Author Topic: What type of log is this? (Read 2994 times)

1crowfarm · « **on:** January 12, 2012, 11:59:47 am »

I have a tree that I cut up into logs this morning only problem is I dont believe it is a Poplar tree at all but maybe a Ash but Iam not 100percent on that either.
I drug this log out of a pile of logs that where left behind from a pipeline ROW so I didnt see the tree standing . here are the pic

beenthere · « **Reply #1 on:** January 12, 2012, 12:07:41 pm »

Looks to me at first glance like a soft maple.

Bark doesn't look right in the last pic for soft maple, but pics are hard to get the "feel" of it.

Doesn't look like ash however.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #2 on:** January 12, 2012, 12:12:53 pm »

More pictures

1crowfarm · « **Reply #3 on:** January 12, 2012, 12:16:34 pm »

The last pic is of the stump cut and the other pic where the bark has kinda of a slightly smoother bark in places and a diiferent look are the third and fourth logs I cut one 16' log and two 12' logs and two 8' logs the top log being 14" on the small end and the stump cut being about 22" on the small end. So we are looking at a log that was almost 60' long and only 8" inches between the first log and the last log.
I know its not a pine log theres no sap

banksiana · « **Reply #4 on:** January 12, 2012, 12:55:53 pm »

What part of the world? Also, upland or lowland? Looks to me like red maple too, but I need more clues.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #5 on:** January 12, 2012, 01:03:16 pm »

Oh sorry about that Iam in South western PA The heart of hardwood country

Chuck White · « **Reply #6 on:** January 12, 2012, 02:51:27 pm »

The one with the smoother bark looks like it may be an upper log from an oak!

ely · « **Reply #7 on:** January 12, 2012, 03:02:11 pm »

pin oak i my guess.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #8 on:** January 12, 2012, 03:10:12 pm »

I cut all the logs in the picture from the same tree this morning

1crowfarm · « **Reply #9 on:** January 12, 2012, 03:13:51 pm »

Quote from: 1crowfarm on January 12, 2012, 03:10:12 pm

I cut all the logs in the picture from the same tree this morning

and it isnt a Oak I'd say its even a lighter log than a Poplar but close to same weight as a poplar

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #10 on:** January 12, 2012, 04:04:04 pm »

Basswood ain't it? Rougher on the but log, gets smoother on up.

Norm · « **Reply #11 on:** January 12, 2012, 04:05:22 pm »

Looks a lot like basswood to me too.

shelbycharger400 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 12, 2012, 04:33:59 pm »

im guessing basswood or cottonwood.. would need a picture of it cut apart to tell

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #13 on:** January 12, 2012, 04:48:16 pm »

The middle log in the second picture looks quite fibrous like basswood would be. You should be able to rip long strips of bark off. It's what they used to make rope from. I know the bark is kind of orangey when exposed.

bill m · « **Reply #14 on:** January 12, 2012, 05:04:17 pm »

Looks like Aspen or Cottonwood to me.

Jeff · « **Reply #15 on:** January 12, 2012, 05:16:01 pm »

Id say almost certainly aspen. That second photo, middle log of the log end with the knot showing on the cut end to me screams aspen,

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #16 on:** January 12, 2012, 05:43:16 pm »

Here's an upper log from a basswood in the barn. It's covered in dust. Has orange marking paint on the end grain there.

Our mature aspen have flattened ridges to the bark and they're around and 1" wide. Mature balm goes that way to.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #17 on:** January 12, 2012, 05:56:54 pm »

There's a strip of bark laying on top there about 3" wide and a couple limbs there to the right. The flashlight is shining a spot on another basswood log.

bull · « **Reply #18 on:** January 12, 2012, 06:30:56 pm »

quacking aspen,cottonwood,poplar they are all sisters !! dosen't look like basswood to me !!

Jeff · « **Reply #19 on:** January 12, 2012, 06:37:04 pm »

Nope, doesn't look a think like basswood to me either.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #20 on:** January 12, 2012, 06:46:17 pm »

This is what our aspen looks like.

