20" Bar too Big for MS260 ?

[downeast]

Happy New Year ! 
Over the too many years of cutting, I've been dropping down in chainsaw sizes from Stihl 440, 028, to 260.    Still love my tiny 009 for climbing, trail work, light limbing. Most of our Downeast Maine woodlot is mixed 16" - 24", with an odd 36"+ oak left over from when the land was pasture. The harvests have been pulp ( when the market was OK ), some sawlogs, mostly 6-8 cords of firewood ( Red Maple, Paper Birch, Green/Brown Ash, some Red Oak ) each year.
The go to saw is now an MS260 with a slight muffler mod (3X the hole ). A 16" bar has worked fine for a few years without bogging in bores. But in cutting some > 30" oaks that also need the butts sliced or noodled for easier handling, the 16" bar is too short.
Anyone use a 20" bar on a 260 successfully ? Will it bog down when buried ?

[Rocky_J]

Back in the days before I upgraded, I used to run the Stihl 260s with 18" bars and I felt that was about as big as I could go comfortably. Then I discovered the Husky 346 which blew away the Stihl 260 in power. I still run 18" bars on the 346s in my stable and wouldn't want to put a 20" on them.

So in other words, no. I would not run a 20" on a Stihl 260 even with an additional 25% increase in power. Not only will it be too slow in the bigger cuts, you will also lose maneuverability and balance in the smaller stuff. If you like Stihl then consider upgrading to the 361 if you want to run a 20" bar all the time. Then keep the 260/16" as a backup and for smaller stuff. The 361 will be lighter than the old 028.

[downeast]

Thx Brian.

[fuzzybear]

I hate to disagree with you Rocky_J.   But I have been running a 20" bar for over a year now and have had no problems with it.  I use a skip tooth chain and it rips through 24" paper birch with no problems.  Just keep the bar clean.

[John Bartley]

I have an 026 with a 20" bar, and I find that as long as I keep it well sharpened it's "ok". I like the 18" bar better for balance, but for pure cutting power (like when you're blocking firewood), there's nothing like a big motor and a short bar. On an 026 that would be 16".

cheers

John

[peterc38]

I have an ms260 w/ 16" bar and .325 chain. I find the saw well balanced with this set up and it doesn't bog even in hardwood.

When I need more bar, I use a bigger saw. I have an ms361 w/ 20" bar and I am in the process of picking up a nice used 371zp too 

[windthrown]

My 026 woods ported with modified muffler will run a 20 inch bar no problem. 3/8 or .325.

Stock? 18 inch is probably the limit.

[joe_indi]

If you really want to run a 20" bar on your MS260, it is very much possible without any strain on the saw.
But, this calls for some major changes of the guide bar and saw chain.
First you got to understand that the MS260 is only a bit more powerful than the home user's MS250.
But it is a pro saw.
And its one of the few stock models(that I know of) which can rev to 14500rpm.
In the cut, with the right cutting attachment that saw can cut faster than its bigger siblings.
So, how is it done?
You will need a 20' guide bar of 0.50 gauge.The solid bar with replaceable bar nose is ideal(20" Rollomatic ES 1.3mm) Part Number. 3003 000 8621
The chain might not be available as a loop you will need to get it made from a reel.
Chain is 63PM of 72 drive links.
To run this chain you could get the 3/8" Picco Rim sprocket kit with 8 teeth sprocket recommended for the MS260. Part Number.1121 007 1040.

What you would  have would be a real mean but light machine which goes  like a hot knife through butter.

I have done this with a 026. Its a real beauty.

Joe

[windthrown]

I do not agree with some of the things you say here. I ran my 026s head to head against my 025s (before I sold my 1123 saws off), and there was no comparison. There is a point that the 025 falls off hard and fast where the 026 continues on. Similar with the difference between the 026 and the 361 in larger wood. I ran my 025s with Picco (low profile 3/8) as well; .325 bogged down too much on those saws. It is all but impossible to get Oregon mini-spline picco rim drives for the small format Stihl saws. I had to use spur sprockets. Picco bars and rims are REALLY expensive (if you can find them) compared to other size bars for the large format Stihl mounts, and rim drives are really spendy as well. The Picco setup for the large format Stihl saws was only designed and sold for the 024 saw (13.5k RPM max), and it was not designed to run on the more powerful 026 or larger saws. Stihl does not sell the picco bars with large formats in the US any more for this reason. LogoSol does sell them though. Picco is comonly used on chainsaw mill saws with larger size Stihl saws (361, 440, 460 and even 660s) and they are typically run with spur sprockets.

