Dolmar or Stihl

[cmills]

I'm looking at getting a new saw in the 50cc range, I've always had good luck with Stihl but I was visiting a different dealer the other day that carried Dolmar and they started talking about how good they are, so I went home and did some research and have heard a lot of good things about them.  I'm curious what you guys think, are they as durable and reliable as the Stihls are?  From most of the things I've read they cut just as good if not better in a lot of comparisons but with that said I would rather have a little slower cutting saw that is reliable than a fast cutting one that has more problems.  I did read somewhere where they said that the Dolmars air filters didn't do quite as good as job as others, is this true?  The saws that I am looking at between the two are the Stihl MS 260 pro and the Dolmar PS-5100 S.  If anybody has any experience with these two I would appreciate your opinion.


               Thanks,
                           Cory

[sawguy21]

Both are good saws. Dolmar had some issues with pistons seizing but most were found to be due to the factory carb settings. The saws were set too lean out of the box to meet emission standards and not properly set up  before delivery. The 5100 has been replaced by the 5105.
The Stihl MS260 is a solid little work horse, has been around for years, but needs updating. The air filtration system is not the best for our conditions, it tends to ice up.

[cmills]

I assume they have corrected the Piston problem?

[Ianab]

I assume they have corrected the Piston problem?

Well the "fix" would be telling the dealers to tune them right before giving them to customers, and bringing them back after 5 or 10 tanks of gas for another adjust.

Factory tuning is never going to be perfect as it depends on temperature, altitude and the makeup of your local fuel.

I have a Dolmar and 2 Stihls, and would recommend either of them.

Ian

[ladylake]

 They,re both good saws. The Dolmars has a little more power, cost less and needs the carb tuned, if set with a tach around 13500 to 13700 shoud be safe, not the 14300 EPA setting. The 260 cost more is lighter and seem to have the carb set better as they come. It's a good idea to learn how to tune a carb no matter what brand you run, different gas, temps and alitude all make a difference.   Steve

[cmills]

Do all the Dolmars have issues with the tachs being set wrong from the factory or is it just the 5100 S?  I ask because I am also looking at the 7900 also.  I suppose if they all have issues it would be a good idea investing in a tach so I could adjust it.

[Mad Professor]

Stihl is replacing the 260 with a 261.  It's listed on their german website.

16 % more power, and weight

[boobap]

isn't the new 261 like around 5 cc's bigger as well, hence the power gain, but what would 5 or so cc's equate to in fuel cost increase?

[windthrown]

261 is a completely different beast. It will likely not be out here until the end of the year. The 261 looks like a more powerful saw with not much more weight. The 261 has the exact same displacement as the 260 does: 50.2cc. 261 weighs 1.9 kilos, and has 2.8 Kw power. The 260 weighs 1.8 kilos and has 2.6 Kw power. This is off the German Stihl site.

I would get a Husky 346xp if you want the best in 50cc class saw. I looked at the Dolmar 5100s here and they are all plastic. They also have a lot of problems (air leaks, need to be detuned from German gas, lots of them have been burning up here in the states). I have four 026s, and I love those saws. But they are an old design. I would pass up the new 260 "Pro" for the 346xp. And try to get the one w/o the cat in the muffler. $500 around these parts for either the 5100s and the 346xp.

[ladylake]

 The Dolmar 5100 is all plastic??    Steve

[Al_Smith]

As a general statement I think you will  find that most new saws are anemic right out of the box . I also think people rely too heavily on a tachometer .

[ladylake]

No tach here, just tune them so the cut the fastest in bigger wood and you won't be lean. Fuel makes torque and power.    Steve

[jteneyck]

isn't the new 261 like around 5 cc's bigger as well, hence the power gain, but what would 5 or so cc's equate to in fuel cost increase?

The new EPA compliant saws are said to be up to 20% more fuel efficient compared to the saws they are replacing.  So you won't see a fuel penalty on the new saws, at least out of the box.  If you retune it those efficiency gains may go away, but I would guess you would end up no worse than equal afterwards.

What saw you end up getting should be based on your needs.  If you're cutting 10 cords a year for heating you don't need a pro saw.  IMO, you're spending money needlessly.  If you're cutting 10 cords a week, well then, a pro saw is a requirement.  Good luck.   

[567paloggger]

I own 2 dolmar 5100s and i love the saws but i did have some problems with them right away they were shutting off when i would cut and i cut alot of trees 6 days a week. They are nice saws but i dont think i will buy another one again for the same amount of money id get the 346xp if you dont like husky go with the stihl it will last forever even if i was a firewood cutter i would buy a pro saw i like the adjustable oilers which you dont get with a mid range saw the 260 pro is nice firewood saw as well as the 346xp

[lumberjack48]

Any of these saw are as good as their owner, some need a little more care then others.

