Author Topic: which skidder? (Read 6264 times)

treefarmer87 · « **on:** March 12, 2010, 11:42:44 am »

i was set on buying a treefarmer c5 from a good friend, but now i found a 230 E timberjack in almost perfect condition. they are both in good shape, the c5 has new tires the TJ has 75% tires. the c5 is $6600 and the TJ is $7000, the TJ is at a dealer, and i can have them both delivered. i have been told that the c5 is easier to get parts for, what about the TJ. which is the better buy? thanks

HolmenTree · « **Reply #1 on:** March 12, 2010, 03:57:55 pm »

Take the TJ 230. Parts are no harder to find for a 230 then a C5. I've run and cut for both and found the 230 took a little longer to get used to operate over the C5, but the 230 was the better machine for cut & skid.
People who weren't familiar with the 230 would say "the 230 has poor operator visability from the left side off set cab. You can only mount and dismount from one side."
Well the 230 was designed for one thing and that was cable skidding off a straight face on a block or strip of timber. The highest producers I cut for ran 230, 240 TJs. These guys would front or backblade "bunch" my swath of felled trees on a full width strip face in only one direction. That was from the left side of the machine they were sitting in.
The operator is sitting right behind the blades left side and thats the side he works with while bunching and running off limbs of the felled timber, excellent visability from this area where the cab is.
He is always working down the face in a left hand side direction. I'm following behind him limbing and topping his bunched wood. In cold winter months no limbing because the blade breaks all the limbs, only topping with the saw. When he finishes bunching at the end of my swath, I'm there to help him pull out the mainline and help him choke up 1/2 or most of his chokers [15-20 total on mainline] Then I start falling again filling in the area of the face where he just skidded from. I at most times fall 1/2 tree length deep on a straight face. Always falling 45 degrees to the face with the trees average south east lean. The very 1st tree you cut on your block to start your face and landing is in the S.E. corner.
If he had holes to back into the strip he would bunch with the front of the blade and knocking down underbrush and snow for me as he goes along. If the timber is too thick he would backblade bunch and delimb. If the trees were small and thick enough I would hand bunch fall all my wood and he would only have to back blade delimb and skid.
The TJ 230 has all its controls in front of the operator, just one low step to get on/off, winch is a breeze to use.
The Tree Farmer C5 has a high center of gravity where the operator sits. With the narrow canopy its easy to bang your head on it from side to side if your faller leaves high stumps. Don't laugh its happened to me a few times and the hard hat didn't help much.

On the C5 you have controls on both sides and in front of you, too many levers. Long ways up to get on/off and the winch is usually always hard to pull out and a PITA to maintain.
If you decide on the 230 there is one thing you must do to it, thats to add on a low steel door about 24" high at its doorway step. Many operators have broken their legs when running over a pushed down tree that was cut about 3- 6 feet from the uprighted roots. The machine would drive over the uprighted roots and then the short log would flip up inside the cab and pin the operators legs against the seat sometimes breaking them. The steel door would offer protection from this happening.
A saw can be easily carried on a 230 too. Put a cut 1/2 ways through a 8" round X 10" long log block 3 inches from the end then pound the blocks cut down onto the 1/4" X 6" steel between the fuel tank and the seat. Cut another cut 1/2 ways through the block on the seat side and that cut holds your saw in place sitting on the cover behind the forward/ reverse stick.

Willard.

quietrangr · « **Reply #2 on:** March 12, 2010, 04:52:40 pm »

Quote from: HolmenTree on March 12, 2010, 03:57:55 pm

The TJ 230 has all its controls in front of the operator, just one low step to get on/off, winch is a breeze to use.

That says just about all of it. Especially that one step part.

J_T · « **Reply #3 on:** March 12, 2010, 05:13:18 pm »

Well here goes

When i was 22 it didn't matter that much but at my age it would be hard to give me anything other than an older T J

And they are posi trac 4x4 .