As for max RPM, from my Stihl manuals, all of these Stihl saws are set at 14k +/-500 RPM stock: 025/250, 023/230, 026/260, 361, 044/440. There are probably others that rev this high. The 260 will run a tad better with a .325 B&C over 3/8, but it is not noticable enough for me to keep .325 B&C and rims around. I am setting up one of my 026s to run picco with a rolomatic bar, rim and Picco chain. It will run faster, but you have to be careful running the light weight chains out there in the woods and on chainswaw mills. You are at or exceeding the limits of the chain design. 

[Skip]

Skip tooth chain is the way to go, less number of teeth equals less 'drag' to compensate for lack of hp and keeps up HP

[Al_Smith]

Skip chain is generally used on longer bars in the 30 plus inch range .

Now comes a slight problem .The MS 260/026 comes equipted with .325 chain which to the best of knowledge my isn't made in skip comfiguration nor for that matter does 3/8" lo profile  come in skip either .

Face it an 026 is a little saw it isn't an oak slayer .As such it would be okay for smaller stuff but of course would cut anything but that would just take longer is all .

In my opinion just keep a good sharp chain on it and it should do fine for a small saw .No matter what you do to it ,it will never be an 066 .

[fuzzybear]

.325 x .050 skip tooth is available thru Baileys.  It's what I use with 20" bar on my 260.

[WILDSAWMILL]

been running a 20" 325 chain on my 260 for 5 years i like it
true its not like my 064 but the 260 dont break my back

[windthrown]

Skip chain and rims are both good ways to change chain speed and torque. You can also mod the 260 to get significant gains in power.

One point of correction: the 260 comes with either the 3/8 standard ~or~ the .325 B&C&R. They can also run 3/8 low profile Picco. The 260 has the Stihl 3003 large format bar mount. You can run 3/8 standard skip or semi skip on a 20 inch bar (I have run that combination with good results). I have all but one of my 026s set up to run 3/8 standard chain, becasue that makes it easy to swap bars, chains and rims between all of my Stihl 3003 mount saws. You can also run .325 B&C&R on a 290/310/360/361 etc.

As said, the 260s are not 660s, and they are not falling or logging saws. They are great for thinning, firewood, and limbing though. Which also makes them a good firewood and arborist saw. I have a spare PNW side cover from my 066 with the large falling spikes. It also fits an 026. I will set up a 026 with that and a 32 inch bar, and show y'all what a gussied up 026 looks like. Lipstick on a pig never looked better.  No way the oiler would keep up with a bar that long... its just for show. The real usable limit for a 260 is a 20 inch bar. I tend to run mine with 16 or 18s.

[John Woodworth]

I've had my 026 which came with a 20" bar for 13 years now, what a wonderfull saw. I run full skip on it and as long as you respect it's limitations have had no problems at all.

[SawTroll]

Happy New Year ! 
Over the too many years of cutting, I've been dropping down in chainsaw sizes from Stihl 440, 028, to 260.    Still love my tiny 009 for climbing, trail work, light limbing. Most of our Downeast Maine woodlot is mixed 16" - 24", with an odd 36"+ oak left over from when the land was pasture. The harvests have been pulp ( when the market was OK ), some sawlogs, mostly 6-8 cords of firewood ( Red Maple, Paper Birch, Green/Brown Ash, some Red Oak ) each year.
The go to saw is now an MS260 with a slight muffler mod (3X the hole ). A 16" bar has worked fine for a few years without bogging in bores. But in cutting some > 30" oaks that also need the butts sliced or noodled for easier handling, the 16" bar is too short.
Anyone use a 20" bar on a 260 successfully ? Will it bog down when buried ?

Really bad idea imo, get a MS361 before they all are gone!   

[downeast]

Happy New Year ! 
Over the too many years of cutting, I've been dropping down in chainsaw sizes from Stihl 440, 028, to 260.    Still love my tiny 009 for climbing, trail work, light limbing. Most of our Downeast Maine woodlot is mixed 16" - 24", with an odd 36"+ oak left over from when the land was pasture. The harvests have been pulp ( when the market was OK ), some sawlogs, mostly 6-8 cords of firewood ( Red Maple, Paper Birch, Green/Brown Ash, some Red Oak ) each year.
The go to saw is now an MS260 with a slight muffler mod (3X the hole ). A 16" bar has worked fine for a few years without bogging in bores. But in cutting some > 30" oaks that also need the butts sliced or noodled for easier handling, the 16" bar is too short.
Anyone use a 20" bar on a 260 successfully ? Will it bog down when buried ?

