Author Topic: Power feed- how about this motor and controller? (Read 1995 times)

fred in montana · « **on:** February 06, 2011, 02:31:16 pm »

In another post, i was looking into adding a power up/down to my LT15. I have decided to put that on hold.

Now, I am looking into a power forward/reverse with variable speed such as what sold by Woodmizer. I could buy theirs but I think I can save myself some money and also maybe add some custom functions.

I found a 9 A 24 V 46 inch lb 120 RPM gear motor with encoder on ebay for around $100.

I would drive it with a reversible DC 10 Amp PWM controller allowing me to vary the speed. I would add limit switches at each end of the mill.

I would power it off of the 12V on the sawhead.

The gearmotor would direct drive the existing crank wheel that feeds the saw forward/backward.

Do the motor and controller specs sound reasonable?

I am not sure what kind of RPM the saw would require for a reasonably fast return to start position. I will have to check that when the weather clears.

sdunston · « **Reply #1 on:** February 06, 2011, 02:54:07 pm »

Fred, WM sells an upgrad for the 15 for feed and it is field installed
Sam

Magicman · « **Reply #2 on:** February 06, 2011, 03:36:06 pm »

How much does the WM unit cost?

Bibbyman · « **Reply #3 on:** February 06, 2011, 04:18:41 pm »

How about fixing a shaft so you could chuck up a cordless drill with variable speed and forward and reverse?

Not my idea, a friend had an old LT30 and the up/down motor went out. So to keep sawing while his new motor came in, he rigged a shaft extension and used a cordless drill.

fred in montana · « **Reply #4 on:** February 06, 2011, 04:25:48 pm »

I think the WM power feed is around $1000.

A cordless drill maywork for a time but I think you would wear it out pretty fast.

Slingshot · « **Reply #5 on:** February 06, 2011, 04:39:27 pm »

The Woodmizer unit is $1095.00. Buy a new LT15G15 before end of Feb and get it for $795.

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bandmiller2 · « **Reply #6 on:** February 06, 2011, 08:45:45 pm »

Fred,why not go hydraulic, drive a small pump from the engine, two spool valve up/down for the head and a hyd. motor drum and cable for feed.Frank C.

fred in montana · « **Reply #7 on:** February 06, 2011, 09:26:16 pm »

Quote from: bandmiller2 on February 06, 2011, 08:45:45 pm

Fred,why not go hydraulic, drive a small pump from the engine, two spool valve up/down for the head and a hyd. motor drum and cable for feed.Frank C.

Eventually, I want to make a setworks system. I suppose there are 12 volt powered solenoid valves for hydraulics that could be controlled with a microcontroller?

Bibbyman · « **Reply #8 on:** February 07, 2011, 10:17:19 am »

What’s the goal here Fred?

What small amount I’ve sawn on the LT15, I don’t feel it needs a power up and down feed as the height adjustment is almost effortless. The manual feed is no physical burden that I can tell. The only advantage would be that you could set it to sawing and then do something else for a little bit like pull a slab or board.

Look Ma! One hand!

“Pattern sawing” can be done easily with a manual mill without all the computers, controllers, etc. It’s just a method.

Slingshot · « **Reply #9 on:** February 07, 2011, 11:15:26 am »

I had an LT15 for awhile and cranking that crank down a long board does get a little
old after a few. Makes you feel like your hand is going around in circles.

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Wallys World · « **Reply #10 on:** February 07, 2011, 05:20:25 pm »

24 volt motor driving off of 12 volts? It will work but it will 1/2 speed and pull more amps. You might want to check into that. Make sure your controller can handle that.

Just Me · « **Reply #11 on:** February 07, 2011, 05:32:21 pm »

Check out Burdens Surplus Center out in Nebraska. They are on line. They have all kinds of cool stuff when you need to invent something cheap. Might be called just The Surplus Center now...

How about a 24 volt solar powered Dc motor running a small hydraulic pump through a right angle gearbox turning a rack and.............

Well the possibilities are just endless.

Dangerous_Dan · « **Reply #12 on:** February 07, 2011, 05:46:29 pm »

As you guys probably know I have a Norwood band saw.
And I want to do the same thing, add power feed.
It hasn't happened yet but I have been thinking about it and gathering parts.
I found a Kangaroo powered golf bag caddy in the garbage. It's 12 volts with a nice variable speed unit and a small gear motor assembly. It's small but has good power and speed. A bearing in the motor had locked up and that's why it got thrown out. I got a new bearing for a buck and it's working as good as new.
One day I'll get to it, till then I just pile up cool parts that I want to add to it and dream about the day I get it all done.
Ask your golf buddies if they know of a broken one or go to a golf course and ask the guy who fixes the golfcarts.
DD

pineywoods · « **Reply #13 on:** February 07, 2011, 06:36:41 pm »

Fred, another good source is electric wheel chairs. There's 2 motors, one for each side. The motors are 24 volt with a built in worm drive reduction box. Still have plenty of power on 12 volts. I have one hooked up as an autoclutch on my mizer. It lifts the wm motor easily. The speed controller may or may not work on 12 volts.