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #4 on:** March 12, 2010, 05:17:14 pm »

the guy that has the treefarmer says that he likes timberjack but he like the simplicty of the treefarmer

HolmenTree · « **Reply #5 on:** March 12, 2010, 05:35:11 pm »

Quote from: treefarmer87 on March 12, 2010, 05:17:14 pm

the guy that has the treefarmer says that he likes timberjack but he like the simplicty of the treefarmer

Someone with just a woodlot is probably better of with the old C5 if he's not doing alot of skidding.
You gotta watch some of those older C5 s with the lighter planetaries, they break easy and not cheap to fix.
Willard.

Maine372 · « **Reply #6 on:** March 12, 2010, 08:08:15 pm »

the 230 is by far the more popular. more made, more still availible for sale and as parts machines.
C5 is a little more of a make-your-own job. its a chassis, and you can put whatever motor and transmission you want in it. not sure a TJ is that easy to do where the gear box sits to one side.

the TJ is full locked all the time. the inside wheel tends to tear things up when youre turning. but also gives massive amounts of traction. deeres have open diffs with a manual locker. im not as familiar with TFs so im not sure how they are set up.

neither one is obscure or hard to find parts for. but if you buy the TJ you will have to change your handle here.

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #7 on:** March 12, 2010, 08:08:23 pm »

i have 2 tracts lined up after this one, i do smaller tracts 10-50 acres but i need something to help me get 2-4 truckloads a day monday thru thursday. the treefarmer has the can car rears and axles

HolmenTree · « **Reply #8 on:** March 12, 2010, 10:12:58 pm »

Quote from: treefarmer87 on March 12, 2010, 08:08:23 pm

i have 2 tracts lined up after this one, i do smaller tracts 10-50 acres but i need something to help me get 2-4 truckloads a day monday thru thursday. the treefarmer has the can car rears and axles

TF how many cords or cubic meters are on your truckloads?
Willard

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #9 on:** March 13, 2010, 03:29:32 pm »

i can haul 1500-2000 bf on 1 load and the last load of pulpwood was 20000 lbs

HolmenTree · « **Reply #10 on:** March 13, 2010, 03:46:52 pm »

I guess I'm old fashioned. I don't calculate bf. All the pulpwood I cut was scaled in cords or cubic meter.
So you have 20,000 lb load of pulpwood, that would be approx 5,000 lbs per cord divided by 20,000= 4 cords or almost 10 cubic meters on one load.
Ok 8- 16 cords is a good day with one man cutting, skidding, bucking and loading pulpwood.
Willard

bushmechanic · « **Reply #11 on:** March 13, 2010, 08:18:29 pm »

By all means get the 230E it's a way better machine to use and HolmenTree sums it up good.I have also used both machines and would go with the Timberjack,hands down.Hey you can always change your user name to Timberjack87!

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #12 on:** March 14, 2010, 10:32:12 am »

yea i know im suprised twig farmer has commented yet

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #13 on:** March 14, 2010, 03:40:06 pm »

my brother in law and even my wife are tellin me to get the TJ mainly cause its at a dealer

Mark K · « **Reply #14 on:** March 14, 2010, 03:52:15 pm »

There both decent machines, but I prefer the TJ. Parts are fairly common, can get most parts at auto parts stores. I think the TF is decent machine also, I looked at a C5 before I bought my 225. My log buyer told me to stay away from the deutz engine but from what I heard here people seem to have good luck with them. As others have commented, TJ's are easy to get on and off of. If your setting your own chokers it saves on ya a little bit. Only down side is you tend to eat alot of snow and mud sitting behind the front tire.

stonebroke · « **Reply #15 on:** March 14, 2010, 03:57:27 pm »

Yeah but he is still young, probably does not mind climbing up and down all day. Wait till he is older.

Stonebroke

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #16 on:** March 14, 2010, 07:23:53 pm »

if i get the TJ i can also go buy another one i passed up a few months back as a back up or parts machine. i also know 5 people that have them. but the treefarmer has 4 brand new firestone forestry specials, but has a 4 cyl deutz the tires are 23.1x26s. the way i usually work is cut and drag out on monday haul tues, and the same on wed and thurs. and i like the way that detriot sounds, and im sure that 353 has got more power than the 4 cyl deutz what are the positives of a detriot or deutz which one do you guys think will last me longer?

mr T · « **Reply #17 on:** March 15, 2010, 07:58:47 am »

Sounds like a good deal either way I wish that c5 was closer id buy it Delivery cost to maine??

