Author Topic: Butternuts comeing up ...but (Read 2114 times)

Banjo picker · « **on:** June 13, 2009, 06:55:02 pm »

I checked about half a dozen plantings that i did last fall from what DL sent me....And i found 2 little sprouts, but they don't look to spunky. One looks very pale almost white, and the other has what looks like a rust on the little leaves . Both are only about 8 or 10 inches tall. i am going out right now to check on some of the others. i planted about abaout 2 dozen. Do i need to put anything like a fungicide on them or fertilizer. They are planted where i want them to grow, not in a plot to be transplanted. Any advice would be helpful. I am going to take some pic. maybe my cousin will up load them for me in a week or two. Tim

Banjo picker · « **Reply #1 on:** June 13, 2009, 07:59:52 pm »

I just made a loop on the atv and found 19 flags...I have a total of 7 little trees. Two of them have the nearly white syndrone

--hope they are gona be ok. Of the 7 I found the best looking one is down in a bottom--Several of the others that I did not find will be back by the creek where it was too wet to go today.... Maybe they will be nice ones as well. Something had bit one off right at the top of the wire container it was planted in ... They will get a bigger enclosure Monday. How big will they get this summer? Need to know how tall to make the container. Tim

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #2 on:** June 14, 2009, 05:57:39 am »

In my experience they will get about 10" tall. If a rodent chews one off at the top, it will send another shoot up or sprout off the side often times. Do the leaves have black spots? I see that on butternut leaves quite often, either mature or seedling. Usually not until late in the season though. Maybe some of the white ones aren't getting nitrogen. They like the damper ground best, but well drained like in gullies and stream banks. Just be patient. Mine usually sit for 3 to 5 years before putting on much height. Then once they get going they take off and put out their first laterals.

The new leaf petioles will often be orange-red.

I would not put any fertilizer on them and as far as fungicide I wouldn't know what to recommend, I've never sprayed mine.

Banjo picker · « **Reply #3 on:** June 14, 2009, 02:18:46 pm »

The one that had been bit off already had a little bud bump or what ever you call it started. The leaves in question don't have spots per say....just dark around the edge of a few of the leaves. I got one that looks just like that first pic. except its got a blue flag by it.

I didn't think they had done anything, and when i drove by and happened to look...I got excided about it....We had a monsoon like rain this morinin or I would go back by the creek and look for some more flags... I planted some horsechesnuts that Marcell sent me down there I wonder if any of them has come up....Tim

Lanier_Lurker · « **Reply #4 on:** June 14, 2009, 10:50:13 pm »

Banjo Picker, I have not had any germination yet with some of the same batch of butternuts I got from Dodgy. Mine spent the winter in the refrigerator, and they have been sitting in moistened germination bins for about 2 months now. Not sure what the problem is. I took them out a couple of times during the winter session in the refrigerator and wet them - both to provide moisture and check that they still still did not float. Out of about 40 I only had 5 floaters.

I think I read somewhere that butternuts can exhibit double dormancy. SD, is that true?

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #5 on:** June 15, 2009, 05:25:02 am »

I believe it is true LL, similar to black walnuts that may have to be stratified up to 18 months. I've had some germinate the second year here when there were no butternuts the previous season on the yard tree. I just found another butternut the squirrels planted in under the apple trees. I have that one and another in the garden to transplant next spring. They both look at least 5 years old.

Crack one open and see if the meet is still white with light brown skin. They told me at the Seed Centre large hardwood seed won't keep long stored in house. They wouldn't store oak for me for this reason, however birch is tiny and keeps a long time like spruce seed.

Lanier_Lurker · « **Reply #6 on:** June 15, 2009, 06:31:04 am »

This is the first time I have used the refrigerator for nut tree seed stratification - I prefer to keep them outside in sealed containers for a more natural temperature experience - which I did during most of this past winter. In late February I moved everything to the refrigerator so that I could remove a few at the time and stagger things a bit and not have everything germinating at the same time. My germination rates on hickories and oaks (that spent the same amount of time in there next to the butternuts) has been just dandy.

