What is "shovel logging"?

[Jasperfield]

Just exactly what is "shovel logging"? I've seen it mentioned occasionally but don't know what it is.

How is it different from other Eastern US methods of logging, and does shovel logging use specialized equipment?

Here in WNC, I've never heard the term.

Jasperfield

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Jasper Its when you use an excavator (shovel) with a grapple  to pick up the logs within reach  and throw it progresevly towards the landing it gets used in wet and steep country and by blokes who only have one bit of gear 

Regards Chris

[SwampDonkey]

In BC, it's also called "Hoe Chucking" where logs are chucked roadside by excavator.

http://web.cocc.edu/logging/szlinks/shovellog.htm

[Jasperfield]

OK, thanks.

I guess I do know what it is, just didn't recognize the operation by the name.

Thanks,

Jasperfield

[barbender]

Is this method just used to move wood short distances, or do they take care of long skids this way too? The reason I ask is that I was reading a western logging publication, and the shovel loggers said they had replaced all of their skidders because this way is cheaper. Just trying to get a better understanding of how this works.

[WDH]

In the US South, shovel logging is generally used where it is very wet.  The shovel loader "shovels" the wood to a shovel road that is laid down using logs so the skidders can access the wood.  As the operation finishes, the shovel loader picks up the shovel road logs as they work their way back to the landing.  The Discovery Channel has a show where shovel logging is used.  It is called "Swamp Loggers" and is set in Eastern North Carolina.  It airs on Friday nights at 10:00 p.m. (Eastern time).

[captain_crunch]

Shovel logging is about the Quickest and cheapest way to log there is. Shovels set up for this have additional armorment and Grouser Pads rather than street pads like on loading shovels. And it will Mortify you where they will get them things while doing this

[SwampDonkey]

Where we setup a shovel logging show on a cut block was always on wet terrain and it was either a part of the block or a small block to begin with. The wood was usually poor in there.

[Jeff]

Shovel logging is about the Quickest and cheapest way to log there is.

I would have to strongly disagree with that statement as a blanket statement unless you qualified it with the conditions and terrain the geographical areas the logging is taking place. No way is shovel logging quicker nor cheaper on flat level solid ground then a conventional skidding operation.

[SwampDonkey]

In my scenario it was always considered the cheapest set up because of the quality of the wood and the small size of the area it was applied. It wasn't always steep ground, but it was usually sensitive ground, where the "side hill gougers" or known as the grapple yarder were not allowed to yard.

Supersnorkel/grapple video. Supersnorkel is a loader with log extensions for further reach.

[stonebroke]

They sure like to cut high stumps out there.

Stonebroke

[SwampDonkey]

Those high ones along the road are for anchoring the machines when yarding and possibly help stabilize the road. Sometimes a support tree is standing as well to help in the yarding where deflection isn't that great from poor road location (no deflection lines run to profile the hillside).

[Paul_H]

The stumps aren't normally cut that high.What would have happened was the road right away was fell first and as the road was built,the wood,stumps and some over burden was piled on the bottom side against the trees in some places.If the right away wood wasn't loaded out before the setting was fell,then the fallers have no choice but to leave some high stumps.
Guyline stumps don't need to be high,usually you dig down on them to get the notch as low as possible.

[stonebroke]

Aha, Would it not pay to go back after the logs are removed and cut them down?
They look like they would be a pain to work around with those machines.

Stonebroke

[Paul_H]

They could cut them off but where they are doesn't interfere with the yarding because of the height of the machines,or "lift". Having a few good stumps to pile the logs against on a steep sidehill is handy sometimes too.

[SwampDonkey]

Google "grapple yarder supersnorkel handbook"

It'll be the first hit, pretty good reading.

[thecfarm]

Not a term that is used around here either.I get a free monthly magazine called Timberline.Keeps me up to date on some of the equipment. Axman and swamp logging showed it too.

[barbender]

If it was always quicker and cheaper I think people would use it around here too. So it must be a special application. I'd like to see that swamp logging show, I saw the previews and it looked pretty interesting.

[Ron Scott]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shovel_logging

[SwampDonkey]

Ron's link references the same information page as mine above. I think if you was to explore the BC Ministry of Forests and Range or Work Safe BC websites they would have a detailed explanation of Shovel Logging/Hoe Chucking.

"Silvicultural Systems Handbook for British Columbia"  has a piece in there about it.

[rigginrat]

shovel logging out west is the cheapest way to do it, we have 2 4300 linkbelts putting 30-40 loads a day to the road. I know things out here in the pacific northwest are different then the east coast our wood is bigger,taller which puts more mbf per acre. We don't have to cover much ground to get the loads, I have never witnessed eastcoast logging , but will assume that shovel logging might not be as cost effective as it is here.

[WDH]

Compared to conventional systems here in the South with skidders, fellerbunchers, and loaders, shovel logging is not cost effective unless you are logging ground so wet that that is the only way to do it.

[rigginrat]

Wet or dry it is the cheapest here in the pacific northwest,we have fellbunchers, skidders the whole bit. Two machines two operators getting 30-40 loads a day is way cheaper than running a bunch of machines and burning fuel.It looks like to me and once again I have never seen it in person, but I would assume that eastcoast or in the south the timber is not as dense therefore you would have to cover alot of ground in order to harvest the same amount of volume, in which case skidders would be the way to go. We use skidders also for instances of long yarding or thinning. We also shovel log some pretty steep ground also and throw it down the hill where a grapple skidder or cat shuttles it to the landing.

[SwampDonkey]

Stands here in the northeast are denser, they are also planted and spaced denser. The thing is the size, you have to handle more pieces shovel logging small wood. It's quicker to process and forward small wood then even manual felling and skidding it.



This is dense maple bush we had to thin.



This was a trail 5 years after the thinning. It wasn't big wood and probably averaged around 7" for merchantable sized stems. Seems to me we cut 1300 cords of wood in two February entries including road wood. It was 90 acres. Probably 1500 cords still standing. We did it with two skidder crews and I had marked all the trails and trees, so selection was a no brainer for the cutting crews. Most wasn't skidded further than 300 feet.



Another trail after 5 years

[barbender]

Just how far will you guys out west move the wood with the shovel method? Around here it is not unusual to be skidding the wood 1/4 mile or more off the back of the cutting blocks, doesn't seem like it could be cost effective to chuck stuff that far. I am not doubting the effectiveness of shovel logging, I just don't completely understand it. BTW, if a crew around here gets 30-40 loads a week they are really in the money, that is HUGE production.

[woodtroll]

NE stands denser (more stems to the acre) maybe. NW definitely more mbf to the acre.

[SwampDonkey]

No question. Thus, why we don't shovel log here. The volume put up at the end of the day won't pay for shovel logging, handling all them small stems over and over. A mechanized crew gets more than 30 loads a week here in the east. I've seen a lot of ground cut in one week's time and piled roadside. 30 loads is only 360 cords or 12-15 acres of ground in good cutting. Some ground runs higher in volume than that, nearly 40 cord/acre and cedar runs 60 cord/acre or more. Cedar is a lot more dense than maple.

[rigginrat]

I don't like shovel logging over 500-600ft. any farther than that and we will shovel out the first 400ft. then skidder or grapple cat yard it. We are currently logging some real nice ground that is running 15-20 loads to the acre based on a 5 thousand ft. load. 40ft logs. If i can get this pict. posting thing figured out I will post some shovel logging pics. from last week.

[Ron Scott]

Yes, would like to see some photos of such operations.

[barbender]

We love pictures