"Gas-less" logging tools for Grizzly Adams

[650nmWolf]

Hi guys. I am brand new here, but was hoping you guys could help me in my thought process. My questions revolve around "early chainsaws" that ran on muscle instead of gas, so I guessed this might be the place to post.

I have a dream of one day going Grizzly Adams on the world... but with the wife and daughter. They may not share the same dream, but that is a different story.

If you guys were going "back to the basics," and you had to invest a few hundred dollars in "logging tools" for long term sustainability in the backwoods (no gas), which ones would they be? Assume that your needs were mostly for firewood and some very basic carpentry. I have a shop full of tools to work with processed lumber, but nothing to work with from scratch. I started my list but have not gotten very far:

    - Fiskars 7884 X27 36" Splitting Axe
    - Maybe a felling axe?
    - Axe sharpener
    - 5-6' one man/ two man crosscut bucking saw for when friends Mad Jack or Nacoma come over (tooth style to look for? brands? easiest to maintain for beginner? ebay or new? lots of questions here)
    - Long jointer
    - Sharpening files

I am not married to this list nor is it complete, but I was hoping to start a dialogue with you guys. Any thoughts? Thanks for reading!

[Chris Burchfield]

Check in the Commerce Section: Timber Framing Hand Tools for Sale.

[beenthere]

Welcome to the Forum
 
When you gonna get da bear?

[fuzzybear]

  I would add a forge, anvil, hammers, and a pile of scrap metal to that list.  My father was a master Blacksmith. If he couldn't make it it probably couldn't be made. I still find myself making my own tools. Learning to work metal is a requirement for living back woods as far as I'm concerned.
  When the early pioneers of this great continent started west they went armed with the greatest tool known to man, KNOWLEDGE. Those that didn't know how to make everything they needed didn't last long.
  There are so many things you need to survive on a daily basis in the bush. Simple garden tools are often missing on peoples list. Learning to preserve food is a must know. If you live 100 miles from town how are you going to take care of your self if you are injured? Basic first aid can mean the differance between life and death. What natural plants can you use for different ailments? Can you sew?  You can't just go and get another pair of pants.
   I have a saying I tell people all the time.....Water does not come from a bottle...food does not come from the store...you must be prepared for all that life throws at you if you are going to survive as a human.  Even then your odds are no greater than that of a gnat.
   If you were ever to go "backwoods" you must arm yourself with knowledge. It is the most basic and often used tool anyone can have. I never mean to rain on someones parade, but I have seen a lot of people come north with the dream of living in the bush, only to find out they are completely unprepared for the reality of doing so.
FB

[RPF2509]

I'd add chisels, drawknife, files - wood rasp and metal and maybe a bow saw to the list

[clww]

Welcome to The Forum!
That list will undoubtedly grow over time. I would get on the internet, the bookstore and the library and read anything I could put my hands and eyes on relating to the subject. I would then research and attend any gathering near your home where there are gatherings or demonstrations showing this related equipment and people that know how to use it.
 As fuzzybear wrote, there is no substitute for practical application and experience. I also would not scrimp or go cheap on what you acquire, as you get what you pay for, and buyer beware.

[Maine372]

bowsaw will be a must. and throw out that fiskars.

if youre going all grizzly adams you need to learn how to hang an axe with a wooden handle and maintain it properly.

USFS has a couple good publications on the topic.

[tyb525]

There is a great book I have called simply "Woodcraft", I forget who it's by, very old probably from the '30's. It is great source on info on all sorts of "Grizzly Adams" style of life. Not just surviving in the wild, but actually living in the wild, they way the indians and bush men did it.

[simplicityguy92]

id say a good 5lb felling axe and a good file to keeper sharp

[jaythecelt]

I'm not sure what I would do without a cant hook - even with gas! An old time wooden handled one, not the all-metal ones you can get these days.  I have both and always reach for the wooden one first.

[mrcaptainbob]

Check out the story "Alone in the Wilderness". The story of Richard Preneke. There are the i'net stories, but get the disc. Very informative. And very impressive.

[beenthere]

I'm not sure what I would do without a cant hook - even with gas! An old time wooden handled one, not the all-metal ones you can get these days.  I have both and always reach for the wooden one first.

