe you got the wrong angle blade, and when you resharpened it you put it to the angle you usually use? Just a thought..

I've bought 30 blades from WM, 15- 10 degree, and 10-7 degree, and didn't have trouble with any of them.

ladylake · « **Reply #12 on:** January 30, 2012, 04:18:05 am »

Maybe you hit some dirt or a small rock right away, that's happened before. Steve

inspectorwoody · « **Reply #13 on:** January 30, 2012, 05:16:21 am »

I have an antique grinder but this is what it says in the manual.

"It is recommended that new blades be sharpened before using. When the blades are manufactured, they are sharpened and then set. The setting process twists the face angle out as much as 7 degrees. Sharpening a new blade with the face angle scale set at '0' will true up the face angle of all the teeth to 90 degrees. You should not have to grind any material from the gullet on the first sharpening."

Not sure if this same thing applies today with all the new technology but I'd like to think so and I'll do just what it says before I use a new one.

Chuck White · « **Reply #14 on:** January 30, 2012, 05:36:30 am »

Don't mean to step on any toes.

This really sounds like the blade was inverted. Right out of the box, wouldn't cut, then taken off and touched up, reinstalled, then it cut really good, who's to say how many times it was flipped!

I might be wrong but I feel just like what okrafarmer said in the beginning of his first post.

I have put a blade on backwards myself, but I noticed it when I was putting the covers on. I'm sure that was like a "test question" back when my FIL was sharpening blades for me!

Kansas · « **Reply #15 on:** January 30, 2012, 06:48:39 am »

I had to laugh when I read Jeff's post about the gravel. We used to have a guy work for us where his favorite method to uncoil a blade was to find a concrete pad and throw the coiled blade up into the air.

He doesn't work for us anymore.

I haven't cut a lot of pine, but not all pine is equal. Some is a lot harder than others. Might be they sent one hook angle, and then you sharpened to a more correct hook angle for what you were cutting. You may have also set it differently. First thing when we get blades, including WM, is oftentimes give them more set when we are cutting fuzzy cottonwood. I don't think any manufacturer sends out blades at 35 or 40 thousands per side.

kevinlt15 · « **Reply #16 on:** January 30, 2012, 06:54:18 am »

(QUOTE) This really sounds like the blade was inverted. Right out of the box, wouldn't cut, then taken off and touched up, reinstalled, then it cut really good, who's to say how many times it was flipped!

I will admit that I have done that

only when there is A bunch of onlookers and neibors watching

woodmizer is A great companygive them A call.

Buck · « **Reply #17 on:** January 30, 2012, 07:11:42 am »

Inside out is the only way I've ever had a blade not cut at all. Even my dull ones cut better than what the op described.

ladylake · « **Reply #18 on:** January 30, 2012, 07:27:21 am »

He made the first slab with the blade, no way would that get done with a blade on backwards. I'd bet on hitting some derbis. Steve

ladylake · « **Reply #19 on:** January 30, 2012, 07:30:40 am »

Quote from: inspectorwoody on January 30, 2012, 05:16:21 am

I have an antique grinder but this is what it says in the manual.

"It is recommended that new blades be sharpened before using. When the blades are manufactured, they are sharpened and then set. The setting process twists the face angle out as much as 7 degrees. Sharpening a new blade with the face angle scale set at '0' will true up the face angle of all the teeth to 90 degrees. You should not have to grind any material from the gullet on the first sharpening."

Not sure if this same thing applies today with all the new technology but I'd like to think so and I'll do just what it says before I use a new one.

Quite a few new blades are just stamped out then set but cut fine that way, some manufactors do sharpen thier new blades. Steve

POSTONLT40HD · « **Reply #20 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:03:29 am »

I can saw PINE with the "G-STRING" from my "GEETAR". It's hard to believe but I think there is an installation error some where.
DO NOT assume anything or make judgements just on one blade from ANY company. I do not know what kind of mill you have but if your mill is set up by the book as you say, DO NOT order 1 blade from WM.....order a whole box and go to work! You'll be impressed!

Cedarman · « **Reply #21 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:34:04 am »

I have been running a WM for 29 years. First LT 30 manual, second LT30 25HP electric, and for 8 years from 98 to 06 at our mill in AL a second 25HP electric. And a 2 head resaw since 92. And used WM blades on our resaw in AL. Put 10,000 hours on that one. Indiana resaw has over 20,000 hours, sawmills probably been run 35,000 hours total. For the vast majority of those hours we have run WM blades. We have used many thousands of blades. In all those years, only one time was there a blade problem out of the box and it involved blade stock that was crowned. Even then it would cut out of the box, but then ride as if the set was out of one side. The more the blades were used the worse they got. That was 10 or 15 years ago.