Mark K · « **Reply #18 on:** March 15, 2010, 06:29:53 pm »

How are the tires on the TJ? If there bald I would seriously consider the Tree farmer, if there both mechanically are in about the same shape. The tires are worth what they are asking for the Tree farmer. My 225 has a 353, it gets kinda old listening to the noise in a 10 hour day. I wouldn't be afraid to buy one again though. They are a tough motor.

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #19 on:** March 15, 2010, 08:03:24 pm »

the tires on the TJ 70-75% they are both in equal shape which is great. the c5 has just been painted. it will cost like $100 for me to get it hauled to my house. the tires on the c5 still have the blue marks on the side. i love the way the 353 sounds i want to get something that has power and can bring out lots of wood. the c5 has a 4 cyl and the TJ 353 which has more power? i like the 23.1x26s on the c5 stay up better in the swampy areas we cut better than the 18.4x26s. but the man i got my log truck from has a 230 d. the radiator is a milky color, i can buy it for around $1500. i could get the good TJ the get the other and have a spare parts machine. i just like the way i sit on the c5 and i like the big tires and plus they are brand new, the motor dosent have any grease or leaks on it.

Mark K · « **Reply #20 on:** March 15, 2010, 08:29:55 pm »

The 353 should have more power than the Deutz 4cyl. I haven't been around a Deutz other than in farm tractors. My 225 has 16.9-30 rubber and I've logged some wet areas with it. The 23.1's will hold you up a little better. Just remember that paint can cover alot of flaws.

J_T · « **Reply #21 on:** March 16, 2010, 12:24:14 am »

Also remember the T J has locker rear ends . C5 may have one in front and one in rear pulling ::)or spinning as the case may be

chevytaHOE5674 · « **Reply #22 on:** March 16, 2010, 07:51:21 am »

I'm always weary of equipment with fresh paint on it. As said paint an hide a lot of problems. I would much rather buy equipment with original paint and some rust/abuse than a thick coat of fresh paint.

240b · « **Reply #23 on:** March 16, 2010, 07:54:16 am »

The DuPont overhaul.

mr T · « **Reply #24 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:05:50 am »

Is that why Eddie Nash skidders are all so pretty??

stonebroke · « **Reply #25 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:07:55 am »

I had a farmer tell me once that the two most used tools in a local tractor dealership were a sledge hammer and a spray gun.

Stonebroke

240b · « **Reply #26 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:09:01 am »

Last time I was there looking at the carnage. I got a pretty good contact buzz from the fumes. Those boys can lay it on nice and thick w/ no runs.

240b · « **Reply #27 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:10:23 am »

That would be beat to fit paint to match.

mad murdock · « **Reply #28 on:** March 16, 2010, 11:05:51 am »

Here in the helicopter shop its" beat it to fit, file it to finish and paint to match".

Mark K · « **Reply #29 on:** March 16, 2010, 05:55:53 pm »

I bought mine right off the landing. Had about 15k bf of hard wood sitting next to it and a big pile of firewood. I made two hitches with it before I whipped out the cash. Didn't have much paint left on it. I brought it home in the fall, ran it till spring and painted it, needs paint again. Paints cheap, parts aren't

. Good luck.

Maine372 · « **Reply #30 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:13:38 pm »

remind me not to fly in a chopper!

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #31 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:40:36 pm »

the guy just bought a franklin 170 and is repainting it too, he is replacing his timberjack 240 with it. he likes a grapple skidder. talked to him last nite, the deutz motor is brand new in it. he dosent have any use for a cable skidder. when on idle the c5 has 80lbs of oil pressure. it is a nice little skidder.

bill m · « **Reply #32 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:49:59 pm »

So this c5 has a new motor, 4 new tires and a paint job and it's only $6600. Something doesn't add up. Why so cheap?