Really bad idea imo, get a MS361 before they all are gone!   

Appreciate the advice. Unlike Norge, we have a slight economic downturn here. 
The $$$$ will go for more important items.....food, fuel, ...good single malt scotch. 

Why are so many of you in love with the 361 ?    And why, if it is the cure for all ills  (power to weight, etc...) is Stihl discontinuing the model ?

[567paloggger]

most dealers have sales on the 361 a dealer near me had 80 dollars off the sticker price that he would be compisated from stihl to sell his 361s off and push the 362 i bought both 361s he had how can you go wrong for 500 dollars one has a 18inch bar and i didnt want the 20inch bar so i said give me the 16inch bar and i got 20 dollars off for taking smaller bars most of the hard wood here in pa are all small most of my work is done with a 16inch bar but as soon as i got home i had to go test it out on some wood liked it alot so the second one will be a spare

[beenthere]

Couple weeks ago I asked my dealer for info on the MS362. Was told by him that they were not released yet, and he didn't have any pricing. But he referred to them as a 'cosmetic' change (not his words exactly but to the effect that changes were minor) plus the larger or better air filter and cowling.

And why, if it is the cure for all ills   (power to weight, etc...) is Stihl discontinuing the model ?

Interesting that it is though of as a cure-all for all ills, but I suspect Stihl is responding to new EPA regs and timelines, as this 362 is said to be more fuel efficient (might mean at the expense of something we like about the MS361).

[footer]

I bought my 026 new with a 20" bar with .325 chain, and used it that way for quite a few years (Firewood Cutting). I think it was OK with that size bar, but not great. Then I came across a good deal on a used 034 with a bran new 16" bar and chain. First thing i did was swap the bars, so now i have the 16" on the 026 and 20" on the 034. For me, that is the ideal setup. The 126 seems to like the 16" bar a lot better, and the 134 handles the 20" a lot better than the 026 does. I also have an 084 with a 24", 36" and 60" Bars for the bigger stuff. I still have a tendency to run the 084 with the 24" bar when i want to cut a bunch in a short amount of time

[madhatte]

026/260 really want a 16" bar.  That configuration is fast and maneuverable.  I have on occasion run a 20" bar for short periods (such as freeing up a stuck larger saw) and found the power to be lacking.  16" 3/8 .50 YELLOW ES bar is how I usually run mine, and it is a limbing monster.  Why the stress on yellow?  Simple:  I'm always snipping out conks and diseased sections for my pathology collection, and I need to be able to bore well.  Also, all of the yellow ES bars (up to 36", IIRC) use the same replacement nose/sprocket assembly.  That makes it just a little bit easier to keep my fleet going on a shoestring budget. 

[windthrown]

Well, it is not so much that fact that the bars are yellow, its the fact that the bars are SOLID and not laminated. I have bent solid GB bars and bent them back into place in a jiffy so that you would never know they were bent. The real issue I guess with yellow bars is the size of the nose sprocket (optional larger sizes), and hence the kickback.

[windthrown]

Why are so many of you in love with the 361 ?    And why, if it is the cure for all ills  (power to weight, etc...) is Stihl discontinuing the model ?

Well, they are good saws. I have three of them myself. They fill the sweet spot for cutting for me, and they do not fatigue me like the 044 and larger saws that I have had  like the 460 and 066. They have good AV, and are light enough to limb with and they will run a 25 inch bar no problem (my favorite length B&C on that saw). I have felled many trees with them. My second and third favorte saws are the 044 and the 026.

Stihl made the 361 design bottom up from the factory with really good engineering. They took the best that they had and made it better, and added a lot of Husky style features (like good spring loaded AV). The reason that they are dropping the 361 are the new 2010 EPA smog laws. All saws have to comply with the US 2010 EPA laws and also (in Europe) the EU AV laws. So they have changed the 361 to a strato 'cleaner' and heavier and more expensive engine 362 to comply with the new chainsaw engine laws. They also changed the AV springs, and added a centrifugal air cleaner to compete with the Husky ads, and some other small features.

