Author Topic: .325 chain (Read 2804 times)

justincase · « **on:** February 20, 2011, 07:57:19 am »

anybody seen bad batch's of chain? I have been breaking .325 stihl chain left and right. Dealer says cold weather and hot bar running in snow. I don't believe it but anything is possible. First one he said rakers were too aggressive but then I brought some in that I hadn't even filed yet. Broke two yesterday that the dealer repaired day before. Running them on a 2152 jonsered and 353 husky. Any thoughts on going to 3/8 chain. Hate to unless it will make a big difference. I probably have broken 10 chains this month and never had this situation before. Thanks for advice.

clww · « **Reply #1 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:52:44 am »

I've run .325 063 for years on my 028 and 290 with 16" and 20" bars. I've broken 2 chains total, although I'm not a pro logger with 5 day a week use each year.

Al_Smith · « **Reply #2 on:** February 20, 2011, 09:07:13 am »

Something is amiss with that cutting system other than bad chain .First of all a 3 cubic inch saw doesn't have enough power to pull apart a chain aggressive or not unless it snagged on something at speed .

If I were a betting man my money would be on a badly worn rim or spur whatever it is .Now I've seen such things believe it or not of some running mismatched bars that will break a chain .I never figure out how they got them to work at all though .

I've never ever broken a chain in over 40 years and hope I never do .If I did though I'd not have broken ten before I kind of investigated the cause .Dang that could hurt you .

justincase · « **Reply #3 on:** February 20, 2011, 09:55:35 am »

This happening on two different saws using the same chain. The 353 is about two months old, original bar and sprockets and the 2152 is a couple years old with just one replaced tip. Bars are in good shape dressed by me or dealer. There is no rhyme or reason to when it happens. Limbing, felling and bucking. Yesterday I just touched a hemlock limb with no pressure and chain broke.

Cut4fun · « **Reply #4 on:** February 20, 2011, 10:23:46 am »

Sounds like you need to type a letter to stihl and bypass the dealer. JMO. Product Complaint, Technical Question. Here is a link.

http://www.stihlusa.com/contact.php

Al_Smith · « **Reply #5 on:** February 20, 2011, 10:38:46 am »

An option of course would be to get a driver count and order a few loops from Baileys .If you don't break them ,that would pretty much tell the tale I would think .

By the way just exactly what brand of chain is it ?

Cut4fun · « **Reply #6 on:** February 20, 2011, 10:53:17 am »

Quote from: Al_Smith on February 20, 2011, 10:38:46 am

By the way just exactly what brand of chain is it ?

Quote from: justincase on February 20, 2011, 07:57:19 am

been breaking .325 stihl chain left and right.

Not that it matters was it RM or RS. Leaving off all the 2, C etc on purpose.

isawlogs · « **Reply #7 on:** February 20, 2011, 10:57:00 am »

First thing I would do is change chain supplier and brand as Al indicated and go from there. I have broke one chain , maybe two , but both where my fault to have used them to the breaking point never had a new chain break, let alone ten in a month.

justincase · « **Reply #8 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:01:28 am »

I am using 25 rsc 72 oilomatic stihl. He said it was the best chain for what I was doing which is cutting wood daily and he claimed oregon didn't make a good comparable chain. If someone has another recommendation let me know.

Cut4fun · « **Reply #9 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:16:49 am »

Quote from: justincase on February 20, 2011, 11:01:28 am

I am using 25 rsc

Sure it isnt 26 RSC? That is some good chain and tops in the 325. Thats also the first stuff I go for is RS 325 in 325 chain.

justincase · « **Reply #10 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:24:46 am »

box says 25 rsc

Al_Smith · « **Reply #11 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:31:29 am »

I won't say anything bad about Stihl chain because it's about top of the line .It should be for what it costs but that's beside the point . I had overlooked the fact it was stated as being Stihl chain .

Whatever is amiss then is amiss on both saws .Kind of hard to determine over the internet .Thinking out loud though if it were tightened up after it got heated up it would surely eat up the rails of the bar in addition to possibley getting tight enough to cause breakage .If that were the case though it wouldn't cut worth a hoot . Also that tight would do a number on the drum in addition to the power side crankshaft bearing .A great mystery at this point .

lumberjack48 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:39:03 am »

I had the same problem with 3/8 - 050. oilomatic Stihl chain, Stihl chain is temper way harder then any other brand, this why it stays sharp longer.
I didn't have time for broken chain, i went to Carlton chain.

Its not your filing or anything its the chain, i think some rolls got over temper, it seems like that because i could get one chain and its good, the next chain i couldn't keep together.

I didn't have this problem with Carlton or Oregon chain.