I will crack one or two and check.

If they appear sound, should I leave them out or put them back into the refrigerator?

Banjo picker · « **Reply #7 on:** June 15, 2009, 09:01:08 am »

Quote from: Lanier_Lurker on June 14, 2009, 10:50:13 pm

Banjo Picker, I have not had any germination yet with some of the same batch of butternuts I got from Dodgy. Mine spent the winter in the refrigerator, and they have been sitting in moistened germination bins for about 2 months now. Not sure what the problem is. I took them out a couple of times during the winter session in the refrigerator and wet them - both to provide moisture and check that they still still did not float. Out of about 40 I only had 5 floaters.

I think I read somewhere that butternuts can exhibit double dormancy. SD, is that true?

I had heard that it might take two seasons of dormancy as well....that was why I had not really been watching them that close.

I planted the ones I checked on by a trail along the outside of my horse pasture, and just happened to look and see one by the flag I put down by it as I was going around the fence on the Kubota after a storm......I am pretty happy with what I have so far, and then there is a good chance I may get some more next year...

I don't rember exactly how many DL sent me but there was very few floaters in mine either..( I gave a half dozen or so to some of my other tree buddies, so I know I have about dtwo dozen or so out there somewhere..).I took too much time planting them to put one in the ground that had no chance...I think we had prime weather over the winter to sprout nuts. Fairly wet and enough cold to freeze the ground a few times... I am hoping since there are no other butternuts in the woods close to me that they will not contact the blight that is wiping them out in some places...Hope yours comes up for you...Tim

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #8 on:** June 15, 2009, 05:47:53 pm »

I guess keep them in the fridge 'til fall and stick'm in the mud where you want them to grow.

Banjo picker · « **Reply #9 on:** June 15, 2009, 06:18:28 pm »

I don't know where DL had been keeping the ones he sent me , but I planted them as soon as i got them. Tim

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #10 on:** June 15, 2009, 06:24:43 pm »

I do the same, just like the squirrels.

Lanier_Lurker · « **Reply #11 on:** June 15, 2009, 11:18:30 pm »

Yep, I figure it is best to let nature do its thing as much as possible - except for the squirrel raids that destroy the seeds!!

I just hope they did not get too dried out.

Banjo picker · « **Reply #12 on:** June 16, 2009, 09:03:42 pm »

Quote from: Lanier_Lurker on June 15, 2009, 11:18:30 pm

Yep, I figure it is best to let nature do its thing as much as possible - except for the squirrel raids that destroy the seeds!!

I just hope they did not get too dried out.

I stopped the squirrels by cutting 1/2 inch hardware cloth in about 8 in squares wiring two of the side together making a cylinder ...planting the nut in the cylinder covering it with some dirt and then mashing the top of the wire almost closed...Seems to work....the wire will rot and you can cut it with a pair of snips if the tree comes out one of the holes instead of the top. Tim

woodmills1 · « **Reply #13 on:** June 30, 2009, 02:49:18 am »

I have so many black walnuts planted by the squirlls on my land in between the apple trees that soon i can rename the place walnut acres

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #14 on:** June 30, 2009, 03:35:11 am »

When mine started bearing nuts the red squirrels would not touch them. Then in the spring time when the husk was all gone they have started to gather and open them up now. They were confused I guess, the butternut has a very thin husk and the squirrels used to cut them off the trees before the frost got them. Chipmunks are busy to, one lives around my wood pile this spring. I like chipmunks better than red squirrels, they aren't as destructive and they hibernate in winter.

Dodgy Loner · « **Reply #15 on:** June 30, 2009, 09:35:52 am »

Sorry to hear that your butternuts are not doing so well, but at least they're coming up! The squirrels cleaned out every single nut I planted this spring

(over 50 butternuts, 50 of the hickories that banjo picker sent, and 100 shumard oaks from LL). I think I might have 2 shumards coming up, but I'm not 100% certain they're not scarlet oaks since there is a scarlet oak nearby. I need to find a location farther from the forest to plant my seeds in the future.