Wide flat ridges in the bark.

The young ones are smooth and green or pinkish hue. Some bleached white like white birch. Our large tooth have white blotches like on sugar maple.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #21 on:** January 12, 2012, 06:56:02 pm »

This is why I often say bark don't mean beans unless it's a tree whose bark traits your used to in that area. It can be all over the map.

Jeff · « **Reply #22 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:00:11 pm »

We have aspen that looks like that as well, depends on the site. That stuff you posted is what we locally call "White poppel". The terminology is completely wrong, but that's what its called here, and its considered junk compared to anything else.

Jeff · « **Reply #23 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:04:47 pm »

I was trying to find some old photos of aspen logs on our log deck, but all I could find was this, and it really doesn't give you a good comparison view.

http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,2535.0.html

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #24 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:17:41 pm »

Jeff I never posted any "white poplar", but there is some just behind here on a neighbors line. And they have never grown in 30 years it seems. The ones I posted is one that is over mature with the dead branches, rough looking and one in cedar stand. The old one is junk because of the conk all over it, but the cedar one is sound and a fine tree. Actually the old one was in a cedar stand to I guess, but the cedar was cut.

We hulled over 300 cords of that "junk" to the mill in 1984, down in Houltan, Maine.

Hard to see when debarked.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #25 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:26:43 pm »

I think it is basswood I unloaded it off of the log deck tonight and put back into a pile untill I kind find out for sure what it is.
I noticed that a piece of bark came off of one of the logs and it peeled off in a very long piece probably 6 or 7' long.
I wonder if there is a market for them around PA I will have to make a couple of calls tomorrow and find out I will let you all know what I find out.
I may cut one of the top logs into 1" boards and put some pictures of it on here

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #26 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:29:17 pm »

I knew it had to be, poplar won't strip off like that. I've not seen aspen bark go orange.

Know anyone who carves? Sometimes those guys are a fussy lot, but basswood is nice to carve or wood burning art.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #27 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:32:00 pm »

Quote from: Jeff on January 12, 2012, 07:04:47 pm

I was trying to find some old photos of aspen logs on our log deck, but all I could find was this, and it really doesn't give you a good comparison view.

http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,2535.0.html

Jeff thats what I thought it was to at first(white poppel) my dad use to call it
I even went up on the hill to look at some but its just not the same besides I've never seen Poppel grow that big around here.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #28 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:38:44 pm »

Hey guys is this basswood good for siding or sheating boards ?
What else is it good for besides carving and furniture?

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #29 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:40:28 pm »

I wouldn't use it outside. But others might have more experience in it's use than I. It's always cut for pulpwood here.

Jeff · « **Reply #30 on:** January 12, 2012, 07:55:12 pm »

Aspen will certainly strip off in long pieces. If the bark stripped off is stringy and almost resembles binder twine, then its basswood. it its just a long strip of bark with semi smooth edges, then its not.

Clark · « **Reply #31 on:** January 12, 2012, 09:51:22 pm »

My initial thought was aspen but given the location and the condition, who knows?

Clark

isawlogs · « **Reply #32 on:** January 12, 2012, 10:10:01 pm »

I don't see basswood there , I see a poplar. I have yet to see a basswood look like the first pic, but have seen many poplar log have that look. Also have seen many strips of bark come off a poplar log.

woodcrazy · « **Reply #33 on:** January 12, 2012, 10:13:41 pm »

Looks like red alder, that is if your area has any, northern California has lots.
woodcrazy

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #34 on:** January 12, 2012, 11:29:11 pm »

Aspen doesn't have the strength for the bark to strip off length wise for several feet. It'll peel far easier in circumference than it will strip. And I never see aspen bark like that.

Jeff · « **Reply #35 on:** January 12, 2012, 11:36:46 pm »

I hate to tell a guy with a degree they are wrong, but you sir are wrong on your assumption on the bark.