May be going to a 063. driver might solve it, i don't know never tried.

Like Cut4fun said, bring this complaint right to Stihl, if it was my chain, I'd want to know, may be they'll give you a roll of good chain

justincase · « **Reply #13 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:40:32 am »

I don't think the chain is too tight. I try to lift chain off rail when tightening but doesn't sag off bottom of rail when tight. I haven't needed to dress bar much and seems even and smooth. I ran file over bar friday and serviced both saws. Sharpened chains so both saws were ready saturday morning. My brother broke one chain with husky on first tank of fuel and I broke one with jonsered first tank of fuel then rest of day went fine both of those chains had broke previously and were repaired day before by dealer. The time spent changing chain is the most frustrating especially wading in our crotch deep snow.

Al_Smith · « **Reply #14 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:49:17 am »

I'd be more worried about that thing taking a chunk out of your leg .

Cut4fun · « **Reply #15 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:56:33 am »

Quote from: justincase on February 20, 2011, 11:24:46 am

box says 25 rsc

Sorry just a little slow today

. 25 rsc = 058 gauge. I was thinking stihl and not jred husky bars.

justincase · « **Reply #16 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:11:27 pm »

I think I pay about 24$ for these chains and have wondered if buying a roll and the tools would be cheaper in the long run but now I would hate to have 100' of bad chain. My dealer support is generally very good. I bring in a saw and they usually fix it while I wait if its not a big deal. I also pay for it and usually I am in on a weekly basis. They say the hand crews are gone and mechanized logging has put a damper on saw business. I have been hauling wood with a self loader for about 4 years and cutting is new to me so this site has been a great place to watch and learn. I really like to just read posts and learn from them but at times like this one I have to ask questions and hopefully someone else is just reading and learning.

Al_Smith · « **Reply #17 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:21:18 pm »

24 bucks is about double what Oregon or Carlton would be through Baileys .

They gents on the left coast in the logging areas say that Stihl is very competitve price wise .However in other areas evidently they charge what the traffic will bear . I know it's high in my area but generally it's good stuff .

sawguy21 · « **Reply #18 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:24:33 pm »

The dealer is making loops off a roll for your Husky, Stihl does not supply pre cut loops to fit unless the drive link count happens to be the same as their saws. I would have a good look to see if they are breaking at the splice, the bench guy may not be spinning the rivets properly or may be bending the driver when breaking.

justincase · « **Reply #19 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:45:40 pm »

would stihl supply the dealer with boxes stamped with exact specs of the chain? Each chain I have bought is packed in a stihl box with the specs of the chain. Like I said I haven't priced much elsewhere due to convenience but I might have to start. I did e-mail stihl so we will see what they say. I am surprised the dealer only sells me this chain. He carries husky, stihl, jred, and echo. Would think there would be more choices on chain.

sawguy21 · « **Reply #20 on:** February 20, 2011, 12:49:26 pm »

Chain is expensive, he likely won't carry another brand unless the price is better or a size Stihl can't supply.

Al_Smith · « **Reply #21 on:** February 20, 2011, 04:08:27 pm »

Quote from: justincase on February 20, 2011, 12:45:40 pm

He carries husky, stihl, jred, and echo. Would think there would be more choices on chain.

Yes but if he did he couldn't sell so much Stihl branded chain .As it is the old boy has a captive market .

I've got one Stihl dealer out of three within a 15 mile area and one Husky dealer in an undisclosed location I deal with by telephone . Baileys most other stuff .

Cut4fun · « **Reply #22 on:** February 20, 2011, 07:55:14 pm »

I would give this stuff a try at $13.99 a loop. It's not as sharp out of the box like stihl chain. http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=WPL+28RC72&catID=11800

justincase · « **Reply #23 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:19:24 pm »

I just ordered two chains to try. I can touch them up if not sharp out of box. If these work for me do you think it is worth buying a roll and tools to make my own. Never done it so Not sure of what's involved

lumberjack48 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:38:30 pm »

Absolutely, nothing to making chain up, you just can't get the rivets to tight, once you learn the basic's you'll be up and running.
After i got hurt the wife made chain up, and fixed chain, we bought all our chain by the roll.

Cut4fun · « **Reply #25 on:** February 20, 2011, 08:59:27 pm »

I am just a homeowner hobbyist that keeps firewood cutters saws and chains going.

I ordered the baileys spinner and breaker set for making my own chain and I really like it.
What is nice is not to have to depend on no one.

Heck I even started breaking down used chains that come in and make them the right drive link when needed.