I'm a true logger by trade, if i wanted a saw for 20 cords of firewood a yr., in stead of buying one Stihl for $450.00 to $600.00, i would buy 5 Refurbished wild things, you would be set up for many years.

[windthrown]

A 'true' logger recommending a WildThing?  

 

I had a WildThing once. I would rather have one 260 than 10 refurbished (or even new) WildThings. The 260 will actually work. I put up 10-20 cords of firewood a year, and I use my 026s and 361s for that (and the 044 now and then).

I never saw a logger run a WildThing in the PNW. Or any Poulan saw for that matter. Ever. I have been living in logging country for most of my life. I was also a logger once... or twice. Now most of us are unemployed.  

[windthrown]

The Dolmar 5100 is all plastic??    Steve

The new black 5100s that I looked at had an all plastic shell. I was surprised. Those saws look cheap in person.

The 346 is also mostly plastic, but it has a completely tight and professional feel to it. Different world. Even the clear plastic 346 demo saw had a great feel to it. I wanted to buy that one, but they would not sell the clear demo model (they said that Husky owns them all and they cannot be sold).

[ladylake]

    Windy     Which saws now days have anthing but plastic on the outside?  Cheap plastic, expensive plastic?  Seems like you just don't like Dolmar saws, no need to bash them.   They're a good well built saw, lots of power and priced reasonable.  Steve

[peppone]

I have a ps 5000 dolmar and it works better than stihl 260. more power, more handable.

[windthrown]

   Windy     Which saws now days have anthing but plastic on the outside?  Cheap plastic, expensive plastic?  Seems like you just don't like Dolmar saws, no need to bash them.   They're a good well built saw, lots of power and priced reasonable.  Steve

I do not like Dolmar saws, or their distributors, or their way that they do business in the states. If you do not like my opinion about them, that is too bad. My advice to Dolmar is for them to get their act together regarding issues with the 5100s, and man do they need to work on their distribution in the USA. As far as Dolmar 5100s competition goes, the Stihl MS260 and the Husky 346xp II seem to have way better quality. But that's just my opinion. The Husky 346xp is also the exact same price here as a Dolmar 5100s. $500.00 for either one. In my book, that is a no brainer decision. And I am a Stihl guy....

Lots of plastic on saws these days, yes indeed. But lots of saws still have a lot of metal on them, like the Stihl pro saws. And there is cheap plastic, and there is plastic that holds up over the years. My 026s have a lot of plastic and they are 10 years old, and still running. The plastic has not given out, even with a lot of abuse. My Echo saws have all fallen apart on me now. Cheaper plastic, they are not built as well, and they simply do not hold up. Uh oh, now I am Echo bashing too... my bad!

Of course they are miles ahead of the Poulan WildThing...

[ladylake]

Dolmar saws have just as much metal as pro Stihl or Husky saws, over here a new 5100 can be bought for $385. Dolmar has some good dealers, not a lot. Echo does not have cheap plastic, after tipping a tree on one the handle bar was toast, bar bent like a pretzel but no broken plastic.  Maybe we ought to start bashing all the Stihl saws except maybe the bigger pro saws, it's been a long time since I've cut with a Stihl saw that has impressed me but I'd blame most of that on poor maintance     Steve

[lumberjack48]

I see i only got 7 for bringing up the green word, not to bad. But like i said a saw's only as good as is its owner. I'm a Stihl man through a through, a Dolmar or Stihl, i would go with the closest dealer and the best dealer, there can always be a bad apple in the bunch. When i ran Husky, i always kept a turn over, the dealer would use my new saw warranty's to fix my older one's, at one time i had 9,  266's, i had 4 men working for me.
I would buy a Pro 290 for all around use , my next choice a 460 Magnum.

Be happy, guys

[Al_Smith]

But like i said a saw's only as good as is its owner.

That pretty much tells the tale .You could take that Poulan wild thing and get years of service out of it or on the flip side trash out an Ms 660 in about a week .--but then some people could destroy an anvil with a feather given enough time ----

[SawTroll]

I assume they have corrected the Piston problem?

There is no evidense that they did, as they won't apply with EPA standards if they did. What they (DolmarUSA) have done is admitting that there is an issue (not in public), but it is the dealers that have to "fix" it, by tuning the carbs richer. Apparntly, they haven't trained ther dealers well enough though, and the last I heard is thatmany dealers have been giving up on Dolmar lately, at least in parts of the US - because Dolmar won't stand behind their product (warranty claims related to this issue). My source for this info is very reliable, but I can't say who it is.