[windthrown]

Couple weeks ago I asked my dealer for info on the MS362. Was told by him that they were not released yet, and he didn't have any pricing. But he referred to them as a 'cosmetic' change (not his words exactly but to the effect that changes were minor) plus the larger or better air filter and cowling.

And why, if it is the cure for all ills   (power to weight, etc...) is Stihl discontinuing the model ?

Interesting that it is though of as a cure-all for all ills, but I suspect Stihl is responding to new EPA regs and timelines, as this 362 is said to be more fuel efficient (might mean at the expense of something we like about the MS361).

They have long since stopped all production of the 361 in Virginia and the 362s have been released into most all the US regions now. We started getting the 362s here in the PNW about a month ago, and now all of the 361s are gone (snowstorms empty the chainsaw shelves). Some dealers may not have sold off all of their 361s in stock, so they have not replaced them with the 362 yet. The 362 is far more than a cosmetic change (see my above post). They have a completely different engine in them. They are also a lot more expensive. $610 here for a 361, and $690 for a 362, from the same dealer. That is a discount price over other dealers here. I have been quoted $740 from other dealers for the 362. For that price I would opt for a 441.

Also while the air filtering is said to be better, I do not agree. I never had problems with the 361 air filters, and I do not like the newer snap and bolted air filters on the 441 or the 362. Nor do I run my saws in mountains of wood chips, like the Husky ads display when they comapre their saws to Stihls. Marketing BS, but people seem to believe it. As for the 362 having better gas milage, it is "implied" from the Stihl ads that the 362 is better than the 361. But that is NOT what Stihl is saying in the ads and on their web site. They say thet the 362 runs cleaner and more efficient than "earlier model saws". They make no specific reference to the 361, so I do not believe that it is that much cleaner or more fuel efficient. Maybe they are comparing it to the 360? Hard to tell, but it is just more advertizing BS if you ask me.

In my view the 361 is the better saw. If for no other reason than price and weight. They are the last of the better non-strato engines. And like the 026, they respond really well to typical muffler modifications and porting. Porting strato engine saws is trickey, and strato engines have not been proven over a very long time.

[madhatte]

Note:  The baddest-azz 60cc saw I own is a good ol' 036 PRO with a muff mod and a mild woods port.  It ALMOST pulls with an 044.  I have had 361s that came very close, but fell short.  I have a hard time imagining that the 362, with its extra weight, will pull the same.  Even so, I'll likely be buying a couple for the work fleet this year, mainly because I'm trying to phase out our 036's.  Why?  They have been used and abused for almost 20 years by god-knows-how-many techs and are starting to be more trouble than they are worth.  I estimate that they must all have >3000 hours on each of them.  They have earned their retirement. 

Of course, I am willing to entertain offers on 361's in the meantime. 

[beenthere]

Can you sell the 361's ?

[madhatte]

I meant that if you have one for sale, I may be interested.  I can't sell any of the work fleet on account of their being gov't property. 

[windthrown]

Getting back to bar length on a 260... there is one for sale on CL here today with a 25" bar on it!

Wow... I have to wonder what he has been cutting with that thing? I hope it has full skip chain.

...
Stihl 026 chainsaw 24" - $285 (Longview, WA)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stihl 026 chainsaw with 24" bar & new chain.
New this saw cost $539.95 for the ms260.
Used for home use only with very low hours.
$285.00 360-425-xxxx or 800-488-xxxx

[stonebroke]

Home use only,sure.

Stonebroke

[timber tramp]

Home use only,sure.

Stonebroke

       What, you figure he was using it commercially??              TT

[windthrown]

       What, you figure he was using it commercially??              TT

Commercial falling with an 026 with a 25 inch bar...  there's a thought.

Must be something off of that AxMen TV show!

It gives me an idea though...

[stonebroke]

Its just a really odd combination for a homeowner to even think up.

Stonebroke

[timber tramp]

Its just a really odd combination for a homeowner to even think up.

Stonebroke

    Agreed, maybe just some dufus that does'nt know any better.  Wonder if he's going to use the $ for a bigger saw?

Commercial falling with an 026 with a 25 inch bar...  there's a thought.

Must be something off of that AxMen TV show!

It gives me an idea though...

                              TT

[windthrown]

 

Well, I have these 026s, see.

I also have these parts from my 066. 

Along with some pretty long bars... 

They are interchangable.

The real 026 CraigsList/Homeowner/Pro saw is born! 

[Cut4fun]

Yeah and they also sale 290's with 25" and full skip out in the NW brand new for those firs etc. You wont see that here in the east hardwoods, 20" at best and full comp.