We have hit dirt or a small stone on first pass and make the blade go dull. Not WM's fault.
Anyone that has sawn with .035 blades back in 82 or 83 knows that the blades today are a dream to work with.

WM makes a very good blade.

Bibbyman · « **Reply #22 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:36:51 am »

Quote from: wlf89 on January 29, 2012, 11:04:20 pm

i have emailed them, will see what they say tommorow.

I would think it only common professional courtesy to talk with WM before posting here.

ladylake · « **Reply #23 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:40:29 am »

I wouldn't even post about 1 blade not cutting, sharpen it and go cut. Steve

ahlkey · « **Reply #24 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:48:46 am »

It is a fact that a single unsatisfied customer can send more business away from your company than 10 satisfied customers. I do not own a WM sawmill but find there company professional in every way and do buy their blades and own their sharpener. I believe where "top" companies shine is when something goes wrong ... be it the customers fault or the manufacturer....

Customer experiences with people, products, and processes will determine loyalty and studies prove that service can dramatically increase customer loyality when things go wrong and WM has proven itself time and time again in this respect!

What I found unfair is that you emailed WM after your problem while at the same time putting a thread on the forum that you were disappointed even before WM responded? Even you mentioned that you were sure WM would make it right.

LOGDOG · « **Reply #25 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:58:02 am »

19 years of milling, mostly with WM blades and I can't recall every having this happen to me. One thing I may have done differently than yourself wlf89, is not sharpen the blade. Leave it unaltered and send it back that way. This would let WM perhaps inspect the blade as near to it's original condition as it was sent out.

If it were me, I'd inspect the path the blade took looking for anything that may have dulled it. I'd take my magnifying glass and inspect the corner of the blade looking for the rounded, shiny corners on the tips of the teeth, I'd lay it in my setter and and run it around checking my set .... just ruling out certain things. Maybe you did all that. Not sure. Maybe you were in a crunch and didn't have any other blades on hand and needed to sharpen that blade just to get the job at hand done. I've been there too.

Don't let the experience with one free blade and an unknown cause of bad performance get you down.

Remember, it's not what happens to you in life, but how you react to it that makes all the difference.

Kansas · « **Reply #26 on:** January 30, 2012, 09:07:55 am »

I want to touch on something poston said. Its hard to get a fair assessment of blades with one blade. I used to go to shows and get a lot of single blades sent in from various companies. Murphy's law. You will hit something with that free blade. Or you don't get the blade configured to what you are cutting. When I was at the last Richmond show I told myself there was no way I was going to sign up for a free blade from all the blade people there. Turns out I did make one exception, and actually did discover a good blade that came from there. But generally speaking, you have to get in tune with the blade concerning hook angle, set, blade tension, etc., matching what you are cutting and your mill. You can't really do that with one blade. It takes a box to get that done.

wlf89 · « **Reply #27 on:** January 30, 2012, 09:52:29 am »

first of all, the blade was not coiled up, and turned right.

2. blade was on the right way, cut one slab.

3. i debark all logs. this one was as clean as can be.

4. when i sharpend the blade, i followed the blades
profile, witch was the same as all my other blades.

also if i had done somthing to the blade, it would have been my fault. i understand this.

it was just dull straight out of the box.

Bandmill Bandit · « **Reply #28 on:** January 30, 2012, 10:00:22 am »

Into my 5th box of blades and have had one blade that was set on one side but not the other. NEVER had a blade that wasn't sharp fresh out of the box.

I didnt even bother WM. I just set it went back to work.

IF it cut one slab how is that not cutting at all? I say there was something in that log that dulled the blade.

I have cut road side trees that had little rocks embedded a couple of inches deep in them from the flying gravel that must have stuck into the bark some years ago and grown into the tree. That dulls a blade pretty fast.

Bibbyman · « **Reply #29 on:** January 30, 2012, 12:45:50 pm »

Probably the first year we owned our first Wood-Mizer, we bought a box of blades from another company. The very first one broke at the weld. I called them up and they sent out another. We used the rest of the blades to death and none of the others broke at the weld. Go figure.

Al_Smith · « **Reply #30 on:** January 30, 2012, 01:00:25 pm »

For reasons unknown blade breakage at the weld just happens some times . I can only speak on the subject from the standpoint of metal cutting bands though .

isawlogs · « **Reply #31 on:** January 30, 2012, 01:26:57 pm »

Having been using WM blades now for 19 years on my mill, I have yet to get one that was dull out of the box. I have had a box of blades that had shiny points on them but that was not a factory error, it was a shipping/travelling/destationtion issue. That box of blades from the getgo was bound to see lots of country wich it did. Some how the postal code got a printing error to it and it went clear across to the pacific ocean , then went on to the atlantic ocean to cape breton then took hafl a dozen stops along the way before it got to Québec then it did another halfdozen towns/city's to finaly get to me three weeks after the order was put through. WM had another box shipped out to me after the first week had gone and I received those blades the next day. When the travelling blades arrived I called them about finaly receiving them and that is when we saw the postal code error. I told them about the shiny points on the blades told them I would be sending them back, they said no.. If I could sharpen them to keep them. I did and I did .