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #33 on:** March 16, 2010, 08:54:44 pm »

i dont know. i heard it run, the winch works great, fluids are fine. the winch has new parts too.

donny hochstetler · « **Reply #34 on:** March 16, 2010, 11:02:46 pm »

new power new rubber new paint what are you waiting on ? somebody else is gonna beat you to, it I"ll tell you , if I would live in your neck of the woods I"d be lookin this skidder up , go treefarmer sounds like a deal to me

mr T · « **Reply #35 on:** March 17, 2010, 07:32:50 am »

Buy it Buy it Its a deal If you dont like it and its not wider than 102 inch Ill buy it from you What year is it? Most c5 had 5cyl engine

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #36 on:** March 17, 2010, 08:26:38 pm »

its an 80s model, the man is holding it for me until next week when i go pick it up

mr T · « **Reply #37 on:** March 18, 2010, 07:14:59 am »

All right! You cant go wrong I had a friend with one ran it for years with no problems

FFLM · « **Reply #38 on:** March 18, 2010, 11:08:24 am »

We will all be waiting on pics of the new skidder! Best of luck

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #39 on:** March 18, 2010, 08:13:49 pm »

ok if i can get them on here i tried to put pics up of my last job and it didnt work
the man said it should last me a long time

lumberjack48 · « **Reply #40 on:** March 22, 2010, 06:58:15 pm »

I ran Treefarmer 30 yrs. , a C5-D was the heavy duty locking rear ends, a model 119 Gearmatic winch, a 353 Detroit [ A poor mans diesel, cheap to fix] if you like the noise or can stand it their a tough motor. I used to get about 8 yrs out of a overhaul. The main trouble with a C5 is the blade, onless its been rebuilt or beefed up right, this is a must to look at. It is a good all round horse.
A side saddle TJ is a dangerous machine to run, you have to be carefull, you can't see off it, hard to deck with, ect., othe then that its a good horse.

ford62783 · « **Reply #41 on:** March 22, 2010, 08:59:36 pm »

both are nice machines here in ny its real easy to find tj parts and detroit parts the tree farmers are getting harder without going out to vermont but the duetz parts here are scares to say the least i guess it all depends on location i run a 240e and i can tell u that the eaton parts are tough and that they are easy to find and good quality machines for the money in good shape i personally would take the tj 230e but its all preferance on ur part but after running a tree farmer for a while i will say that the tj cabs r much more protective if the tree farmer dsnt have anydoors and are much easier to get in and out of in deep snow also the tj are mcuh more protected on the belly pans than the tree farmer if the tree farmer dsnt have the plates to cover the access holes i hope u have great luck

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #42 on:** March 22, 2010, 09:24:58 pm »

im going to have the c5 delivered sometime this week hopefully

if anyone is interested there is a c5 with a grapple on ebay in good condition for $3500 with 353 detriot motor

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #43 on:** March 22, 2010, 09:33:43 pm »

heres the link
http://cgi.ebay.com/C5-Tree-Farmer_W0QQitemZ180483387593QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2a05a5f0c9

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #44 on:** March 24, 2010, 09:18:12 pm »

well looks like ill have to get the TJ 230 somebody bought the skidder today heres the one im gonna try to get now http://www.equipmenttraderonline.com/find/listing/-TIMBERJACK-230-96170823

what are your opinions on this one

Bobus2003 · « **Reply #45 on:** March 25, 2010, 01:25:52 am »

Maybe its just what i'm used too, but I think it would be a real pain in the butt having to get on and off the Left side only.. I love my 440 being able to hop out or get on from either direction.. I really Don't miss having to use all levers for steering and blade.. That was a huge downer for me when i ran a 666 Clark

240b · « **Reply #46 on:** March 25, 2010, 10:09:34 am »

Quote from: Bobus2003 on March 25, 2010, 01:25:52 am

Maybe its just what i'm used too, but I think it would be a real pain in the butt having to get on and off the Left side only.. I love my 440 being able to hop out or get on from either direction.. I really Don't miss having to use all levers for steering and blade.. That was a huge downer for me when i ran a 666 Clark

The levers are all right in front of you w/ the tj --Plus all the hydralics are in one little valve. I ran a clark and a TF and it helps to have an extra arm, things are all over the cab- in those rigs, and a far a getting out only on the left, how many times do folks get out the right side of there pick up truck? Not an issue imo.

mad murdock · « **Reply #47 on:** March 25, 2010, 11:47:56 am »