Oh oh dont try spinning up chain when blind from drinking

fuzzybear · « **Reply #26 on:** February 20, 2011, 11:52:47 pm »

Just a quick thought. You said you had the chains repaired by the dealer the day before and they broke on the first tank. I would almost be willing to bet your dealer is buying bulk reals of chain and is making up loops. And the person doing this job has no clue what they are doing. I would be willing to bet they both broke at the link repaired by the dealer. I had a batch of chains do the same thing and turned out to be the dealer. They hired a new kid and never really took the time to teach him the correct way to do it.
hope this helps
FB

barbender · « **Reply #27 on:** February 21, 2011, 12:27:52 am »

Yep- something is fishy there. I think I have only broken 1 chain, and that was my fault. I got my bar pinched falling a tree and muscled it out when I should have did something to get the weight off of it. The chain broke about 10 minutes later. The fact this is breaking on both saws makes it seem to be a chain problem, I think the others on here that suggested the dealer is spinning the loops and not doing it right are on the right track. I also think Stihl chain is very good quality, but around here it costs about 40% more. I usually run Oregon, I've got some Carlton I'm trying now. It seems kind of soft, I'm not sure. I haven't ran it much yet. You better corner your dealer with the accusations you got on here

Al_Smith · « **Reply #28 on:** February 21, 2011, 07:03:31 am »

The ability to make up your own chains is handy but it just depends on the situation as to weather it's a good option .
I can and due but it's more because of the amount of odd ball sizes I have with the antiques .That plus on occasion cutting down a longer loop which might be damaged but still salvageable .

As far as a standard loop like 72 driver 3/8" you might save a dollar a loop verses buying them from Baileys or other online suppliers .Sometimes they even have them about the same price or even cheaper than buying a bulk roll at standard price .

If you're only going to go through a couple chains a year or couple years a chain ,it wouldn't be worth the hassel .

SawTroll · « **Reply #29 on:** February 21, 2011, 09:32:05 am »

Quote from: justincase on February 20, 2011, 11:01:28 am

I am using 25 rsc 72 oilomatic stihl. He said it was the best chain for what I was doing which is cutting wood daily and he claimed oregon didn't make a good comparable chain. If someone has another recommendation let me know.

He is wrong about the Oregon stuff, 21LP(X) would fill the bill perfectly. I use both, but prefere the Oregon.

However, that is irrelevant in your case, as it is highly unlikely that a change would solve your issue.

Quote from: fuzzybear on February 20, 2011, 11:52:47 pm

Just a quick thought. You said you had the chains repaired by the dealer the day before and they broke on the first tank. I would almost be willing to bet your dealer is buying bulk reals of chain and is making up loops. And the person doing this job has no clue what they are doing. I would be willing to bet they both broke at the link repaired by the dealer. I had a batch of chains do the same thing and turned out to be the dealer. They hired a new kid and never really took the time to teach him the correct way to do it.
hope this helps
FB

That is what I find most likely at this point as well....

lumberjack48 · « **Reply #30 on:** February 21, 2011, 08:18:23 pm »

When i had this problem with Stihl chain, i think it was 1983, Stihl had a issue with chain breaking. I was getting my chain from Con's saw shop in Grand Rapids, MN.
Con was the number 1 Stihl dealer back than, he replaced my Stihl chain with a Carlton, he sold Stihl, Carlton and Oregon chain.

If it would have been so simple as a repair link i would have seen that the first time it broke. I understand what your talking about I've had it happen many times, over tight strap, to louse, cracked strap, upside down strap, I've seen it all from the saw shops.

I fixed my own chain on the job with a vice grip chain breaker, after i fixed it 3, 4 times i new something was wrong, i dug out one of my old chains, never had a problem with that.

I think Cons boy Dale still has it open, barbender next time you go by there stop and ask Dale about Stihl chain.

justincase · « **Reply #31 on:** February 21, 2011, 08:44:56 pm »

Stihl e-mailed me today and wants samples so what the heck I got nothing to lose. I never will recoup costs due to downtime changing chains but at least I might find out why its happening. Hard to tell how many have broken because they have been repaired and reused so many times with new chains mixed in. Wish I could have marked them somehow. I look forward to trying some other chains and possibly making up my own when I narrow the choices down.

justincase · « **Reply #32 on:** March 04, 2011, 08:30:38 pm »

Well just got an e-mail from Stihl and they said they would replace the four chains I sent back. He didn't say what the problem was though. Funny thing is I needed a couple chains until the chains I ordered from Bailey's came in and these Stihl chains have been no problem at all. I was wrong on the price I said I was paying. The Stihl chains are 19$ from local dealer and carlton chain was same money after shipping so I will try carlton and oregon and see which is best. Hopefully this was a few bad chains and I won't have this problem too many more times.

lumberjack48 · « **Reply #33 on:** March 05, 2011, 01:20:45 pm »

Carlton is the better chain by far than Oregon, Oregon is a softer chain

Get a Carlton File-O-Plate, its the best tool i found for rakers, simple to use

What size is our chain, pitch, gauge, driver count ? I'll see if i can beat their price.

justincase · « **Reply #34 on:** March 05, 2011, 04:46:58 pm »

Lumberjack, I am using .325 chain 18"bar, 72 drivers, 58 guage chain. I haven't used the carlton chain yet and I guess I will be getting 4 more Stihl chain as well.