My 5100S has been OK, but it was sold by a good dealer, and the rpm/carb setting has been monitored closely with a tach. The issue was known of already when I bought it in 2007.

[SawTroll]

Dolmar saws have just as much metal as pro Stihl or Husky saws, .....

Allmost, but not quite on the 50cc saws.

The difference is the clutch cover that is plastic on the Dolmars, and Mag on the Stihl and Husky. The case is Mag on the 5100S, like on the MS260 and 346xp/CS2153.

I agree that the Dolmar plastic have a more "plasticy" feel to it, but it looks like it holds up just as well.

[lumberjack48]

The tale is i could take any saw, run it to its expectations and get good service out of it. My saw's were my life, if they didn't run my family didn't eat, same with the skidder's, this is the life of a logger.
I had two Stihl's that were on the job 8 years, 038 Magnum and a 044 Magnum. After i got hurt, my wife helped me keep the job going 6 years, we quit because you can't  find good help.
After we quit, i gave one son a 028 , sold the 038 for $200.00 [deal] gave two 044's to the other boy for a firewood saw's [he sold firewood] gave my father a 034, he needed a firewood saw. Sold a C5D Treefarmer [353] and a S8 International  [353] Funk Auto. This is hard to do after 30 yrs in the game, it turned to dog eat dog. I've been in this wheelchair 21+ year's, [Doc's gave me 5 yrs to live]  after all the yrs, I'm still logging at night. The thing is guys, live every day to its fullest, [ [I have typed a profane word that is automatically changed by the forum censored words program I should know better] happens]

[peppone]

Dolmar saws have just as much metal as pro Stihl or Husky saws, .....

Allmost, but not quite on the 50cc saws.

The difference is the clutch cover that is plaspic on the Dolmars, and Mag on the Stihl and Husky.

the clutch cover of the husqvarna e-series is in plastic as well. and even the piston-rod cover is in plastic...that's worse.

[SawTroll]

the clutch cover of the husqvarna e-series in in plastic as well. and even the piston-rod cover is in plastic...that's worse.

HUH!  

What do those saws have to do with pro 50cc saws?    


You are quite a bit off here!  

[peppone]

I don't think to be off topic. I was just answering to somebody who says that in dolmar saws there is plastic more than in husqvarna. I was just explaining that in dolmar and husqvarna saws there is the same plastic in the same place: it's up to the line, if professional or not professional.

saluti
peppone

[windthrown]

Dolmar saws have just as much metal as pro Stihl or Husky saws, over here a new 5100 can be bought for $385. Dolmar has some good dealers, not a lot. Echo does not have cheap plastic, after tipping a tree on one the handle bar was toast, bar bent like a pretzel but no broken plastic.  Maybe we ought to start bashing all the Stihl saws except maybe the bigger pro saws, it's been a long time since I've cut with a Stihl saw that has impressed me but I'd blame most of that on poor maintance     Steve

I bash a lot of Stihl saws too, and I am a StihlHead. But in the lower end, I would take an 025 over any same size Echo saw out there. The plastic is cheaper in the Echos. Over time the threads strip, and the stuff just fails or falls apart. I have had a lot of Echo saws, and a lot more Stihls. No comparison. I am no fan of the new strato Stihl saws either, BTW. More weight... more money.

[miking]

My old 025 from ten years ago would have run right over my new Echo 370, but that same Echo would run a new 250 right out of the woods. I've run all three extensively and think myself a pretty good judge of what's what here. I really don't think I'm bashing Stihl in this regard but I do think it's a case of Echo saws catching up to, and perhaps surpassing, their competition.

[ladylake]

Dolmar saws have just as much metal as pro Stihl or Husky saws, over here a new 5100 can be bought for $385. Dolmar has some good dealers, not a lot. Echo does not have cheap plastic, after tipping a tree on one the handle bar was toast, bar bent like a pretzel but no broken plastic.  Maybe we ought to start bashing all the Stihl saws except maybe the bigger pro saws, it's been a long time since I've cut with a Stihl saw that has impressed me but I'd blame most of that on poor maintance     Steve

I bash a lot of Stihl saws too, and I am a StihlHead. But in the lower end, I would take an 025 over any same size Echo saw out there. The plastic is cheaper in the Echos. Over time the threads strip, and the stuff just fails or falls apart. I have had a lot of Echo saws, and a lot more Stihls. No comparison. I am no fan of the new strato Stihl saws either, BTW. More weight... more money.
[/quote


 A lot of Echo saws I've had apart have brass inserts where they need them, never found even one on a Stihl saw . Any new Echo the same cc as a 025 or MS250 will cut faster and last longer than a 50 or 150 hour rated Stihl. Echo saws are  rated at 300 hours , the reason being they are biult better.  If you want to compare Stihl to Echo you better use thier pro saws.   Steve

[Rocky_J]

The hour ratings have nothing to do with build quality or expected life span. Hour ratings are strictly an EPA score of how long the machine is expected to remain in compliance with emissions standards. Any argument attempting to use EPA hour ratings to imply quality or life expectancy are null and void. 