I'm certain you know what your trees do, I can't judge that, but on ours, I certainly can. You can't take your model and make it everyone's. I fought aspen and aspen bark half my life. I know what the heck I'm talking about in regards to several million feet that passed before me.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #36 on:** January 12, 2012, 11:57:27 pm »

It's just not as reliable as buds, twigs, flowers and wood grain when dealing with a wide ranging species. Locally, with experience most fellas know their logs and standing trees. I've seen the difficulty on this forum when comparing the same species in the north with that in the south. Just like our cherry bark, it looks a lot different in other places to the south. About the only thing that looks like aspen in those photos is the white wood. I'll have to go to the UP and show ya your bark ain't orange.

A degree won't factor much into bark ID, experience over rules.

Our balsam poplar when it gets beyond mature has real rough deep bark and flat ridges, but does go orange. That might be a possible fit here. Western black cottonwood is pretty much the same. Recognizing that these are logs from a much younger tree than I am describing. A younger tree bark is quite different in comparison.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #37 on:** January 13, 2012, 06:56:16 am »

I will take the camero with me today and see if I cant get to that strip of bark and take it apart some for pictures but we had a quick freeze come through last night and its only 18 gegrees out there right now

so it might be next week when it warms up again

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #38 on:** January 13, 2012, 06:59:48 am »

That's still warm, cold is 20 below.

Dodgy Loner · « **Reply #39 on:** January 13, 2012, 10:09:59 am »

All the southern boys are sitting this one out, I see

. We don't have true poplar around here. Just yellow-poplar (aka tuliptree). We do have basswood in limited areas, but the bark looks a lot different from your northern stuff. I won't be of much help on this thread.

Jeff · « **Reply #40 on:** January 13, 2012, 10:13:12 am »

Do you have a picture of a board? Even Basswood and Aspen lumber will look very similar until you see the knots in the lumber. Basswood has knots with very distinct defined edges, where as aspen knots will usually have color spreading from the knot edges which are not nearly as defined.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #41 on:** January 13, 2012, 10:16:52 am »

That's OK dodgy because I've seen a person that should know, confuse balsam poplar for red oak. And had the log(s) right there to look at. And swear up and down it was red oak. And cut them where no red oak was present down on a wet flood plain. You just gotta walk away.

Jeff · « **Reply #42 on:** January 13, 2012, 11:30:11 am »

I've also seen a high school shop teacher confuse balsam poplar for red oak. One of my cousins. I went to the old farm and he had a couple sections of short 4 foot logs in his truck. He was going to take the "Red Oak" home and cut it into boards on the shop band saw for a personal project.

WDH · « **Reply #43 on:** January 13, 2012, 09:40:56 pm »

Quote from: Dodgy Loner on January 13, 2012, 10:09:59 am

All the southern boys are sitting this one out, I see . We don't have true poplar around here. Just yellow-poplar (aka tuliptree). We do have basswood in limited areas, but the bark looks a lot different from your northern stuff. I won't be of much help on this thread.

Gary_C · « **Reply #44 on:** January 13, 2012, 10:01:18 pm »

Jeff is right on the money. That's Aspen.

Aspen has so many different looks to it's bark, it can fool you. But that deeply furrowed look to the lower part of the tree is common. Sometimes you have to look up to the top of the tree to be sure what it is, but after seeing a lot of Aspen go down in front of my harvester, I know it's aspen. And definately not Basswood.

Gary_C · « **Reply #45 on:** January 13, 2012, 10:08:11 pm »

Quote from: SwampDonkey on January 12, 2012, 06:46:17 pm

This is what our aspen looks like.

(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

Wow, that one wins a prize. The Lyle Lovett of aspen trees.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #46 on:** January 14, 2012, 05:19:39 am »

Yeah the second one is a nasty widow maker with lot a lateral limbs. It was over mature and full of conk. I wouldn't take a saw anywhere near that thing.

