Skid Steer vs Tractor

[brooksmill]

Looks like Bibbyman has the right piece of equipment but I couldn't justify that for my little operation.  I have a Kubota 30 hp tractor and just purchased a used Cat 242 skid steer.  There's no comparison.  The skid steer is by far the best.  Can turn on a dime and has the capacity to lift large logs without the rearend getting light.  I have a set of forks on it.  My 2 cents worth.

[Don K]

Show me somebody that seriously skids over 3 trees a day with a skidsteer and I'll show you somebody who needs a chiropractor unless he is skidding across a ballfield and doesn't have to look back.

There ain't no way you can convince me that a skidsteer with a 24" 16 foot log pulling backwards in the woods can outpull a tractor. The tractor will pull two to one at least.   If you can more power to you, I know I wouldn't want to do it. All the limitations you listed scratches it off the list for me.

Don

[spencerhenry]

i make a living cutting and skidding timber. we have moved more wood with a skidsteer than most guys with their tractors will move in a lifetime. last winter we did 189 acres of select cut, removing 50% of the trees. the skidder only did the stuff that was too steep to drive, not too steep for the skidsteer, but too steep for the skidder. most of the trees were in the 30 to 40 foot long and 10 to 14" butts. green ponderosa in 1 foot of snow or more. the skidsteer was used in the woods to bunch for the skidder, and when within a couple of hundred yards of the deck, to skid to the deck. the skidsteer could easily handle 3 or 4 trees at a time depending on size sometimes 5 or 6. but at the deck the skidsteer could stack neatly and fast. then when not skidding the skidsteer was using a fecon and mulching slash, try that with a tractor. i know from personal experience that a skidsteer in the woods will out skid a cable skidder in on short skids. like i said before, if the ground is really rocky, or  really steep the advantage goes away.
 i am not talking about a home-owner skidsteer. i am talking about machines that weigh in the neighborhood of 10,000#. steel over tire tracks in the winter and summer. my skidsteer with my the rubber tracks on it weighs 13,200 with no attachment, and has 115hp. i use a bobcat 90" snowbucket with road base, a full bucket and the machine is no where near tipping. a skidsteer is also far more stable than a tractor for side hill work.

 as far as driving backwards, have you heard of a mirror? it is not very hard to travel FAST while skidding. most of the pictures i have seen on here of people in their mill yards or woods, shows flat ground. i live in the ROCKY mountains, on my 35 acres the elevation varies from 8200' to 8500', there are very few places i cant get my skidsteer. high stumps, big rocks, or rockfields are a problem. i know where i grew up in the midwest we had NO rocks, and elevation change on 160 acres was under 30', that is perfect skidsteer country.

[spencerhenry]

how about 150 trees a day? done it in up to 2' of snow

[chevytaHOE5674]

My question is... if a skid steer can pull more than a skidder, then why isn't everybody using one?

Backing up even with a mirror is tough over 1/4+ miles of twists, turns, and hills. I've also never seen a skidsteer than can move at the same speeds as a skidder loaded or unloaded (which means more turns with a skidder in any given time). Most I've seen a skid steer do is close to 10mph, and slower while turning, many skidders are capable of 15-20 mph and can maintain speed while turning, as can a farm tractor. Also most skid steers have ~8" of ground clearance where a skidder has 15-20" and a tractor has close to that. 



I can agree that around a mill a big skid steer can be effective, but in the woods when compared to a tractor or skidder I don't see it, not around here at least.

[beenthere]

I guess some will use skid steers and some will use tractors. 

[Don K]

Spencer, you got any pictures. I for one would like to see some. I think it would be rather interesting.

Don

[backwoods sawyer]

Hey Spencer, I am familiar with your area, back in the 80’s I spent some time up around Glenwood springs doing some seismograph work both with the truck thumpers and helicopters. I can see how the maneuverability of the skid steer in that type of terrain would be a big plus over the cumbersome skidder. Then again a machine like what you are operating would cost more then my whole milling operation, making it a mute point for me to dream about adding it to my operation, where a much smaller used skid steer or used tractor may fit into the budget with a little more ease.

[spencerhenry]

hope you've got rollover protection on that yard tractor if you are turning at 20mph!

i own 2 skidders and a skidsteer. there is no way in hell that you are ever skidding at 20mph in any of them. a skidder with a turn of logs is more like a fast walk, unless of course you are skidding in your proverbial ball field. any speed beyond a fast walk makes it hard just to stay in the seat, and that is in my 34,000# skidder, not to mention the abuse you are putting on the machine. i think the theoretical speed of my skidder is around 16 to 18 mph. theoretical, and actual are often far from the same thing. have you ever tried to drive an articulated machine at 20 miles an hour?

