Author Topic: Fencing material - type of boards (Read 1492 times)

wmrussel · « **on:** August 27, 2011, 12:06:48 pm »

Hello Everyone,

A friend of mine wants to use something other than treated pine for his fence. He lives in east central Alabama and is looking at cypress, cedar or redwood. I'm guessing cypress will be the cheapest, since it's the most abundant of the three in our area.

As far as quality, which of these three materials is best for a fence? Are there other types that I've not mentioned?

Brad_bb · « **Reply #1 on:** August 27, 2011, 04:47:46 pm »

Does he really want solid wood? I always feel that fencing is kind of a waste for wood. I prefer natural shrubbery for a fence, and some sort of wire fencing (like woven) if you have to keep animals in. I save the good wood for timberframing or other projects.

Rooster · « **Reply #2 on:** August 27, 2011, 06:25:36 pm »

What about Black locust?

WDH · « **Reply #3 on:** August 27, 2011, 08:51:04 pm »

Redwood will last a long time with good maintenance. So will heart cedar. The sapwood is not very rot resistant. Heart cypress is also very good, but sap cypress is not hardly any more durable than most other wood. If your friend goes with cypress and it is sap cypress, don't expect any longevity records.

Magicman · « **Reply #4 on:** August 28, 2011, 08:21:33 am »

Not Cypress, as WDH said. Heart (red) Cedar, White Oak, or Black Locust. I would think that Redwood would be very expensive.

luncharm · « **Reply #5 on:** August 31, 2011, 12:53:52 am »

I'm the friend. Thanks, wmr, for getting this started. Here in the SE, I can get cypress for about the same $$ as pressure treated spruce pine, and I've heard it has comparable resistance. But I need to check on that to see it's quality, and if it's heart cypress.

Another suggestion I got is to use something like douglas fir and treat it with a preservative. Our initial concern with pressure treated was chemical seepage into food plants, but I understand there is new treatment that is enviromentally safer. Also, I don't know about chemical seepage from a preservative.

Cedar, redwood, and I suspect others mentioned I'm afraid would really cost too much.

This will be a picket fence, by the way, with a rail at the very top instead of the traditional kind that taper each picket open at the top.

I appreciate any input.

ljmathias · « **Reply #6 on:** August 31, 2011, 03:33:21 am »

luncharm: very unlikely you can get heart cypress- we've cut all the old growth and the new stuff is mostly sapwood, which means it has the durability of most sapwood: little to none untreated or unsealed. There are some good seals out there; we're using woodguard on the pine siding on the house I'm building now. The new pressure treated wood doesn't leak and is much more environmentally friendly then the old stuff. Problem with it, though, is fasteners: can't use regular nails and even galvanized corrode (according to PT sites). I'm using coated deck screws which are supposed to be designed for the new treatment. Stainless also works but has two major drawbacks: cost, and brittle failure while installing. I've had way too many stainless screws just snap off if they get friction tight- then what do you have?

Good luck, and have fun!

Lj

ellmoe · « **Reply #7 on:** August 31, 2011, 06:53:30 am »

I've sold hundreds of semi-loads of 1/2' cypress "sapwood" pickets. While they will not outlast heartwood, they average 15+ years. Leave them unpainted and off the ground a few inches and you'll get more life than what you should expect for the money. I sell both PT and cypress. The cypress last as long as the PT and shrinks, twists and gracks less. I put cypress up in my own yard.

Mark

ljmathias · « **Reply #8 on:** August 31, 2011, 07:28:04 am »

Wow, that's good and bad news: good that even sapwood cypress works so well, bad cause I can't get any here at a reasonable price; logs that is, so I can mill my own lumber for fences, siding and furniture...

Lj

WDH · « **Reply #9 on:** August 31, 2011, 08:03:32 am »

Mark,

Probably the concern that has been expressed with sap cypress has to do with the wood in ground contact and comparing it to the old "Tidewater Red" which was the old heart cypress. What you have experienced managing the wood to keep it from getting saturated with water that does not re-dry out as in ground contact is the key. From your experience, I would choose it over PT pine as well.

ellmoe · « **Reply #10 on:** August 31, 2011, 09:03:09 pm »

Dan, you correct in use as ground contact. Until about 25 years ago we used cypress 4x4's for privacy fence, then the market switched to PT. We would average about 10+ years with a "second growth" 4x4, with a 6x6 about 25 years. The PT 4x4 will last about 20+ years under same application and are cheaper which is really the main consideration here.

Mark

luncharm · « **Reply #11 on:** September 02, 2011, 09:27:11 am »

If I used sap cypress, would it make any sense to seal the posts and leave the pickets and rails bare? I guess I'm thinking of saving money, but I suppose they would probably weather to different colors.

WDH · « **Reply #12 on:** September 03, 2011, 12:20:54 am »

I don't know the answer, but I would think that some treatment for the below ground portion of the post would help. I suspect the above ground portion of the post would do as well as the pickets, so I would treat them the same so that they weather and color the same.

ellmoe · « **Reply #13 on:** September 03, 2011, 07:31:43 am »

The decay will be plus and minus a few inches at ground level. This is the area than will need treatment, maybe a copper solution. Me, I'd just let nature take it's course if I didn't want to use PT posts.
Mark

caveman · « **Reply #14 on:** September 04, 2011, 09:41:48 pm »

In 1993-4, when we built our house, we decked the back porch with cypress and built a fence around the yard with cypress boards. The deck did not last long--some boards were rotten in four or five years. All were pulled up and replaced with pt pine. The fence boards were sprayed with a pump up sprayer with some creosote looking stuff that I can't remember the name of. All of the fence boards are still up and should last a few more years. I do not think the stuff I sprayed on the boards led to their longevity. I think they have lasted because they don't have water standing on them. I would not put untreated wood in the ground here. This is in Central Florida where untreated pine and other woods will rot in a very short time under the right conditions. Caveman

bushhog920 · « **Reply #15 on:** September 04, 2011, 10:09:01 pm »

Good to see I'm not the only one in monkey town here. there is a sawyer here that sells alot of cypress call him at 268-1856. I mostly cut pine here on my mill last ok as long as you keep its feet dry.

wmrussel · « **Reply #16 on:** September 05, 2011, 06:34:56 pm »

Quote from: bushhog920 on September 04, 2011, 10:09:01 pm

Good to see I'm not the only one in monkey town here. there is a sawyer here that sells alot of cypress call him at 268-1856. I mostly cut pine here on my mill last ok as long as you keep its feet dry.

You only live a few minutes from me. Where do you buy your pine for your mill? Or is it high enough production that you have quite a few sources? I do a lot of inventory work on Rayonier timber sales.

bushhog920 · « **Reply #17 on:** September 06, 2011, 10:31:30 am »

I log my own pine off my land or trade with local land owners. been cutting alot of dead pine lately getting more than i can handle for free. have thought about buying it at one time but local loggers were not interested in small orders.

wmrussel · « **Reply #18 on:** September 06, 2011, 11:24:53 am »

I'd love to get down your way and see your setup. I've toured large mills in school, but never seen a small operation.

bushhog920 · « **Reply #19 on:** September 07, 2011, 04:37:22 pm »

Not much down here just a pole barn, 13hp norwood, bobcat, couple of chainsaws, and some lazy dogs. be glad to show you around or just hang out and talk about wood. ph# 284-6712

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Author Topic: Fencing material - type of boards (Read 1492 times)