[des170stihl]

If you really want to run a 20" bar on your MS260, it is very much possible without any strain on the saw.
But, this calls for some major changes of the guide bar and saw chain.
First you got to understand that the MS260 is only a bit more powerful than the home user's MS250.
But it is a pro saw.
And its one of the few stock models(that I know of) which can rev to 14500rpm.
In the cut, with the right cutting attachment that saw can cut faster than its bigger siblings.
So, how is it done?
You will need a 20' guide bar of 0.50 gauge.The solid bar with replaceable bar nose is ideal(20" Rollomatic ES 1.3mm) Part Number. 3003 000 8621
The chain might not be available as a loop you will need to get it made from a reel.
Chain is 63PM of 72 drive links.
To run this chain you could get the 3/8" Picco Rim sprocket kit with 8 teeth sprocket recommended for the MS260. Part Number.1121 007 1040.

What you would  have would be a real mean but light machine which goes  like a hot knife through butter.

I have done this with a 026. Its a real beauty.

Joe

I Agree,, Could,nt of said it better myself,, Nice reply Joe.

[windthrown]

Yeah and they also sale 290's with 25" and full skip out in the NW brand new for those firs etc. You wont see that here in the east hardwoods, 20" at best and full comp.

We have hardwood here too. Oak, madrone, apple, maple, yadda yadda. Its not all fir cutting here, even when cutting fir stands. Clear cutting Doug fir requires that the trash trees (oak, madrone, maple) have to be cut and culled into the slash piles (where I cut them up into firewood). Alders are also cut and sold as saw logs. Alder is softer than Doug fir, but its still considered a hardwood. Also when hardwoods are green, they are typically not that much harder than say, frozen solid Doug firs. Doug is not balsa wood, and it is not really even a fir species.

Not too many 290s here sold with 25 inch bars, really. Most have 20 inch bars. I see far more 361s with 28 inch bars here. With full skip that saw will drive that bar, but the stock oiler will not keep pace with that length. I have bought used 361s with stock 28 inch bars with bar burn. I ran a 20 inch bar on my 290 with no problems most of the time. I run a 25 inch bar on my 361s most of the time. I tested my ported 310 today running a 25 inch bar. I compared it one to one with one of my stock 361s running the same bar and chain, swapped out, and doing full cuts. The 361 beats the 310 only becasue the RPM on the 361 is set to 14.2k,  and the 310 is set to 13.2k. Faster chain speed wins in the cut. The 310 did not bog any more, even buried, and by the European 310 specs it should have about 4.5 HP with the modified/ported 1127 muffler. Problem with the 290 is that its max RPM is even lower than the 310 at 12.5k, meaning you can set it safely to a max of 13k.

In any event, a 20 inch bar is going on the 310 now. I am also putting a rim drive from a 360 on it. The 310 is going to be my brother's new 'large' saw. I am weaning him off of his Echos. He would be better off with one of my 026s, but the 310 is 'bigger', and it will run a larger 25 inch bar. Modified, a 310 is a great backup saw for the 361 with similar power (they are both 60cc saws).

[ladylake]

I'd even take as Stihl saw if my brother gave me one.   Steve

[windthrown]

Well, here she is. My modified 026 with a PNW side cover, 066 dogs, and 32 inch bar. It has semi-skip chain on it, and would probably cut better with full skip. Yah, I ran it to buck some 24 inch rounds out back. Oiler cannot keep up with a 32 inch bar, but I did not expect it to. I just drizzled some extra bar oil on it before I made each cut. And yes, it bogged down, and required a feather touch on the throttle. But it worked! It cut big cookies. Slow. A tad bar heavy, but I am used to saws being bar heavy. Was not as bad as I expected, and it cut better than I expected. Too bad an 066 cannot be made that weights only 10 pounds like this one!


The Professional Homeowner saw...

[timber tramp]

   Windthrown, that's too cool.     Might do something similar myself, then send the wife in to the saw shop with it, have her tell them somethings wrong with the oiler. Maybe wait till April 1st.                        TT

[windthrown]

Yah know, two of my non-PRO 026s have the adjustible oiler bellies on them. I could get an adjustible oiler kit and put in a HO oiler gear and control bolt and then I could take this one to GTGs and shows. I need to add another 066 falling dog and roller to make it into a proper dual dog setup as well. It may need a more extreme porting to get it to drive the bar better though. Drop the jug and turn down the piston, and really get it to crank! Then put on full skip semi-chisel to do it up right. I could probably get at least 4.5 HP out of this little saw.