On my Garrett, all of the controls are in front, I can get out on either side but usually set up for some reason or other to get in and out on the left, as the winch lever (gearmatic 8A) is on the right, and it does require a conscious effort to not get hung up on the handle as you go past it. The left side has no obstruction. As I think now about it, it just works out that I end up getting out the left side more than the right, probably an unconscious bias on my part. I have run a Clark 666 also, and the Garrett is alot easier, even though it doesn't sport that Allison Automatic Tranny. The TJ looks like it would be alot easier to bet on and off than the TF, as you just physically don't have as high to climb. Something I am sure would become more and more appreciated as one ages.

FFLM · « **Reply #48 on:** March 25, 2010, 04:36:56 pm »

TJ's are very easy to get in and out of the cab, I would not even consider it to be a climb. Looks like an alirght skidder, but much of the time you get what you pay for.

timberjackrob · « **Reply #49 on:** March 26, 2010, 01:35:52 am »

i have a tj 208 one tough machine. u can get most all parts from aftermarket parts i think their website is rightparts.com.timberjacks are fairley easy to work on,and alot of parts such as u joints and bearings and seals can be purchased locally.the herculies winch has performed trouble free since ive owned the machine for 9 years,i think on later models they used eaton winches but i think they are the same

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #50 on:** March 26, 2010, 08:56:27 am »

I also found a franklin 170 http://www.tylosales.com/index.php?/FORESTRY/69-FRANKLIN.html in my price range, looks a little rough though, there is a 440 deere a mile down the road with a brand new motor too. im kinda confused now. i have never had a skidder and i need something for work mon- fri getting at least 2 loads a day

timberjackrob · « **Reply #51 on:** March 26, 2010, 10:41:42 am »

had a older 440 once u never had to worry about losing it u could track it by the leaking hydraulic fluid. ajohn deere is a great machine as long as everything is working actullay easier to use than a timberjack,however they are extremley hard to work on to many hydraulic parts and valves. everything is enternal even brakes require complete teardown,not to mention parts from dealer are out a site.unless u are an experienced deere mechanic iwould stay away. deeres are harder to get on and off of also.

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #52 on:** March 26, 2010, 11:20:29 am »

yea i know there is a guy that hauls to the same mill i do and he told me not to get that skidder cause it is beat up i like that 170 though

Bobus2003 · « **Reply #53 on:** March 26, 2010, 08:53:32 pm »

Quote from: timberjackrob on March 26, 2010, 10:41:42 am

had a older 440 once u never had to worry about losing it u could track it by the leaking hydraulic fluid. ajohn deere is a great machine as long as everything is working actullay easier to use than a timberjack,however they are extremley hard to work on to many hydraulic parts and valves. everything is enternal even brakes require complete teardown,not to mention parts from dealer are out a site.unless u are an experienced deere mechanic iwould stay away. deeres are harder to get on and off of also.

I have a late 60's 440 and I love it.. Its not hard to work on.. Yeah the valves are a bit complex and $$ to fix if you go to Deere.. I havent really found it hard to get any parts through Deere or that expensive.. (I also have a Complete Extra Parts Skidder). I had some issues with a Clutch a for a few weeks, but that was just a Shim issue.. Still lost on that one though

Jim H · « **Reply #54 on:** March 26, 2010, 09:16:16 pm »

TF, check Charlottesville Craigslist,there's a c5d with a detroit for $6500 in the farm and garden section.

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #55 on:** March 26, 2010, 09:38:55 pm »

i just seen that a little while ago, thanks jim it has been on there before, probably about december, the they took it off first they wanted $8500 for it then dropped it to $6500 it went off craigslist in jan i think. now its back on

treefarmer87 · « **Reply #56 on:** April 01, 2010, 07:59:40 pm »

hey jim h, thanks for the info on the treefarmer, checked it out yesterday- going to bring it home tomorrow

Jim H · « **Reply #57 on:** April 01, 2010, 10:10:23 pm »

Glad that worked out, it sounded like it might be a good machine. On another subject, do you run into much cedar on your tracts? I could use a load or two from time to time.

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Author Topic: which skidder? (Read 6264 times)