what kind of tree is this? Solved: White Ash

[hackberry jake]

Ive had several different oppinions. Brother thinks Ash. Neighbor thinks Hickory. Friend thinks it could be an American Chestnut. I'm hoping for Butternut. Cant really get a pic of the leaves since the first branch is waaayyy up there. Wonder if anyone could tell by just the bark. It's a crooked fellar Its growing in a shallow hollar, next to a seasonal creek. Northwest Arkansas

[beenthere]

Get a leaf sample (shotgun works well) or with binoc's look for the leaf pattern. Easy to tell if there is opposite branching (ash) or leaflets on a leaf which gets into walnut.

Fro the last pic, looks like walnut if the leaves seen are with this tree.

[Dodgy Loner]

Looks like a hickory to me, but could be a walnut, as beenthere suggested. Take a pocketknife and try to shave off a little bit of the outer bark. If it's soft and chocolate-colored underneath, it's walnut. If it's rock-hard and you're barely able to shave anything off, it's hickory. I don't think it's an ash, but ash would have very soft bark that's tan-colored underneath. It's definitely not a chestnut.

Butternut is only native to a very small area in NE and North Central Arkasas, so that is unlikely, but possible. You would need a nut to confirm butternut, though.

[ahlkey]

It is a large White Ash given the distinctive diamond pattern in the bark.  As far as the leaves of White Ash they are are opposite, pinnately compound, and have 5 to 9 dark green leaflets with white-green undersides. The branches are also opposite.

[SwampDonkey]

Probably bitternut hickory, which has bark close to white ash as far as texture. Our white ash up north here has a brown color to the bark and white blotches like you see on young sugar maple only not as many. Old trees get flaky bark along the ridges. You can rule out butternut.

Here is a young white ash from the north.

[WDH]

I am with Beenthere.  Looks like walnut.  Right color.  Right bark pattern.  I bet the inner bark is bright yellow.  Take a pocket knife and cut a small hole in the bark until you get to the inner bark.  If it is walnut, the color should be bright yellow.

[ahlkey]

Bitternut Hickory and White Ash are often difficult to tell the difference on young trees but as they mature it is pretty easy.  With Bitternut it will be gray as mentioned with shallow furrows and interlacing ridges while White Ash will be brownish when mature with diamond type furrows.  Likewise, Bitternut Hickory will have alternate branching while White Ash will be opposite.  The leaves will have differences as well.  

For the past three years I have been involved in the national dieback study on Bitternut Hickory on my property and it is your first picture that made me think it was White Ash rather than Bitternut Hickory.  If it is indeed gray with alternate branching then I would agree it is not White Ash.  Please let us know.

[tyb525]

In the 2nd picture you can see the bark right under the outside layer is tan, leading me to believe it is white ash. Looks like the ash we have here, especially the form.

[SwampDonkey]

Being that butternut, walnut and hickory are in the same family I would discount the yellowing under the bark. It's certainly there in butternut. In this picture you can see the yellow inner bark (left) and a section of light brown bark (right) on a butternut tree. See how flattened the ridges are on the outer bark, although it does have the interlaced diamond pattern.



Pole sized butternut has some stripping on their bark as well.

[WDH]

Butternut may have the intense yellow inner bark, but the hickories and ash definitely do no.  It is distinctive for Juglans.

It could very well be an ash given the comment by Ty on the color of the flaked off bark.  If so, the branching will be opposite as previously pointed out.

[SwampDonkey]

Thanks for the clarification WDH on the yellow inner bark.

Can't rule out the ash for sure. I think some ash trees do tend to turn an ash gray on the surface. But not always.

The shape of the leaflets in the shadows there could go either way at this point.

[WDH]

We await the branching habit  .

[Autocar]

White Ash

[hackberry jake]

. not sure what you mean about opposite branching. I looked at the branches coming off the main trunk and couldn't tell for sure. looks like it has lost quite a few limbs over the years. I cant tell if it has opposite branching going to the leaves on the smaller stems. If i have time tomorrow i will take the trusty 12 gauge and try to score a close-up pic of the leaves. Hope these pics help

[hackberry jake]

My pics look very similar to SwampDonkeys pic. Im still hoping for Butternut... If its not butternut, I'm starting to lean towards hickory. The only thing that makes me think its not hickory is the figure of the tree. Most of the hickories we have around here are telephone pole straight. May just have to fell it and make some boards... Bet that will solve it. If it is Butternut, I would like to try and propigate it and plant its offspring everywhere. I've never got ahold of any Butternut, but judging by you guys pics, I think im gunna like it

[SwampDonkey]

White Ash is also straight as a gun barrel around here.

But there are also a lot of crooked ones to.

You can forget about the butternut.

I'm leaning on hickory quite hard still.

[ahlkey]

You need to look at the specific branches and then see how the leaf branches are positioned on it.  Likewise, if the leaf has roughly 9 blades or less and the 3 end leaftets are usually larger than the basal leaves it is probably a Hickory.  Alternate leave branching makes it clearer to determine but you can determine by the leaflets in most cases.

If the tree has it leaf stems positioned directly across from each other on the  branch that is considered an opposite arrangement.  In addition, the leaflets are similar in size and shape at both the end and rest of the basal leaves then that is an indication it is an Ash tree.

I agree it could be either at this point but I agree with earlier posts that it difinitely not butternut.

[SwampDonkey]

The ridges in the bark don't seem sharp enough to me for an ash at this point. I've handled white ash bear handed and it (bark) sure scratches the hands. Real old ones the bark flakes off more and not so rough to handle.

[bill m]

Tulip Poplar

[WDH]

Not walnut!  Not butternut!  The yellow inner bark test definitely rules them out.  Either a hickory or an ash. 

Hackberry,

Imagine a twig standing upright with leaflets (leaves) coming off the twig.  An alternate leafing habit is where the leaflet petioles (leaf stem) comes off the twig in an alternating pattern one leaf to the next, that is, one leaf on one side of the twig, then another leaf a little farther up on the twig on the other side but not directly opposite the first leaflet.  That is an alternating leafing habit.

An opposite leafing habit is where the leaves on either side of the twig are arranged exactly opposite each other.  If you look at the twig in this link, you will see how the buds are exactly opposite each other rather than alternating.  http://dendro.cnre.vt.edu/dendrology/syllabus/factsheet.cfm?ID=48  Each of these buds will form a leaf in the future.  That is an example of the opposite arrangement.

So, if it is ash, the leaves will be arranged on the twig exactly even with each other on opposite sides of the twig.  If hickory, the leaf petioles will alternate one side to the other, but never directly opposite from each other.

[hackberry jake]

Looks like my brother was right. Looks like ash to me

[SwampDonkey]

yes, ash.


Our northern white ash in this area have black branch tips when dormant and leaf color is dark shade of red not a bright red in fall.

[WDH]

Mystery solved. 

[ahlkey]

White Ash trees when cut into lumber remind me a lot of red oak.  In Wisconsin it is one of the first trees to change color in the fall and its leaves can go through a wide range of shades of yellow, orange, and red. Unfortunately, it is being hit with the EAB which is a HUGE problem for the species.

[SwampDonkey]

I hope I never see the pest, I have been managing for it on my woodlot with my brushing activities. And the moose generally leave it alone except the leaves they strip off.