[ladylake]

 The argument above is null and void .  Don't you think Stihl would put a 300 hour EPA rating on thier cheapers saws if they could and the saw would hold up to specs that long,  the cheap Stihl  saws ARE built cheap    Steve

[SawTroll]

I don't think to be off topic. I was just answering to somebody who says that in dolmar saws there is plastic more than in husqvarna. I was just explaining that in dolmar and husqvarna saws there is the same plastic in the same place: it's up to the line, if professional or not professional.

saluti
peppone

OK, but you are wrong anyway regarding pro 50cc saws - the Dolmars have a "plastic" clutch cover, vs a Mag one on the Huskys.  I also believe the PS5000 have a "plastic" handlebar as well, unlike the 5100S and the Huskys.

Another difference is that Husky still use Mag in the same places on the "semi-pro" version (353), while Dolmar use a much heavier Alu case on the 500/510........

[windthrown]

My old 025 from ten years ago would have run right over my new Echo 370, but that same Echo would run a new 250 right out of the woods. I've run all three extensively and think myself a pretty good judge of what's what here. I really don't think I'm bashing Stihl in this regard but I do think it's a case of Echo saws catching up to, and perhaps surpassing, their competition.

Echo? Surpass Stihl? 

And sorry, but the new Stihl 250 of today has the exact same plastic, handle, and engine as the Stihl 025 of yester year. Everything is interchangable except the flippy caps and the screw in ones for the gas and oil, and the tank vent is different. I have owed over a dozen 1123 model Stihl saws, and I have torn them all down and rebuilt half of them. Half my 250s had 025 engines in them. No difference. Some had fixed jet carbs, and they suck, but that is the carb and not the saw.

[ladylake]

You finally got it right Windy, Echo surpasses Stihl in every thing but sales and I think with the junk over rated  home owner saws they sell now that they will be losing sales after people figure it out.  Polaris used to be the NO  1 selling snowmobile by far with 70% of the market, now after putting out a over rated low quality product they are down to a 15% market share. These companys can't live off thier name forever, they need to keep the quality up on all of thier products not just some of them. Right now Echo vs the Stihl home owner lineup Echo wins in every thing except sale and maybe wiegh on a couple of models. My MS170 is light, my CS370 wieghs a little more but cuts TWICE as fast  . Nothing wrong with the Stihl pro saws except price , but a simple muffer mod puts the same cc Echo right with them , and they cost way less.   Steve

[miking]

What Steve said.

[SawTroll]

The hour ratings have nothing to do with build quality or expected life span. Hour ratings are strictly an EPA score of how long the machine is expected to remain in compliance with emissions standards. Any argument attempting to use EPA hour ratings to imply quality or life expectancy are null and void. 

That sure is true! 

[ladylake]

The hour ratings have nothing to do with build quality or expected life span. Hour ratings are strictly an EPA score of how long the machine is expected to remain in compliance with emissions standards. Any argument attempting to use EPA hour ratings to imply quality or life expectancy are null and void. 

That sure is true! 

 That sure isn't true, biggest line of bs I've ever heard.  No common sence at all, don't you think Stihl would rate those cheap 50 hour saws at 300 if they could. I'm not saying they won't run more than 50 hours, just that after 50 hours they are half wore out and can't pass the EPA test .   Steve

[sawguy21]

Sorry Steve, Rocky is correct. Most manufacturers entry level saws are rated for 50 hours. Stihl does build a 300 hour version of the MS250, it's called an MS260
It's all about compliance with emission regs, a Wild Thing has the same 50 hour rating as the 250 yet they are entirely different breeds of cat.

[ladylake]

Sorry Steve, Rocky is correct. Most manufacturers entry level saws are rated for 50 hours. Stihl does build a 300 hour version of the MS250, it's called an MS260
It's all about compliance with emission regs, a Wild Thing has the same 50 hour rating as the 250 yet they are entirely different breeds of cat.

 We all know that Stihl has 50  , 150 and 300 hour saws . Echo just has 300 hour saws being as they are built better and last longer than Stihl 50 and 150 hour saws.  What is Rocky correct about, he's trying to say that the EPA hour ratings make no difference in the quility of the saw which is a pile of bs.    Steve