Heh heh heh... a saw is born to drive guys like Gasoline-Gary nuts. Now, how to get a 3/4 wrap to fit this one? I have never seen a 3/4 wrap on an 026.

[stonebroke]

Don't bother with 3/4 wrap, go right to full wrap.

Stonebroke

[windthrown]

I have never seen a full wrap on a Stihl, actually. Stihl calls their 3/4 wraps 'full wraps' in the parts lists. Not like my old MACs that had 100% full wraps.

[stonebroke]

I have a full wrap on my 056. Bought it when I bought the saw new. As I remember it was about 100 dollars back then.

Stonebroke

[stonebroke]

Now that I think about it, What I call a full wrap may only be a 3/4 It does not go under the saw. So was I wrong in calling it a full wrap?

Stonebroke

[windthrown]

Well, wrong in terms of it being a true full wrap, yes. The saw in my avatar is a full wrap Mac. That is a photo of Paul Newman from the movie, Sometimes a Great Notion. However, in terms of what Stihl calls a 'full wrap', you were correct. For whatever reason, Stihl calls a 3/4 wrap handle a "full wrap." Meaning that they do not sell true full wrap handles.  I have 3/4 wraps on my 044 and one of my 361s. Left and right, but no bottom rail.

Like I said, I have never seen a full wrap handle on a Stihl myself. They were far more common back in the day when Macs were king of chainsaws. They fully wrap around the saw, including the rail at the bottom.

[chevytaHOE5674]

Like I said, I have never seen a full wrap handle on a Stihl myself.

You just have to look harder. haha  Not sure for a 260 though hmmmm.

My 460 with what stihls "full" wrap. Really a 3/4 wrap.


My 660 with an aftermarket true full wrap.

[windthrown]

Well, there you go! A full wrap 660. Come to think of it, I did see an 066 full wrap bar once that looks like the one you have on your 660 there, but it was not on the saw. I had a 3/4 wrap on my 066 that is like the one on your 460 there. Similar to the one on my 044.

I think that I would have to customize a 3/4 wrap for the 260. 

[downeast]

Update---
Yesterday bucking and quartering a ~30" DBH Red Oak, frozen and dead (not rotten). With the 20" bar it does seriously bog down when buried in the wood. I have to lighten up any pressure to get it to move. Even the weight of the saw causes it to bog. Because of the oak's weight, the butts are noodled for hand humping into the trailer. If the bar tip is not exposed in the cut, the 260 slows or bogs---newly sharpened chain.
Those who said it would, you win nothing. 

[Riesenbr549]

Hello all... I to have tried a 20" bar on my 26 pro it sucked!! now runnin a 3/8 drive 16" solid dura bar that i came across in all my junk .brand new bar pry from 70's era works very well!! thou i dont use it much. i prefer my 020t and 460 w/28"bar . just checked out my local dealer for 361's he is sold out ! i did pick up a 650 power head for $825.00 out the door! as they are discountinuing that model also! 

[MrJim]

All Stihl saws from MS210 up to MS660 can have standard Stihl pico rims put on.
You might have to replace the spur sprocket.
Hard tip bars lose you power and cost more.  Stihl use to make a pico roller tip bar that mounts to MS260 - MS660.  I have a 16" one, and used a pico chain for a while (did not llike it much), but was thinking of putting it and the new carbide pico chain on my 361 to cut some stumps flush with the ground.

I ran 3/8 full skip RSF chain on my MS260 cutting fire wood behind some logging we had done.  It was slow fully buried in oak, but the light weight made this a excelent limning saw.  With a pico chain I would have lost cutting time to increased need to sharpen the chain.

I do not agree with some of the things you say here. I ran my 026s head to head against my 025s (before I sold my 1123 saws off), and there was no comparison. There is a point that the 025 falls off hard and fast where the 026 continues on. Similar with the difference between the 026 and the 361 in larger wood. I ran my 025s with Picco (low profile 3/8) as well; .325 bogged down too much on those saws. It is all but impossible to get Oregon mini-spline picco rim drives for the small format Stihl saws. I had to use spur sprockets. Picco bars and rims are REALLY expensive (if you can find them) compared to other size bars for the large format Stihl mounts, and rim drives are really spendy as well. The Picco setup for the large format Stihl saws was only designed and sold for the 024 saw (13.5k RPM max), and it was not designed to run on the more powerful 026 or larger saws. Stihl does not sell the picco bars with large formats in the US any more for this reason. LogoSol does sell them though. Picco is comonly used on chainsaw mill saws with larger size Stihl saws (361, 440, 460 and even 660s) and they are typically run with spur sprockets.