Woodwalker · « **Reply #14 on:** February 07, 2011, 08:01:58 pm »

If your not mobile then this may help http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,28793.msg413811.html#msg413811
My LM1 was set up something similar with the hand cranks. That got old fast. I'm set up stationary and connected to a single phase source. I've got a 90V DC on the raise and lower and a variable speed head travel through a FVD and a three phase motor.

fred in montana · « **Reply #15 on:** February 07, 2011, 08:27:52 pm »

Quote

What’s the goal here Fred?

What small amount I’ve sawn on the LT15, I don’t feel it needs a power up and down feed as the height adjustment is almost effortless. The manual feed is no physical burden that I can tell. The only advantage would be that you could set it to sawing and then do something else for a little bit like pull a slab or board.

I would like to:

be able to pull a slab or board
avoid the exhaust and sawdust in the face- I set my saw up with the prevailing wind that blows it right in my face!
Be able to have the saw return to the starting position on its own while I go about other things.

Eventually add a power up down and make a setworks system to automate cutting 1x, 2x etc...

Mostly because I like doing this kind of stuff!

I have read that 24v DC motors work fine on 12 v but with less power. The PWM speed controllers basically vary the voltage so I don't think that it hurts anything to run it at voltages other than 24.

Bibbyman · « **Reply #16 on:** February 07, 2011, 08:58:23 pm »

Quote from: fred in montana on February 07, 2011, 08:27:52 pm

Mostly because I like doing this kind of stuff!

I figure that’s behind a lot of mods that would be simpler and much quicker just to trade up to a mill with those features built in. And if you count your time thinking it all out, gathering pieces and parts, putting it together, getting it to work, then modifying it when it fails or falls short, you could have more in it than the upgrade.

Our first mill was an LT40 manual mill. I bought the log turner parts and one toe board (old blade style) from WM and added a 220v 2gpm pump and two valves. We used it for years and it worked well enough. But it was still limited. One thing I had to always be sure the manual back supports were up before I used the turner else I could roll a log right off the back.

A couple of years back Mary and I were all ready to get a new mill. But the new mills didn’t show any advancement or improvement over the model we have. And I’d have to rework a new mill to match the changes I’ve made to our 2002 model.

Just my thoughts, but be cautious of too much automation because things can happen real quick when you’re two steps away.

fred in montana · « **Reply #17 on:** February 07, 2011, 09:03:44 pm »

Money is also a factor. I added the power backstops, turner, leveler and clamp for about $575 parts and about 40 hours work. I didn't count my time as it was "fun" work.

The power feed should be a fairly quick add on since the LT 15 already has the crank system.

(We'll see, you never know until you get into it I guess).

I hope the motor is up to it. I did by the 1/8 HP. If it isn't, I will find another use for it.

bandmiller2 · « **Reply #18 on:** February 07, 2011, 09:11:23 pm »

Be aware some of the makeshift electrical components don't fare well out in the weather,most should have a roof over their heads. Frank C.

pyrocasto · « **Reply #19 on:** February 07, 2011, 10:36:18 pm »

10amp controller with a 9 amp motor is not going to be enough. That motor will pull 12-20 with a load of cutting through wood. I have a wheelchair motor that pulls 7 amps when lowering my saw head, and over 30 when raising it.

If you run a 24v 9amp motor at 12v you will still run around the same amperage. You're dropping voltage, witch drops speed not torque.

fred in montana · « **Reply #20 on:** February 08, 2011, 06:45:48 am »

Quote from: pyrocasto on February 07, 2011, 10:36:18 pm

10amp controller with a 9 amp motor is not going to be enough. That motor will pull 12-20 with a load of cutting through wood. I have a wheelchair motor that pulls 7 amps when lowering my saw head, and over 30 when raising it.

If you run a 24v 9amp motor at 12v you will still run around the same amperage. You're dropping voltage, witch drops speed not torque.

Good info. I haven't bought the controller yet so will look at for a 40 amp or higher.

pyrocasto · « **Reply #21 on:** February 09, 2011, 12:17:23 am »

Now remember you probably wont jump as high as mine pushing forward/reverse(mine doesnt), and you can also adjust the speed/amperage ratio with sprocket size. Sometimes that can save your wallet some on a controller by sacrificing a little speed.

After running mine tonight I am running 12 volts through the cut, and changing the reverse to 24v. Way too much time for me going back and I have a 24v and 12v system.

fred in montana · « **Reply #22 on:** February 09, 2011, 08:28:40 pm »

Quote from: pineywoods on February 07, 2011, 06:36:41 pm

Fred, another good source is electric wheel chairs. There's 2 motors, one for each side. The motors are 24 volt with a built in worm drive reduction box. Still have plenty of power on 12 volts. I have one hooked up as an autoclutch on my mizer. It lifts the wm motor easily. The speed controller may or may not work on 12 volts.

Unfortunately I had already ordered the motor. I think the wheelchair motors may be the best option.

The motor came in today. It is a 3 phase DC brushless motor. I never knew there was any such thing as a 3 phase DC motor. I may have to put it back on ebay unless I can find a brushless motor controller.

Does anyone know where I can find one? Not having much luck searching the net.

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Author Topic: Power feed- how about this motor and controller? (Read 1995 times)