You may of gotten a dull blade from them, but I must saye that I think it is very highly unlikely that they did.
Why would they have shipped a dull blade to a pottential customer... !
Now if I had a choice of calling or sending an email ... I would be talking and not printing.

wlf89 · « **Reply #32 on:** January 30, 2012, 03:05:13 pm »

from wm

what were the problems that you were experiencing?

Well I am sorry it did not perform well for you. I cannot remember which sample I sent but maybe a profile more close to what you are currently using will work the best for you in your pine.

If it were hard wood I would have recommended a different profile. At least it did not cost you anything.

sparks · « **Reply #33 on:** January 30, 2012, 03:54:56 pm »

The last reply was kind of vague. Did we take care of the blade? I have a hard time believing our guys would say, "At least it didn't cost you anything."
We treat free blade customers no differently than those who buy blades all the time. If this was said it would be nice to know who it was so we don't have a he said she said conversation.

If the blade was not taken care of, email me your information and I'll take care of it.

Papa1stuff · « **Reply #34 on:** January 30, 2012, 04:39:25 pm »

I had a box of blades come that were packed wrong ,teeth to teeth ,which could of dulled them.
I called WM and they said to return them,but I said just give me an free sharpening cupon which they did. They also had me email the numbers from the bands.
They have always been very fair with me!! Great company!!

Ohio_Bill · « **Reply #35 on:** January 30, 2012, 05:02:54 pm »

I have to agree with Bibbyman . Calling or Emailing the company before posting would be the proper and courteous thing to do and if I am reading correctly it is a free sample blade . IMO you should never post a E mail that was sent to you . That is throwing a person or a company under the Bus .I recently had a problem with a company that is sponsor. I tried to work out the problem with the sales person and was not pleased with the results, so I Emailed the Company Owner he resolved the issue and I will continue to do business with them. I did not think it was appropriate to post any of those transactions. Thanks

Dave VH · « **Reply #36 on:** January 30, 2012, 06:39:33 pm »

when I first started, (a few weeks ago) I ordered 2 different kind of wm blades. One was good, the other not the best. Then I figured out that it had nothing to do with the blade. My saw was miles out of tune. Finally got all of that around and then the bigger double sharp was the way to go. I ended up ordering a box of 15. Very happy now. Every one of them comes reverse the way my saw cuts, oh well.

Buck · « **Reply #37 on:** January 30, 2012, 06:44:19 pm »

Well Dave, you missed a golden chance to post your disappointment. You just inverted them and rocked on.

POSTONLT40HD · « **Reply #38 on:** January 30, 2012, 07:39:38 pm »

DAVEVH, dis yooper got some inverted blades back in November. Dis yooper had hook Da mill up to Da tractor and pull it into Da opposite side of Da da sugar shack. Now Da blades cut in Da right direction. dis yooper've never had a problems with blades again!

LOGDOG · « **Reply #39 on:** January 30, 2012, 08:53:09 pm »

Is it Yooper night again?

Buck · « **Reply #40 on:** January 30, 2012, 09:10:17 pm »

MapleNut · « **Reply #41 on:** January 30, 2012, 09:18:25 pm »

Whats yooper nite? I'm one, ya know

Bandmill Bandit · « **Reply #42 on:** January 31, 2012, 12:07:51 am »

I learned something here today.

I have been using the double hard bands and have been wanting to try one of the silver tip and one of the Razor tip blades but didn't want to buy a whole box just to try them. I would like to try them BEFORE I order my next box of blades. Am I correct to say that I can ask for a trail blade?

The other thing I would need to know is will I be able to sharpen and set them with my CBN grinder and my "modified dual tooth" setter?

I ma cutting mostly Aspen and Birch right now and it would be very nice to cut a whole day with out a blade change. Am I being too optimistic here?

Thanks in advance for any advice on this topic.

Brucer · « **Reply #43 on:** January 31, 2012, 01:15:54 am »

I don't know about free blades, but Marv was always willing to break open a box and sell me two or three to try them out.