As for max RPM, from my Stihl manuals, all of these Stihl saws are set at 14k +/-500 RPM stock: 025/250, 023/230, 026/260, 361, 044/440. There are probably others that rev this high. The 260 will run a tad better with a .325 B&C over 3/8, but it is not noticable enough for me to keep .325 B&C and rims around. I am setting up one of my 026s to run picco with a rolomatic bar, rim and Picco chain. It will run faster, but you have to be careful running the light weight chains out there in the woods and on chainswaw mills. You are at or exceeding the limits of the chain design. 

[SawTroll]

The bottom line is that a 20" really is too large on a 260 - but if will work, if your expectations are low enough!    

Another issue is that a 20" bar will totally destroy the pretty nice handling qualities that saw basically has.

[SawTroll]

Update---
Yesterday bucking and quartering a ~30" DBH Red Oak, frozen and dead (not rotten). With the 20" bar it does seriously bog down when buried in the wood. I have to lighten up any pressure to get it to move. Even the weight of the saw causes it to bog. Because of the oak's weight, the butts are noodled for hand humping into the trailer. If the bar tip is not exposed in the cut, the 260 slows or bogs---newly sharpened chain.
Those who said it would, you win nothing.  

  No surprice there, you never win on all accounts, changing one factor on a given powerhead - what you really need is a larger saw, or a lot of patience!

From another perspective, the "13" crowd" here tell us here that you can fell trees 2 1/2 times the length of the bar, and they sure are right - but who really wants to do it routinely?  

[Cut4fun]

Like I said, I have never seen a full wrap handle on a Stihl myself. They were far more common back in the day when Macs were king of chainsaws. They fully wrap around the saw, including the rail at the bottom.

I've seen this full wrap 084 a few times.

[JohnG28]

Anyone seen windthrown here in a while? I dont think I have.

[Franksplanks]

 A 20" bar is much too big for the 026 or any 50cc saw I think. It looks kinda silly.
 Gypo

[img width=500 --Photos MUST be in the Forestry Forum gallery!!!!!--.com/albums/v639/sunlover3/346-3.jpg[/img]

[Al_Smith]

  The Gypster must have escaped 

He is correct though .An 026 /Ms 260 is a little bitty 3 cuber .Not a bad little saw but still a 3 cuber and made to do what that size saw does .Handy size, nice firewood cutter but certainly not an oak slayer .

[Al_Smith]

Like I said, I have never seen a full wrap handle on a Stihl myself. They were far more common back in the day when Macs were king of chainsaws. They fully wrap around the saw, including the rail at the bottom.

I've seen this full wrap 084 a few times.

(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

Every saw I own which came from the west coast has a full wrap,Macs ,Homelite Stihl ,Husqvarna .

[SawTroll]

Anyone seen windthrown here in a while? I dont think I have.

I have seen him on another (Aussie) site - will go there now, to look for him!

[SawTroll]

Anyone seen windthrown here in a while? I dont think I have.

I have seen him on another (Aussie) site - will go there now, to look for him!

I did - he posted there as late as today!  

[JohnG28]

Cant say that Im on that site, but hadnt heard him here, he used to be on a lot of these here chainsaw threads.

[SawTroll]

Cant say that Im on that site, but hadnt heard him here, he used to be on a lot of these here chainsaw threads.

I guess he posts where he finds something interesting to post about - I more often find that here than on that site, but it may be different with him?   

[JohnG28]

I agree, usually I can find something here that peaks my interest.  If not then theres always something productive I should probably be doing with myself anyway.

[Al_Smith]

Anyone seen windthrown here in a while? I dont think I have.

I have seen him on another (Aussie) site - will go there now, to look for him!

Well I suppose that praticular site perhaps is operated by a one time insurance claims adjuster  lately turned palm tree slayer With aluminum wedge and claw hammer to boot .

Sorry gents I don't even go there on a link.

[Cut4fun]

Anyone seen windthrown here in a while? I dont think I have.

I have seen him on another (Aussie) site - will go there now, to look for him!

