one ton sufficient?

[Ironwood]

Dont forget medical card, log book and pretrip inspection if your hauling heavy. We could go on and on, triangles, fire extinguiser, combo plate, blah blah. Of course RV's are exempted here in Pa. to my knowlege As if some retired overweight guy driving it isn't as liable to have an accident, (perhaps strong RV lobby?)

 Ironwood

[stonebroke]

U-Hauls are exempted also. So somebody never drove anything bigger than a hydundai can move his household goods.

Stonebroke

[treefarmer87]

im getting ready to buy a pintle trailer for hauling my c5 i believe it weighs about 15,000. im gonna get this older triple axle trailer rated @ 20,000.

[gunman63]

If your skidder weighs 15000, trailer cant weigh over 5000 to be legal, im guessing if trailer is good for 20000 gross it weighs over 5000 lbs.

[stonebroke]

If i trailer is good for 20,000 it is going to weigh more then 5,000 lbs

Stonebroke

[Gary_C]

Dont forget medical card, log book and pretrip inspection if your hauling heavy. We could go on and on, triangles, fire extinguiser, combo plate, blah blah. Of course RV's are exempted here in Pa. to my knowlege As if some retired overweight guy driving it isn't as liable to have an accident, (perhaps strong RV lobby?)

 Ironwood

Are you saying all retired guys are overweight or is it that all overweight guys are retired? 

This whole question of pulling big trailers, RV or otherwise with pickups is a very slippery slope for both the law enforcement and drivers. There are so many rules and exceptions that it ends up being more a question of how much trouble you get into when you get stopped or as others have said the mood of the law enforcement that stopped you at the time. Most all of the laws are based on the FMCSA rules that all states have been forced to adopt plus the states all have other rules that enter into the fray.

For example in Minnesota, the state licenses all 3/4 ton pickups as passenger vehicles only and will fine you if you buy a truck license for that pickup. The reason is the passenger vehicle license costs as much as 5 times more that a weight rated truck license. The problem is there is no law that allows them to even weight you with a passenger vehicle license. But if you hook a trailer up to that passenger vehicle and the combination GVWR is over 26,000 lbs, they may declare you a truck subject to the truck laws. But they still cannot weight you.

And yes, the AARP among others have demanded and got exemptions for RV's and the state enforcement has no appetite for dealing with angry old retired and yes sometimes overweight guys. 

Plus it depends on if you are staying within your home state. If you have to cross state borders all rules change and many of the more restrictive rules apply.

I have hauled many loads, big and small, one by mistake that weighed 48,000 lbs on a gooseneck trailer behind both a 3/4 ton and one ton dualy. It was not so much a problem pulling them as it was stopping them that is a problem, especially with those electric brakes. The better braking system for those bigger trailers behind a pickup would be vacuum over hydraulic, but that requires a vacuum pump on the truck and hydraulic brakes on the trailer.

The other problem is your tire rating. That is the first thing a DOT guy will look at when evaluating load carying ability of your trailer. Look at the rating on each tire and add all tire ratings up and that will be the maximum you are allowed to carry.

The answer for the question is that a one ton can haul that load with a good gooseneck trailer with enough load rating. But you have to maintain those brakes and tires and drive defensively at all times. And know all the laws and stay as far away from those DOT guys as you can. In other words, stay out of trouble and look safe and they will probably leave you alone.

[maple flats]

Before I had my own mill, I hauled some logs on a 7000# GVW trailer that I am sure were way over then hauling capacity of the little Olds Bravada I pulled it with. I hope to never exceed weight capacities that much again. It was an 18' solid deck car haul trailer and I loaded it with 2 layers of logs, many 16 and a few 18' long and averaged about 19-20" DBH on the butt logs. I only had to go about 2 miles with no hills, but I surely would have had problems stopping if a little kid ran into the road. I had load equalizer springs on the hitch which was the only way I kept the front wheels on the road. After that I vowed to use a truck meant for the task I ask it to do. I also have my CDL which would have been in jeopardy had I gotten caught. They don't go easy on those who know better but do it any ways. The main reason I've decided to have the right truck is because I thought later how foolish I was if a kid ran out in the road. I will not take those chances again. Too much at risk.

