next »

[ford62783]

i am new to the busines end of logging and live in ny i am looking for wood lots to secure to have ample business for when i start my own business. i was wondering how i go about finding lots to cut

[Chuck White]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum!

In answer to your question, I'd suggest talking to a local Forester in your area!

[ford62783]

thank you i have tried that but with the price of pine right now any jobs of size are being kept hush hush the biggest problem is no skidder at the time being but after income taxes i will be buying one. well im on that subject ive been told by a few loggers that rent to own is an option with a portion of the profits going toward the price wanted by the owner has anyone in ny or surrounding areasw heard of that type of oppertunity

[Magicman]

First,  Welcome to FF.  Go to your local NRCS office, and your County Extension office.  Also, your county should have a County Forester, and also there probably is a County Forestry Ass'n (CFA).

Logging is a business that a lot of folks wish they weren't in right now.  They are trapped with equipment notes to pay, having to lay off workers, and wondering where their next logging job is coming from.  You really can't blame anyone that has work for being closed mouth.

[ford62783]

i dnt blame them for being tite lipped im not asking for leads to jobs just how to go about finding them

[Mark K]

where are you in NY? I have logged here for over 15 years and last winter was the tightest winter I can remember. It was tough to even move hardwood logs let alone softwood. The best way to find woodlots is to just drive around, look at tax maps and knock on doors. Its hard to secure woodlots unless you put money up front. My best advice from a forester is make sure you draw up a good contract and have a lawyer read it over. Make sure you look at all costs before you jump in, Fuel and insurance will probably be your highest.

[Magicman]

im not asking for leads to jobs just how to go about finding them

I went about telling you how I would look for them.

Go to your local NRCS office, and your County Extension office.  Also, your county should have a County Forester, and also there probably is a County Forestry Ass'n (CFA).

[SwampDonkey]

It would also be a good idea to be familiar with looking up ownership of property. GPS with loaded maps and aerials is good to have to, not the Garmin types, but those by Trimble, Magellan and Corvalis that can display a registered aerial photo in a mobile GIS program like ArcPad 8. Just one of them little bonuses in the tool box. Some places have it all in digital form online: maps, aerial photos, ownership, assessment, recent sale price, etc that can be accessed for a monthly minimum fee from an internet connection. That cuts down on some of the run'n, then you can approach the owner to get permission to see their ground if they are interested in selling timber. Then work out the details after that. I wouldn't make any promises or claims until I seen the ground. I wouldn't tie up a lot of hours cruising until I had their interest. You'll meet all kinds of situations, some will follow through. Even if you don't get the lot it's all worth it just for the chance to sell yourself. Most folks will be more inquisitive and not real interested in cutting wood when your ready. They might cut it 10 years from now as part of their objectives.

Here is some of the free stuff we can get in NB

Some fee for services under Land and Property

[ford62783]

thank you swampdonkey and everyone i began looking up property maps and finding names and addresses i will let you all know how it turns out keep the advise comeing thank you again

[thecfarm]

I myself feel it's a hard business to make money at. How much cutting have you done?Lots of laws to follow,streams and wet holes that you can't even see when it's dry.Things go good when you don't have a break down.Parts are some high.When you're turning a wrench you're losing money 2 ways,the part(s) itself and you're not cutting wood.I get letters from loggers too.It's a good way to get your name out there.One week the mills are paying a good price,than they drop the price or just stop taking logs.Some sawmills will even favor the long time buyers and won't buy from a new guy when times are rough.Good luck.

[Mark K]

I think your biggest competition will be the whole tree chipping operations. There are alot around here. In hardwood last January you could make more chipping logs then sending them for pallet or firewood. I dont think you will have a problem finding smaller softwood woodlots up here. There is afew decent markets for white pine, hemlock and pine poles up here. Good luck to ya.

[DanG]

Welcome to the forum Ford.

I never heard of a "rent to own" program for skidders, but there might be one out there.  If there is, I would bet it is a bad deal.  It sounds as if you have no capital in hand with which to start up.  However, if you're insistent in giving it a go, look for the very smallest jobs you can find...the ones the big boys don't want to fool with.   I'm talking about building lots and such.  Many of them will yield a few good quality trees, even though they're already assigned to a clearing contractor to just be eliminated.  If you can get up with one or two of these contractors, you might be able to slip in there and drop/buck the trees, then just rent an appropriate machine for a half-day to get them out of there.  That way, you don't have a payment hanging over your head, and you have a chance to develop markets and customer bases, as well as a reputation.  If you work it right, you may even get the clearing guy to load them for you after you slip him a few bucks and a twelve pack.   It may take a couple or three lots to get up a marketable truckload of sawlogs, or you may be able to market them a few at a time to small sawyers like me who can't buy a whole semi load at a time.  Think small and you might grow big.

[metalspinner]

DanG,
I had similar thoughts.

Small woodlot owner can't get somebody to cut.

Small sawmill owner can't buy small quantity of logs.

Small logging outfit looking for work.

Seems like a good recipe to me.

[ford62783]

thanks alot danG that is a great idea i never thaught of my uncle is a logger and has a well established business i fel a few hitches for him today and he told be they dnt rent to own anymore but in situations they do from private owners who have logged and gotten out of the business i appreciate all the help guys thank you

[PAFaller]

What you do depends on where you are at. You really need to know what types of landowner is in your area. Not sure where you are at in New York, butI  know the northern reaches have lots of big woods managed by big forestry firms and owned by investment groups. If much of the land falls into this bracket, and there are already guys fighting over the smaller pieces, and you dont have a lot of capitol to go buy bid timber, its going to be a long hard road. You may be better off getting started working for another company or contracting to a mill, although they usually want more experienced crews with a decent reputation. You need to do a pretty detailed market analysis before you run out to buy a machine and try to go to work. If the area is more smaller landowners, say 100 acres or less, then you may be able to find work, but its still a competitive gig. The delivered prices are higher than they were a few months ago but still not great for decent hardwood logs. Not sure about softwood in your area, but only Amish mills will buy it around here. Hardwood pulp and pellet prices are down with oil staying fairly cheap, and there are plenty of mechanized crews already in the pulpwood and chipping game. Not trying to foil your hopes of going to work in the woods, just suggesting you do your homework before you dive in.