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Author Topic: Greenpeace the reason for logging industry decline????  (Read 1507 times)

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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: Greenpeace the reason for logging industry decline????
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2011, 07:21:57 am »
But, you're not talking about a green problem as much as you are a past practices problem and government interference in business.  The government went the value added route, which is what hurt your small businesses.  I'm convinced they want to get rid of small businesses since its easier to control a few large ones than several small ones.  This seems to happen in all governments, so its nothing new. 

But, you talk about being forced into lower quality wood, since the higher quality wood has been locked up.  I'm not sure of the specifics, but I have done work in an area where there was a high proportion of government owned wood and a good proportion of privately owned wood.  The talk amoung the loggers was the same 20 years ago as today.  All the good quality wood was on the government land, and they had it locked up.

That was true mainly due to the way that landowners used their land as an ATM, and the industry used mining techniques instead of management techniques in timber harvesting.  The selective logging was just a technique to get the best and leave the rest.  Its a practice that still goes on.

Meanwhile, the state has a lot of other products and issues to maintain.  I don't see our state being controlled or even influenced by green organizations, let alone extreme greenies.  They also aren't controlled by the whims of the industry.  They maintain sustainable management practices that insure good quality wood, provide habitat for a wide range of wildlife, protect scenic values, provide areas for recreation.  They also turn a profit.  They routinely take out pulpwood from species that won't make good products down the line.  That is almost non-existent in private sales.  I'm not seeing a downside in this.

Private lands continue to be logged in a "sustainable" manner with no checks on the management.  Logging practices have improved, and the loggers did this through state interference.  Greenie involvement?  I don't know, but it was a practice that was needed in some cases.  But, the cut the best and leave the rest practices still remain.  Even an industry led effort doesn't stem that since there are no checks or balances. 

As I said before, I don't think the green movement has all the answers, or that we should even follow any of their recommendations.  But, I don't think an industry led management scheme is the right road to go down, either. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Online SwampDonkey

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Re: Greenpeace the reason for logging industry decline????
« Reply #21 on: January 27, 2011, 07:37:13 am »
I don't think an industry led management scheme is the right road to go down, either. 

I agree, but it seems to be the way we are headed. A license holder of crown is looked at as if he owns my land and if you want any share of it you are told to deal with the license. When you go to the government, they say the license has the say in it's management. Maybe I want a share of the say. Too bad.  :-X The licenses have preached for as long as I can remember, cheap wood, competition, most efficient way to harvest it (machines and clear cutting), maintain the jobs we have now (union and company, harvest and silviculture contractors your on your own), then the government is expected to pay for all the silviculture. Forestry department staff continue to be down sized and offices closed. And many seasonal employees, so they don't have to pay out benefits or future pensions.

Pre-commercial thinning pays off. :)

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Offline jim king

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Re: Greenpeace the reason for logging industry decline????
« Reply #22 on: January 27, 2011, 08:44:15 am »
Let me give you a preview of a show coming to the theater near you sooner than you think.

1:  Prohibited cutting on private land without a harvest plan.
2:  Enviornmental impact study on logging area.  Detailed bridge design and topography layout etc. with GPS points on each tree to be cut.
3:  GPS control on skidders and transport vehichles and indivual permits for each time a truck is loaded.
4:  Physical inspection of wood prior to leaving logging site for volume and verification of the stumps..
5:  Each log marked with logging permit number with 30 cm high letters and numbers prior to leaving logging site.
6:  Chainsaws registered with the DNR
7:  Carpenter shops and home workshops registered with the DNR with operating plan
8:  Permits for firewood cutting on private land
9:  Sawmill incoming and outgoing volumes controlled by the DNR and tax authority
10:  Any violations of about 60 steps are criminal and jail time

1a:  The "Lacy Act" governing trade of any wood coming into the US.  Fines , confiscation and jail time if the above is not perfect for importer and exporter.  This is in effect now but the govt does not yet have the staff to enforce it.  But several trial arrests have been made. 
http://www.eia-global.org/lacey/P6.EIA.LaceyReport.pdf

Quote
Criminal felony fine (up to $500,000 for corporation, $250,000 for individual, or twice maximum gain/loss from transaction). Possible prison for up to five years. Forfeiture of products.
This is just a summary and just the beginning.

Offline Meadows Miller

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Re: Greenpeace the reason for logging industry decline????
« Reply #23 on: January 27, 2011, 08:59:27 am »

Jim that sounds like the show we have running here atm it just has not finished yet Mate   :) :) ??? ::) Is it called "" The Destruction Of An Industry "" ??? ???  ;) :D :D  ???  If it is its gonna be a sad one  :) :) :( :'( :'(
Jackson Lumber Harvester RMP 50" Manual Circular Mill #132 with Jackson Lumber Harvester Portable Edger, Meadows #2 delux manual circular sawmill & Edger, 1997 International 4700 Flatbed

 


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