I've my doubts you have used the new Logrite cant hook then.
I too liked the wood handle ones too (all most of us knew) until using the Logrite (not the chinese knock-off). Just nothing like the grip they have on a log.

But you are sure right that some means to get a log to roll while working in the wilderness without a cable winch would be an important tool.

[jaythecelt]

I've my doubts you have used the new Logrite cant hook then.

I'll have to check that out then ... I guess for hand tools, I am partial to 'antiques'.  The main thing I don't like about the all-metal cant hook (it's branded as a Husqvarna, but probably an Asian import) is the weight.  But it does have a jack on it to lift the log for the chainsaw.  Besides I think I paid ~$60 for the metal one and about $10 for the wooden one.

As for basic carpentry, I have found a spokeshave to be a very versatile tool.  Simple - lightweight - small enough to fit in your pocket.  Mine is an old Stanley #51.   Great for trimming something that doesn't quite fit - and for finishing up those axe handles you'll have to make

I picked up a one man cross cut saw several years ago - its about 40"-48" long with a handle on only one end.  I never sharpened it to try it, but I would think that would really help with bucking all that firewood.

An important point is to have tools that are versatile and high quality.  And you will need to have the right kinds of tools to let you make other tools - like axe handles, sawbucks, etc...

[tyb525]

The Indians didnt buck firewood too often. If they had a log that was too long, they would just lay it across the fire till it burnt in two pieces saves a lot of work

[jaythecelt]

I guess it depends if 650nmWolf can talk his wife and daughter to sit outside in the snow and rain to keep warm

I know how that would go over with my wife and daughters 

This is an interesting thread - I often thought about going native and what that would take.  I once saw a documentary (don't remember what it was called) about a guy in the 50s and 60s who spent every winter in the Alaskan wilderness in a cabin he built from the trees on site.  He had little more than a saw, chisel, axe and a gun.  It looked like he lived a pretty good life - he was very skilled with a hand saw, almost as fast as a circular saw.  But he was single.

[tyb525]

Jay, I saw that documentary also, I loved it. I forget the name also :/

[HolmenTree]

We had a TV series here in Canada called "Pioneer Quest" back in 2000. A modern day couple was picked to break land, build a homestead and live off the land as was done in 1875 here in Manitoba. If they survived for one year they would be paid $100,000 plus  expenses paid for.Minus -50F in winter [ coldest Manitoba winter in 120 yrs], wet summer and mosquitoes.

The History Channel made 9 one hour episodes and I believe they can be downloaded on Net Flix etc.

The couple survived [barely] and have a website www.pioneerquest.ca

Willard.

[Holmes]

Jay, I saw that documentary also, I loved it. I forget the name also :/

"Alone in the wilderness"  from the 60's?  Holmes

[isawlogs]

A gun and some amo might not be a bad idea to have at your side . 

[Bro. Noble]

Jay, I saw that documentary also, I loved it. I forget the name also :/

"Alone in the wilderness"  from the 60's?  Holmes

Look up www.lakeclarkair.com They give tours of that cabin and have a little history on it.

[HolmenTree]

We had a TV series here in Canada called "Pioneer Quest" back in 2000. A modern day couple was picked to break land, build a homestead and live off the land as was done in 1875 here in Manitoba. If they survived for one year they would be paid $100,000 plus  expenses paid for.Minus -50F in winter [ coldest Manitoba winter in 120 yrs],+110 F in summer and mosquitoes.

The History Channel made 9 episodes and I believe they can be downloaded on Net Flix etc.

The couple survived [barely] and have a website www.pioneerquest.ca

Willard.

[jaythecelt]

Check out the story "Alone in the Wilderness". The story of Richard Preneke. There are the i'net stories, but get the disc. Very informative. And very impressive.

:-[uh ... yea. mrcaptainbob already pointed that one out

Sorry, guess I had a blond moment there.   That's the guy - pretty amazing story. 

Leaving the grid and civilization behind sometimes sounds like a great idea, but the people who lived like that 100+ years ago were much different than we are today.  Most couldn't tell you the first thing about an internal combustion engine, but they understood things about the natural world that would be as foreign to us today.  I just don't think we have the skill set to survive without electricity and at least some powered devices.  Having the right tools is one thing, but knowing what to do and when is something different.