The picture was for the bark, not for the beauty.

It's also over 30" dbh. The first was 26 inches dbh as I recall.

Aspen logs here that are up to 14 or 18 inches have smooth green/gray with some white sections or pinkish hue bark beyond 5 or 6 feet of the but. Like this. Unless its the white barked ones that never seem to grow much on higher elevation. This is at the point where the bark is starting to separate into ridges. This tree is around 14" and probably 35 years old. I have a 10" in the back yard and the bark is more green at 25 years of age.

That tree has enough logs from it that you would see some of the traits on up the tree. I don't see it, so can't agree to aspen.

I don't consider these junk when you get as much for pulp as veneer for them. That's why no one bothers to separate it because of the extra handling costs for nothing.

I think you'll find that the variance you see in the bark is hybridization and between species of poplar. I've been to Jeff property I saw aspen just like what I see here in NB. Not even a second guess. I also see it across northern Ontario.

Jeff · « **Reply #47 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:36:18 pm »

The aspen in the U.P. on my property, would not be typical to what we see at this latitude. Although we have some that looks like that, is can have a very different appearance from site to site. Some can even look like white birch from a distance. It would be rare for us to confuse a basswood log with Aspen. Ash, yes. Basswood looks quite a bit like ash in log form with the bark on. New yard guys at the mill would always confuse it.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #48 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:56:29 pm »

Yes, as I said your aspen grows like here. We have those white barked aspen that look like white birch to. But you would still not confuse it, or I wouldn't.

As far as basswood goes it grows with white ash and hard maple up here and I wouldn't confuse it for ash, but instead some folks confuse it for hard maple. My father for one.

I think it might just be the color or photography angle in the pictures, but sure looks like basswood bark.

MM has a bunch of photos of aspen in CO from his hunting excursions and they have the white bark.

Dale Hatfield · « **Reply #49 on:** January 15, 2012, 07:54:35 pm »

No doubt Its aspen. We often see 2 kinds of aspen smooth wood and fuzzy wood. when ya buck a log you will see what is fuzzy or smooth.
Funny is the fuzzy one will often hold a hinge better than the smooth wood. But neither will hold much for side lean.
Jeff is spot on I have seen everything he has said in aspen as well.

Dana · « **Reply #50 on:** January 16, 2012, 06:10:06 am »

I thought we had the answer two pages ago so I didn't reply. Since the debate is still on I say it's Aspen or what we locally call popple.

isawlogs · « **Reply #51 on:** January 17, 2012, 07:45:02 am »

SD is having trouble acknowledging that his books don't have the answer... It's OK Bill, every once in a while one misses and gets a strike , you've hit so many out of the park this one we"ll let pass

It has poplar written all over it. The fact that it is a year old on the ground is deceiving. Sorry Bill... it's poplar , I can't tell ya what kind of poplar aint that smart but its in that family tree.

1crowfarm · « **Reply #52 on:** January 17, 2012, 08:40:30 am »

Hello folks I plan on sawing tomorrow god willing I have three or four Poplar logs on the log deck to saw before I saw these ? logs up I will take lots of pictures and post them on here .I'am thinking that these logs are Aspen now from the last picture that was posted on here.
Hopefully we can solve this mystery with some pictures of the boards cut from this logs

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #53 on:** January 17, 2012, 12:31:00 pm »

Marcel it was based purely on experience. Never saw aspen with basswood bark before.

What I showed for aspen is what we got, simple as that. If I'm wrong that's fine, never bothered me before.

Anyone that would get worked up over a darn tree has some issues.

MapleNut · « **Reply #54 on:** January 17, 2012, 01:50:31 pm »

It is aspen...you can tell by the smell!!

Jeff · « **Reply #55 on:** January 17, 2012, 02:00:54 pm »

Quote from: SwampDonkey on January 17, 2012, 12:31:00 pm

Never saw aspen with basswood bark before.