Well I suppose that praticular site perhaps is operated by a one time insurance claims adjuster  lately turned palm tree slayer With aluminum wedge and claw hammer to boot .

Sorry gents I don't even go there on a link.

It's like the 3  deliverance guys over there or Larry Curly Moe.    Nothing more.

[RedHawkRidge]

I had a 026 with 18" bar.  Really good saw.  Also have a 044 for the big stuff.  I carried the 026 on the ATV when cruising my property.  But had those situations where the 026 was overmatched, so traded it on a 361.  Bigger, but not too big that it couldn't serve as a brush cutter up to knocking down an oak.  In other words, a great all-around-saw.
Another angle:  have 3/8" x 20" chains on both saws, which makes the inventory and maintenance of chains much simpler.
Jim
PS:  saw on an earlier post something about "getting a 361 before they disappear" or something to that effect -- what's going on?

[beenthere]

The 361 is changing to the 362.  Seamless change according to my dealer (who still has a couple 361's).
A bit heavier and prolly meets more of the EPA regs that houng the chainsaw industry. Be nice to keep the Gov't out it. 

I like my 361 too. 

[SawTroll]

Honestly, imo anything more than a 16" with .325x7 is too much on an 026/260, and then I am not counting in the reduced power US EPA 260s, as I have never used one of them.......

[windthrown]

Anyone seen windthrown here in a while? I dont think I have.

Have not been here in a while, no... did I miss something other than the pot shots at myself and the Aussy site?

Dudes, like you need to get real lives or something.

[windthrown]

All Stihl saws from MS210 up to MS660 can have standard Stihl pico rims put on.
You might have to replace the spur sprocket.
Hard tip bars lose you power and cost more.  Stihl use to make a pico roller tip bar that mounts to MS260 - MS660.  I have a 16" one, and used a pico chain for a while (did not llike it much), but was thinking of putting it and the new carbide pico chain on my 361 to cut some stumps flush with the ground.

I ran 3/8 full skip RSF chain on my MS260 cutting fire wood behind some logging we had done.  It was slow fully buried in oak, but the light weight made this a excelent limning saw.  With a pico chain I would have lost cutting time to increased need to sharpen the chain.

I would dearly love to know where you found a picco rim for a 1123 Stihl saw with an Oregon or Stihl spline. I never found one in 3 years of looking myself. Baileys thought that they had one, but I wrote them and they checked into it, and realized that it would not fit. I had to run my 1123 saws with picco chain and spur sprockets. For that matter, where do you get rim picco drives for standard splines on the 360 and up saws? I only found one for the 026 spline, and that was very hard to get, along with an 18 inch large format Stihl picco bar which are nearly impossible to get.

Stihl only made the picco B&C for the 024, and they stopped selling them in the US when they realized that people were running them on much larger saws. I know many guys that prefer picco for milling with larger saws (including myself), as it has a much narrower kerf. They are faster in the cut. I never found chain sharpening to be an issue; there are as many cutters on a picco chain as a standard 3/8 chain. The only drives that I am aware of for picco are spur sprockets on the lager format Stihl saws (360, 440, etc.).

[JohnG28]

For the record Im not taking shots at anyone or any other sites out there.  Actually was just making an observation after someone had brought back up a thread here that hadnt had any posts in a long time.

[Cut4fun]

I make reference like  this (It's like the 3  deliverance guys fiddle hoedown, hillybilly with a tub base, Banjo Man, over there or Larry Curly Moe.  Ya dats a good one!  Nothing more.) and now I'm making fun of another site. Someone needs to rethink and get their life in order.    No your just wrong again.


I like 16" RS RSC 325 or full 3/8 for me on a 49cc for HARDWOODS. I do have 2 20" for testing purposes and a partner 500 set up for a guy with 20" that he swears by. Just got to remember that is all the dude has to cut with, besides some smaller back up saws for firewood.

[SawTroll]

......
Stihl only made the picco B&C for the 024, and they stopped selling them in the US when they realized that people were running them on much larger saws. I know many guys that prefer picco for milling with larger saws (including myself), as it has a much narrower kerf. They are faster in the cut. I never found chain sharpening to be an issue; there are as many cutters on a picco chain as a standard 3/8 chain. The only drives that I am aware of for picco are spur sprockets on the lager format Stihl saws (360, 440, etc.).

They market a model that they call MS660 Logosol here. That one comes with a picco (pmx) setup - but as you said, the sprocket is a spur.