[woodmills1]

CDL liscence required for truck over 26000

any trailer over 10000 requires, fire extinguisher, flares/triangles. seat belt, first aid, chocks, inspection, medical card  and more I can't remember right now

any combination over 26000 with over 10000 trailer requires CDL A

these trailer rules are federal so  beyond states



MY OPINION


if you are hauling a trailer over 10000 pounds GVW read the federal DOT rules and comply....as said it is not if you can get it done...it is what if a mobile home driven by a young bad driver crashes into you and you are faulted due to lack of paperwork...your insurance company just might bail

happy motoring

[sjfarkas]

our 20000lbs gooseneck weighs 4500lbs so we could haul 15500lbs

[ohsoloco]

For example in Minnesota, the state licenses all 3/4 ton pickups as passenger vehicles only and will fine you if you buy a truck license for that pickup. The reason is the passenger vehicle license costs as much as 5 times more that a weight rated truck license.

That's interesting.  Here in PA a passenger vehicle registration costs $36 (or something close to that).  Half ton pickup is fifty-something, 3/4 ton is $85, and a one ton is $156.  According to how my truck is registered, I can haul 200 pounds more than the GVWR on the door sticker 

[Gary_C]

Here in Minnesota, Land of 10,000 Taxes, there was a time when a new 3/4 ton pickup could cost as much as $600 per year for license, which was based mostly on value. However they lowered that somewhat as it was excessive and now the max I believe is somewhere around $400 per year and it goes down every year of age till it gets down to about $75 per year.

On the other hand, a 1 ton truck license costs $125 per year and stays the same as it gets older. But in the past, some DOT guys have consficated those truck licenses if they caught people driving to work, to the grocery store, or to church and made the driver park the vehicle and buy the high priced passenger version. And no refunds on the consficated truck license.

But then the conflict was there is no provision in the law for even checking the weight of any passenger vehicle.

Yes, those pickup license requirements are a mess. But for the most part the DOT will leave you alone as long as you do look OK. But I think the DOT does shake their heads and probably closes their eyes when someone goes by with a pickup or a car pulling some questionable looking trailer. But they can get real pissy if it looks like you are doing something for profit. That's illegal you know. 

[Ironwood]

In some states, sales tax revenues and general fund "taxes' are linked to vehical values and such. It would be more realistic to just sales tax stuff and keep vehical registrations reasonable it keeps folks like us from being creative Idaho or Washington was one such state 15 years ago. I guess Minnestota also.

 Ironwood

[barbender]

My gooseneck is only 14K, so obviously if my skidder weighs 14k then I would be overweight by the weight of the trailer. But, I run the machine right to the front of the trailer so there is quite a bit of the weight on the truck. I've never ran it across a scale, but I'm willing to bet I'm legal on the trailer weight. I intend to run it across the truck scale at work to see where everything sits.

[Gary_C]

That brings up a good point. Makes no difference how much weight you are carying, it's the total of the GVWR's of your vehicle and trailer that determines if you are over 26,000 lbs. and need a CDL and all the other goodies.

[barbender]

I'd add that the terrain is pretty flat in this area, I would be much more apprehensive of using this setup in mountains. BTW, surge brakes are illegal here if I am not mistaken. We had a 14k trailer we had to convert to electric brakes at work a few years back to pass DOT inpections, they had outlawed them that year. That was fine by me, I thought those surge brakes were about the worst thing this side of no brakes. Maybe there are some that were better, but these would cause the tow vehicle to really get bouncing, they about sent me out of control several times. I would truly rather have had no trailer brakes.