SawTroll · « **Reply #35 on:** March 07, 2011, 12:44:50 pm »

Quote from: lumberjack48 on March 05, 2011, 01:20:45 pm

Carlton is the better chain by far than Oregon, Oregon is a softer chain

......

I disagree with that, based on the Carltons I have used.

Then we have the fact that Carlton doesn't make low-vibe chain.....

Cut4fun · « **Reply #36 on:** March 07, 2011, 12:48:46 pm »

Quote from: SawTroll on March 07, 2011, 12:44:50 pm

Quote from: lumberjack48 on March 05, 2011, 01:20:45 pm
Carlton is the better chain by far than Oregon, Oregon is a softer chain

......

I disagree with that, based on the Carltons I have used.

Then we have the fact that Carlton doesn't make low-vibe chain.....

Thats why I had suggested the woodsman pro over the oregon LP for the first go around try. That LP chain is just so heavy with all that extra metal

John Mc · « **Reply #37 on:** March 07, 2011, 01:55:34 pm »

Are "Total" chains just rebadged Carlton? One of the Husky/Jonsered dealers in my area carries Total chains. I had good luck with them or a few years, but then ran in to some that appeared to have some heat treating problems. Most of the teeth and depth gauges would sharpen normally, but in a few chains I got, there were one or two teeth that were so hard that they would ruin my file every time I tried to sharpen them. I finally gave up on them. Now I run either Oregon (if I'm buying locally) or Wooldland Pro from Bailey's.

I agree that the Carlton File-O-Plate is a great tool for setting the depth gauges. I now use a similar tool sold by Husqvarna that I find easier to grip. It works the same way as the File-O-Plate. I use the one on the left in the photo below. I'm usually using the Hardwood end, since that's what I cut. The softwood end makes for a bit more aggressive setting on the depth gauges. The one shown is for 3/8 pitch (Husky part #505 69 81-01). They also make one for .325 pitch (Husky part #505 69 81-00). There are ones for .404 and "3/8 Hobby" whatever that is.

John Mc

justincase · « **Reply #38 on:** March 07, 2011, 04:44:29 pm »

That is the same plate I have been using to set raker depth as well. The chain I bought from Bailey'

justincase · « **Reply #39 on:** March 07, 2011, 04:50:52 pm »

Sorry hit enter when I should't have. The chain I ordered is Baileys woodsman pro which I think is carlton.

Shotgun · « **Reply #40 on:** March 07, 2011, 05:22:38 pm »

Quote from: justincase on March 07, 2011, 04:50:52 pm

Sorry hit enter when I should't have. The chain I ordered is Baileys woodsman pro which I think is carlton.

justincase, You can edit your original post. No harm done, but you didn't need to start another post.

Norm

justincase · « **Reply #41 on:** March 08, 2011, 08:02:57 pm »

Picked up my new Stihl chains today and the dealer said Stihl admitted they had a bad run of brittle straps and bring back any chain I had a problem with. Sounds good to me!

Cut4fun · « **Reply #42 on:** March 08, 2011, 08:20:36 pm »

Quote from: justincase on March 08, 2011, 08:02:57 pm

Picked up my new Stihl chains today and the dealer said Stihl admitted they had a bad run of brittle straps and bring back any chain I had a problem with. Sounds good to me!

Thats cool..........

sharkey · « **Reply #43 on:** March 12, 2011, 05:56:22 am »

Just a heads up that if your buying Stihl branded chain off Ebay that there is a chance that it may be a Chinese knock off.

The tie straps are marked 'Stihl' and all the numbers on the chain look correct. The packaging (plastic bag and box if buying loops) is also correct with 'Stihl made in Switzerland' and the logo looks correct. The artwork and colors are just about perfect.

The oilomatic groove that is cut into the chain to draw oil to the rivets is a patented Stihl process and it is missing from the counterfeit chain. I cannot post a link or pics because they are on another forum, but you will come across them if you look around a little.

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Author Topic: .325 chain (Read 2804 times)