Banjo and LL, it occurs to me that, since the butternut where I collected the nuts was the only one I saw for miles (it was in a campground in the middle of Hiawassee), the nuts may very-well be self-pollinated, which would explain their lack of vigor. Maybe I can find a butternut with some neighbors to collect some nuts from this fall

Lanier_Lurker · « **Reply #16 on:** June 30, 2009, 10:02:03 am »

Grey squirrels are a menace.

I had to build a cage for my potted seedlings. I also keep some of them closed up in the garage where some sun gets in.

If I ever decide to do open seedbeds I am sure I will need some sort of contraption to repel the rodents. I also have a bunch of ground squirrels.

Yes Dodgy, I had wondered about the self-pollination thing.

Banjo picker · « **Reply #17 on:** July 02, 2009, 10:09:17 am »

DL sorry to here about your raiders of the planted nuts.

Remind me this fall and i will get you some more of the hickories. All in all I am pleased with what I have so far with the butternuts. i haven't been able to check on them in a while, because my mother had a fall and is in the hospital. She is probably going to the assisted living center when she gets out. She is 90 and is not liking being away from her home. Tim

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #18 on:** September 05, 2009, 03:51:18 pm »

I took the GPS out today and pin pointed the locations of another half dozen butternut and a couple new red oak seedlings. Some of the older butternut have grown a lot this summer, going from a foot and a half from last season to 3 feet total height. Some will be double stemmed, not many, so the plan is to crop out the worst stem of the two.

Now I'm searching for an ideal space, for a group or two, of bur oak plantings on the lot. It's the ideal lot for bur oak from what I've read.

Banjo picker · « **Reply #19 on:** September 07, 2009, 10:27:38 pm »

The ones that were sickly looking ...didn't make it.

I have one that is really doing well though, and I am proud of it. Its in a bottom area...and there are some more deeper in the bottom by the creek that I have not checked as of yet....Hopefully they will make it. Tim

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #20 on:** September 08, 2009, 04:04:35 am »

I found two more butternut on raised ground in a strip of ground fed by springs and one more red oak. I looked at my older ones from 5 years ago and they are growing well. I soon have to brush around them so they can get a bit more light. Right now I just break off branches near by so the trees are not over topped.

The thinnings (pre-commercial) are growing quite well, the fir is almost stud wood sized in places and there are some 6 inch spruce on the but end, only 13 years old. I'm pleased with the hardwoods to, starting to self prune. My plantations are mixed with maple, ash and aspen, w. pine, larch (wet places) some nice white cedar also.

Scared off a moose Sunday as well. They sure hate white pine.

Dodgy Loner · « **Reply #21 on:** September 09, 2009, 11:08:45 am »

Your success ratio is better than mine, BP!

I hope that one that's still doing well will pull through!

Lanier_Lurker · « **Reply #22 on:** September 10, 2009, 09:46:00 am »

I put mine back into the refrigerator last night. I'll hope for double dormancy and try them again next spring. During the worst of winter I may put them in an outside container to get some occasional sub-freezing temperatures.

I had zero germination.

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #23 on:** September 10, 2009, 05:36:41 pm »

I'm going to go out over the hill on dad's old farm after a good hard frost and pick a pale of butternuts if the squirrels aren't too busy before then. Maybe there aren't any nuts. My tree has about 6 and I think the squirrel has cut them off.

Good luck to everyone this coming growing season.

Banjo picker · « **Reply #24 on:** September 10, 2009, 07:50:21 pm »

I was looking over these last few post and my wife sat down beside me and then I got an English lesson on how I had spelt "comeing " in the heading...but I think everyone that read it knew what I ment did they not....I just got another laugh at the ment...

Tim

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #25 on:** September 20, 2009, 05:58:21 pm »

This year's harvest off some wild trees on dad's farm he sold. There was a small grove in the middle of the butternut stand that had straight stems with clean boles. Looked like some nice future saw material, all limbed up good. Maybe 12 in the tight group. Got most these nuts from a 20"er.

News:

Author Topic: Butternuts comeing up ...but (Read 2114 times)