[01crewcab]

A good lawyer for when your wife(who isn't sold on the idea) tells you to shove it.

[mrcaptainbob]

I was so impressed with that story of Preneke. The guy was a real artist with the wilderness. And a very fine presentation on it, too! The biggest let down to me was at the end when the story finished about his living there for over thirty years and the story being finished by his.....wife and kids. If mine couldn't make the change with me...the change wouldn't get made. Except for that, it was most impressive.

[jaythecelt]

If mine couldn't make the change with me...the change wouldn't get made.

I'm with you there!  I am lucky enough to have a wife that will put up with country living in Pennsylvania.

The thing that impressed me most was his skill with a handsaw.  He was resawing straight boards with a handsaw by eye.  And he was fast - he must have been really good at sharpening also.  I think I might try to get or rent that video to watch it again.

[01crewcab]

I'm sorry, but I have watched that show(story) several times on TV, plus have his books and videos. He was not married. The only mention of family was his brother.

[john_boylan]

Add a fro, adze, and bent handle broadaxe to your list and I think you'll have most of what the better equipped pioneer ancestors had at their disposal.  Growing food and making servicable clothing would be a whole nother challenge.

[mrcaptainbob]

You are right, 01crewcab. I stand corrected. I watched the story again and was amazed at me. I can't figure WHERE I got it that he had a wife and daughters! I'd've stood on Bibles and sworn to God that that was stated at the end and that that's who donated his cabin!  Well, here's a small bio of him and his talents: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Proenneke. I recommend watching this talented guy at work. Very impressive.

[Bro. Noble]

I read the book 'Alone in the Wilderness' and also DickP.'s diary and found them very interesting also.  A story that wasn't told and that is still going on is about the Alsworth family.  Alsworth was the old man that flew Dick P. up to his cabin site and flew in to deliver supplies and to check on him.  He flew in from Port Alsworth on Lake Clark and was a real pioneer and adventurer in that area.  His son and grandson still run Lake Clark air and are still taking care of visitors.  They have regular flights from Ancorage to the Lake Clark area as well as taking people on guided fishing and hunting trips and sightseeing trips including Dick P.'s cabin.  One thing they do that isn't as well known is the rescue of downed flyers and the salvage of their aircraft.  Somestimes they can repair a downed aircraft on site and fly it out.  Their pilots are above average in skill and courage.

[mrcaptainbob]

This sure is an interesting thread.

[mad murdock]

Hi guys. I am brand new here, but was hoping you guys could help me in my thought process. My questions revolve around "early chainsaws" that ran on muscle instead of gas, so I guessed this might be the place to post.

I have a dream of one day going Grizzly Adams on the world... but with the wife and daughter. They may not share the same dream, but that is a different story.

If you guys were going "back to the basics," and you had to invest a few hundred dollars in "logging tools" for long term sustainability in the backwoods (no gas), which ones would they be? Assume that your needs were mostly for firewood and some very basic carpentry. I have a shop full of tools to work with processed lumber, but nothing to work with from scratch. I started my list but have not gotten very far:

    - Fiskars 7884 X27 36" Splitting Axe
    - Maybe a felling axe?
    - Axe sharpener
    - 5-6' one man/ two man crosscut bucking saw for when friends Mad Jack or Nacoma come over (tooth style to look for? brands? easiest to maintain for beginner? ebay or new? lots of questions here)
    - Long jointer
    - Sharpening files

I am not married to this list nor is it complete, but I was hoping to start a dialogue with you guys. Any thoughts? Thanks for reading!

Simonds Internationalhttp://simondsinternational.com/ makes any file for sharpening anything, including all types and flavors of saw files.
http://www.crosscutsaw.com/ manufacturer of new "old" crosscut saws, saw maintenance tools etc. and other quality tools like axes, froe, adz, timber carriers, peavey, etc. etc. 

Logrite(sponsor of the Forestry Forum) has a very good line up of quality tools as well, just may not have the breadth of selection that the crosscut saw co. has, when it comes to old style tools.  The timber framers forum on here is a great place to look for old tools as well.

[ickirby]

...learn how to hang an axe with a wooden handle and maintain it properly.

USFS has a couple good publications on the topic.

Here is the link that you want all about axes.

[mad murdock]

Thanks for posting that link ickirby, that is a great resource.