We are now in agreement! Because on the other hand, I've never saw ~~aspen~~ basswood with ~~basswood~~ aspen bark before.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #56 on:** January 17, 2012, 02:52:38 pm »

Yeah, what do they call that? cancelled reciprication or something? Well they should anyway.

WDH · « **Reply #57 on:** January 17, 2012, 08:01:47 pm »

You are the Yin and he is the Yang

.

LeeB · « **Reply #58 on:** January 17, 2012, 08:16:42 pm »

Yep, a couple of ying yangs.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #59 on:** January 17, 2012, 08:17:54 pm »

Now that we've resolved that, what's next?

isawlogs · « **Reply #60 on:** January 17, 2012, 09:17:14 pm »

Bill, no one is getting upset over a tree, surely not I

Paul_H · « **Reply #61 on:** January 17, 2012, 10:09:51 pm »

Bill should be in politics,his admission of being wrong seems ambiguous.

zopi · « **Reply #62 on:** January 17, 2012, 10:28:11 pm »

Four pages on the worlds largest forestry forum to decide what kind of log that is...now, that's funny!

Jeff · « **Reply #63 on:** January 17, 2012, 11:08:16 pm »

Why would that be so funny?

Swamp Donkey may still have the last laugh. Its pretty tough sitting here looking at ambiguous photos and come up with a definitive answer. I'll bet if Donk and I were standing next to the actual logs to examine them, we would come up with a common consensus.

WDH · « **Reply #64 on:** January 17, 2012, 11:11:17 pm »

Notsweetgum

.

isawlogs · « **Reply #65 on:** January 17, 2012, 11:12:29 pm »

Most definitely would come up with it being " log "

zopi · « **Reply #66 on:** January 17, 2012, 11:14:10 pm »

Just giving you guys a hard time...my answer...notsweetgum.

Anybody try the Google Goggles App for identifying by bark? I have tried it with leaves with a fair bit of success...it still will not tell the difference between red maple amd norway maple for some reason...never thought to try it on bark.

JohnW · « **Reply #67 on:** January 18, 2012, 08:54:18 pm »

It looks like basswood.

OneWithWood · « **Reply #68 on:** January 19, 2012, 06:21:38 pm »

My first thought was aspen.

But if that log sat a while I would be inclined to say upper log of box elder...

NMFP · « **Reply #69 on:** February 06, 2012, 04:41:56 pm »

This is definately Aspen. In the one picture, there is a brown stain on the end of the log. That is discolored hearwood. I see it all the time, especially when sawing big aspens and cottonwoods.

mad murdock · « **Reply #70 on:** February 08, 2012, 03:15:40 pm »

I just wanna see some boards outta those logs! For my.02 worth, it looks like aspen to me too. Basswood that I have cut in n. Wisconsin and the U P looks too different.

wheelinguy · « **Reply #71 on:** February 11, 2012, 02:11:25 pm »

looks like a poplar that has been down a while, we burn alot of it in our OWB, seems like the bark would look different if it were basswood. I think everyone is dying to know. Not sure if we have aspen around here so i guess i wouldn't know what it looks like.

beenthere · « **Reply #72 on:** February 11, 2012, 04:18:56 pm »

The OP said pics after the Jan 17 sawing.

Not seen any, or heard from him.

Hope all is okay.

saltydog · « **Reply #73 on:** February 12, 2012, 06:32:08 pm »

looks like bamagilia to me or as yoopers call it elephant bark popple.

Jeff · « **Reply #74 on:** February 12, 2012, 06:38:35 pm »

No, not really close to Balm of Gilead.

Corley5 · « **Reply #75 on:** February 12, 2012, 10:34:32 pm »

Popple without a doubt

JohnW · « **Reply #76 on:** February 14, 2012, 10:04:47 pm »

I cut a couple logs that looked just exactly like that a couple years ago. It would be crazy if it's not bass wood because that's the reason I cut it. A wood carver guy I know was looking for was looking for some bass wood. These trees were blown down on my Dad's farm in Norther Indiana. The dead leaves looked like bass. I'll have to check with the wood cutter guy, and look at the remaining tress at my Dad's. I know, I have no way to confirm they're the same trees as in these pictures.