my point several posts ago was disputing the comments made that skidsteers were not worth anything in the woods. while that may be true in some instances, it is by no means true across the board. there are times when a skidsteer is a BETTER machine for the job. but all that aside, the original thread was about a tractor or a skidsteer around the mill. there is absolutely no way that anyone who has ever used both could come away with the opinion that a tractor is more versatile. the sheer number and variety of attachments for a skidsteer proclaims it to be more versatile. the only advantage i see to a tractor in the mill yard, is the clearance, but why do you need clearance in the mill yard? i recently sold a telescopic forklift, would lift 7000#, reach 27 feet in front of the front tires, and 42' high. great for moving lumber, ok for moving logs, ok with the bucket for moving firewood or sawdust, and not bad at snow removal, but talk about a dedicated machine, you dont take it into the woods, you dont mow grass with it, you dont dig holes with it. unless your mill yard is several acres, it is too big,
 i have owned and run lots of machines. just last year, i bought my first skidsteer after seeing how effective they could be in the woods. now i wonder why i didnt buy one sooner. and by the way, they arent all that expensive. i paid $19,000 for my mustang 2109, it is a 2005 and had just under 1100 hrs, 115hp perkins, cab with heat and AC, lights, and good tires, i just wish i had a stereo in it.

 it annoys me when people who have no experience with something profess to know everything. just because a guy you know, that knows a guy, whose brother once had a skidsteer, and he said they suck, doesnt mean that it is so.
 i have owned a small farm tractor, 2 extending boom forklifts(and run almost every brand out there), still own 2 skidders (one dual arch grapple, one cable), log loader, sawmill, edger, dumptruck, army 6x6, and have lots of hours in excavators of all sizes, some dozer time(but i suck), ran snowcats at Aspen one season. those are things i know about, but i wont begin to tell you about what a feller buncher can and cant do.

[ladylake]

I agee, in the woods you can get in and out of places a tractor never could. I have both, the tractor sits in the yard most of the time.   Steve

[chevytaHOE5674]

hope you've got rollover protection on that farm tractor if you are turning at 20mph!

I do, same protection as a skidder.

As for speed, the return trip from the landing to the woods is where is helps. I can run 15-20 mph and stay in the seat as I make good roads and smooth them out. Actually I road my skidder quiet often getting from job to job.

it annoys me when people who have no experience with something profess to know everything. just because a guy you know, that knows a guy, whose brother once had a skidsteer, and he said they suck, doesnt mean that it is so.

I have multiple farm tractor, a skidder, a skidsteer, etc. Had all three in the woods, and around here the skidsteer is way out of its element in the woods IME.

[zopi]

This was a funny thread...

Looks like I may have picked up a compact (and old) skid steer with a cracked head..Perkins engine..shouldn't be too hard to find one...and the price is right...this little bugger won't be moving many logs, but for cleaning up slabs and moving little whacks o lumber..cleaning up sawdust piles and about anything else around the yard..ought to be the bomb..

Spent part of yesterday moving snow with a hydraulic rotary broom on a Cat skidsteer...that'll spoil ya...nice machine...

[jwoods]

depends on how you outfit the tractor

 



Joe

[379hammerdown]

This is my new tractor, and it's been working out perfect so far! Logs that are just TOO big for the front end loader get picked up with the boom pole w/ tongs and skidded parallel to the mill. I then I drop it and roll it using the front end loader onto the mill's loaders. Most logs are able to be picked up using the front end loader no problem. The one on the loader is 12' long and 22" diameter top pine log. Much easier on my back too!!!

Mine is a Mahindra 4025 (The 4wd is model 4035) with skid steer front end on the loader, with a bucket and Pallet forks.

[kderby]

I am four years into owning a 6000# Wiggins rough terrain forklift.  It has done everything I have asked of it.  Recently I have been renting a neighbors skid steer.  The only advantages the skid steer has are portability (easy to trailer) and the bucket for cleaning up sawdust.

The forklift has a lifting capacity that is heavier, taller and safer.  Hopping on and off the forklift to adjust bunks is easy.  The side shift helps make a trailer load of lumber nicer and faster.  In the winter I chain up the forklift and keep going.  (I do not have to deal with bottomless mud)

Someday I will buy a skid steer or backhoe for added choices.  I also have an 8000# rough terrain forklift at a second location.  It is too much machine for what I need.  I truly love my 6000# Wiggins purchased from a rental fleet for $6,800.  If I only had one location where I worked, that forklift would be all I needed.

[ladylake]

(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

Graple skider or....

 

(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

Skid steer with graple?

  Which one would get around better in a tight woods where you didn't want to destroy all of the trees?

[woodpeckerlips]

Ladylake,
Everyone has a opinion. I'm here in Virginia, where its hilly. I have a large skid steer with forks, grapple,and bucket. My skid steer has tracks 18" wide. I can go anywhere needed. Can navagate the tightest places. Can climb steep hills with the graple full of logs. I can make quick work of all the tops and brush with the grapple. Then when done, I can grade every thing out beutifully with the bucket. I have a tractor front end loader. When loaded trying to climb hills and such, it takes the weight off the back wheels. Skid steer has low center of gravity. (I) feels safer in bad spots with my skid steer. Now if your in a much larger prodution situation. There is no substitute for a skidder, huge rubber tire crapple loader ect. My opinion, they don't make anything for a tractor that can't be put on a skid steer. It's the most versitile piece out there.  The rest are good for just 1 or2 things. Get a skidsteer,(80hp+) with hyd hook up and your ready to auger holes, plow snow, trench ditches, backhoe a hole, bush hog difficult places, harley rake your yard, post drive, ect, ect. I even have a attachment to set trusses. As long as you have the skidsteer, you can always rent the attachment you need! Like a stump grinder, the list is endless.  I use mine at my cicle mill when cutting and everywhere else when building, grading and here lately a lot of snow removal.