Meadows Miller · « **Reply #44 on:** January 31, 2012, 04:45:03 am »

Gday

Bandmill Bandit Its just the nature off the beast with bands i use to get about 2 to 3 changes per day cutting clean pine at between 800 and 1300 odd bft a day but i always pulled mine before they where too dull too I think its better to pull them early than to try pushing a saw thats lost its edge Mate

I was going to say You can go all day without changing the blade on a circular mill

Both styles have their pluses and jobs they shine on

Regards Chris

ladylake · « **Reply #45 on:** January 31, 2012, 05:09:20 am »

Quote from: Bandmill Bandit on January 31, 2012, 12:07:51 am

I learned something here today.

I have been using the double hard bands and have been wanting to try one of the silver tip and one of the Razor tip blades but didn't want to buy a whole box just to try them. I would like to try them BEFORE I order my next box of blades. Am I correct to say that I can ask for a trail blade?

The other thing I would need to know is will I be able to sharpen and set them with my CBN grinder and my "modified dual tooth" setter?

I ma cutting mostly Aspen and Birch right now and it would be very nice to cut a whole day with out a blade change. Am I being too optimistic here?

Thanks in advance for any advice on this topic.

Really depends on how many bf you cut in a day, 1000bf yes 1 blade might make it, 3000bf no way unless it's large beams. Steve

Meadows Miller · « **Reply #46 on:** January 31, 2012, 05:17:38 am »

There is so many variables in this game it keeps things interesting

MotorSeven · « **Reply #47 on:** January 31, 2012, 08:47:18 am »

Quote from: MapleNut on January 30, 2012, 09:18:25 pm

Whats yooper nite? I'm one, ya know

The site admin has a program that changes everything written into Yooper lingo and they pull it on us every now and then.

It's hard on this cajun to read Yooper, but after a few beers, not so bad

Raider Bill · « **Reply #48 on:** January 31, 2012, 09:12:58 am »

Quote from: MotorSeven on January 31, 2012, 08:47:18 am

Quote from: MapleNut on January 30, 2012, 09:18:25 pm
Whats yooper nite? I'm one, ya know

The site admin has a program that changes everything written into Yooper lingo and they pull it on us every now and then.

It's hard on this cajun to read Yooper, but after a few beers, not so bad

Couple more and you can speak it too.

Bandmill Bandit · « **Reply #49 on:** January 31, 2012, 10:04:30 am »

Really depends on how many bf you cut in a day, 1000bf yes 1 blade might make it, 3000bf no way unless it's large beams. Steve
[/quote]

I am cutting between 1200 an 1500 on 1 inch material and about 2000 to 2500 when cutting 2+ inch. I like to change my blades sooner rather than later. I find, like most others, that changing the band while it is still cutting "pretty good" adds more life to the band then just about any thing else, provided you are doing a proper job sharpening and setting.

I will have to call Marv.

Bibbyman · « **Reply #50 on:** January 31, 2012, 10:35:36 am »

Quote from: Bandmill Bandit on January 31, 2012, 12:07:51 am

The other thing I would need to know is will I be able to sharpen and set them with my CBN grinder and my "modified dual tooth" setter?

I've sharpened nothing but DoubleHards on our WM CBN sharpener. I've also sharpened the WN stellite blades. Didn't seem to have a bit of a problem. Don't know why you'd have problems with the setter on these blades. Other than I'm to to watch the Stellite blades and not try to set very much as you could break the tip off the tooth.

Bogue Chitto · « **Reply #51 on:** January 31, 2012, 04:14:30 pm »

If Wood Mizer has done you wrong believe me, they will make it right. I had a problem with a box of blades and they did more than they had to to make it right. They are a very good company with good employees. The customer definitely comes first with Wood mizer.

Five Star company!!!!!

Bandmill Bandit · « **Reply #52 on:** January 31, 2012, 08:54:12 pm »

Talked to Calan at Woodmizer west in BC and he recommended I go to the 042x1.25(I think I got that right) double hard for the frozen aspen and birch so that what I will be doing for the next box of blades.

First question Calan asked me was what are you trying to remedy? Cuts getting wavy in the wetter frozen logs and as the blade dulls too?

Answer was yes! He said the 1.25 would diminish that problem a lot if not eliminate it completely. Said he'd send one of the razor tips if I want one but he didn't think I would be happy with it for what I am cutting. Hes never put me into any thing that I didn't like yet so that be the way I will go.

Thanks for the pointer on the stellite Bibby. Will be careful on the setting if I do decide to get one of them to try.

timbuck2 · « **Reply #53 on:** January 31, 2012, 09:16:48 pm »

A long time ago I bought a box of blades from (no need to name names) and one was made up of about 4 or 5 pieces all welded together. Never bothered with them again.

isawlogs · « **Reply #54 on:** February 05, 2012, 09:53:26 am »

timbuck2
Now that blade you got that was made up of 4-5 peices, how did it saw? Did it break prematurely? Where you able to sharpen the blade.. Did you saw with it ??

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Author Topic: dissapointed with wm (Read 2134 times)