I don't really see any aspen around here, or up north except quaking aspen. Maybe there's a few trees I just don't notice. Any way, I'll be interested to see if there's any conclusion here.

Later, and sorry to ramble so.

Jeff · « **Reply #77 on:** February 16, 2012, 02:18:08 pm »

Quote

The dead leaves looked like bass.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #78 on:** February 16, 2012, 06:00:10 pm »

Sounds logical to me.

Jeff · « **Reply #79 on:** February 16, 2012, 06:02:28 pm »

I came across a guy one time that was told and actually made to believe that Basswood was called Basswood because of the smell.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #80 on:** February 16, 2012, 06:19:21 pm »

You meet all kinds in this business.

JohnW · « **Reply #81 on:** February 16, 2012, 08:47:49 pm »

Of course I don't mean the leaves looked like fish -- I mean they looked like basswood leaves.

So why do they call linden, basswood? Could it be that it was in demand for carving fishing lures?

WDH · « **Reply #82 on:** February 16, 2012, 09:12:53 pm »

"Bark

It is known in the trade as basswood, particularly in North America. This name originates from the inner fibrous bark of the tree, known as bast. A very strong fibre is obtained from this, by peeling off the bark and soaking in water for a month, after which the inner fibres can be easily separated. Bast obtained from the inside of the bark of the Tilia tree has been used by the Ainu people of Japan to weave their traditional clothing, the attus. Similar fibres are obtained from other plants are also called bast, named after those from the Tilia: see Bast fibre."

From Wikipedia.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #83 on:** February 16, 2012, 11:47:27 pm »

Natives used it to make rope just as they did on the west coast from western red cedar bark. You can peel really long strips off and it's strong.

Magicman · « **Reply #84 on:** February 17, 2012, 10:48:15 am »

And I was told by a logger that Linden was Linwood, or more properly "Lynwood" and was named after me. So now you know the "rest of the story".

Jeff · « **Reply #85 on:** February 17, 2012, 12:01:43 pm »

We would never saw basswood in the latter part of the day at the mill because of its twining attributes and fear of fire because of our debarker. When debarking basswood the bark fibers will come off like binder twine and can get wrapped around the cutter head shaft. The friction created easily dries the fibers and sets them on fire. There have been mills burned to the ground because of basswood. You never want to walk away at the end of the day after debarking that stuff without a thorough cleaning and inspection of the debarker. We kept a water extinguisher in the debarker cab just in case. Sometimes you had to get out after every log and unwind the stuff.

WDH · « **Reply #86 on:** February 17, 2012, 09:18:08 pm »

Was it especially worse in the spring when the bark peels off easily?

Jeff · « **Reply #87 on:** February 18, 2012, 08:08:57 pm »

Actually, in the spring when it is really peeling, its better, because you can pull it off in sheets. You hit the log with the debarker turn heads, and many times the bark would peel off in a sheet. Shallow up on the cutter head, so you don't grind off any wood, and keep spinning the log through while you back the sheet of bark back off the infeed conveyor.

Corley5 · « **Reply #88 on:** February 19, 2012, 10:05:55 am »

The pulp mills around here would only take basswood in the winter when it was frozen because of the de-barking issues with Rosser head machines. LP in Newberry only recently installed a cambio ring debarker which can handle basswood year round

Okrafarmer · « **Reply #89 on:** February 19, 2012, 04:41:52 pm »

Well since I saw it was from Pennsylvania and had reddish bark I was going to say black birch. Which is why I am not an expert. Next best guess-- well, if it were here in my state, I would say sweet gum, because sweet gum has a habit of camouflaging itself to look like any other kind of tree....

News:

Author Topic: What type of log is this? (Read 2994 times)