[Dave Shepard]

Pulling a load that has a gross of about 9 ton with a truck that weighs about 3.5 ton is just plain crazy. IMO. That size truck was not designed to pull that size of payload. Yes they will pull it and if you are careful it will also stop it but at what cost? How often do you need to move it? For that size combination you must have a class 1 CDL to drive it unless you try to run farm plates and if you check with the RMV in your state you may not be able to run farm plates. If I had a machine of that size I would let someone else haul it and not have to worry about the liability.

Just to play devil's advocate here, are you saying a 10,000 lb single axle tractor shouldn't haul a 40,000 lb. trailer? A gooseneck trailer puts a lot of weight onto the truck, making it a much safer combo than a bumper hitch trailer.

[bill m]

A single axle tractor is not a 1 ton. A 1 ton does not have heavy enough springs, axles, drive shafts, transmissions and all other related components to be pulling a load of that size. Tractors ( single, tandem, or tri axle) are designed to pull.

[Dave Shepard]

The GCVW on one tons has been creeping up, I don't know just how far. I think that most one tons do have a sufficient driveline, or at least my Dodge does. While I don't advocate doing the things I do, it's held up to loads in the range of 30,000lbs combined weight. My truck has a Dana 80 rear axle, and a driveline that is about as big as most of the single axle IH trucks I've worked on that are under CDL. The Cummins engine uses a No.2 bellhousing and a clutch that would be the same size as if it was in an F-800/FL-70 sized truck. My truck has 167k on it with the original U-joints, and makes 1,200 ft/lbs of torque. I don't see a catastrophic clutch or driveshaft failure in this setup. You are allowed to put 15% of the trailer weight on the truck. Now you are at 9850/16,150 weight distribution between the truck and trailer. The 2,850 weight transfer doesn't overload the trucks weight rating.

Weight break down:
Truck-7,000? (big variable here)
Trailer-5,000
Skidder-14,000
15% weight transfer-2,850

Legality is another issue. I'm not saying anyone should go out and try to haul anything, this is purely hypothetical.

[woodmills1]

one more thing, say you are registered correctly at 25,500 pounds, so no CDL.  Then you get pulled over and with a load you actually weigh 27,000 pounds, not just overweight but no CDL...could get interesting

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

You blokes have got too many state rules   Overhere we have things pretty simple a ute/pickup can only tow a trailer with a max weight of about 8000lbs   on a car licence

then you get into truck licences

Light rigid is about 10000lbs payload 2 axle single drive or 4x4

Medum rigid is upto about 18000lbs payload 2 axle single axle drive or 4x4

Heavy Rigid will let you have upto about 30000lbs payload form bogie drive 3 axle truck upto tridrive twinnsteer  
 
MR & HR will let you pull a single or dual axle trailer with a total weight of 19000lbs on its own without upgrading to a Heavy combinaton licence  

Then you move into Heavy Combinations eg Articulated  Semis  

HC is from a 2 axle singledrive pulling a single axle trailer upto a twinsteer bogiedrive Primemover and trailer with upto 4 dual wheel axles

MC Is B doubles & Roadtrains upto about 180ton or 360,000lbs gross weight pulling 3 trailers but they are on restricted routes around australia  

asfar as Rego is concerned a 30000lb gross weight single drive traytruck like the Acco is $1200 au pa for rego and a bogie drive Primemover and triaxle trailer will set you back about $6000 pa  including Tac insurance Transport Accedent Commision insurance is to cover the third partys Hospital ,Care and Rehab costs in the state of Victoria but also covers any Vic regod veihical in any state if you have a prang  

stamp duty is $40 per thousand of the approx value of the vehichal whenever it changes hands and is re Regod roadworthy by the new owner   but most put it down as the bare min if its a private sale  

Utes and Cars will set you back Between $350 and $550 pa inc Tac and 10%gst depending on how many seats they have   My ute costs $350 pa in rego costs

asfar as Licences go they are either 3,5 or 10 year terms a 3 year licence will cost about $80 total  

Car licences are State by State and Truck Licences are a National Licence to stop prof truckies having upto 8 different tickets  at one time

Regards Chris