Drop start

[bandmiller2]

How many put the saw on the ground ,step in the handle ,to start.??Most of the people I've seen that use saws for a living just drop the saw as they pull the rope up.Is it as dangerous as the manuf. would lead you to believe.??I've always drop started and are none the worse for wear.Frank C.

[Jeff]

That's the way I always used to do it (drop start). Could never get my boot in the handle to start it the other way.  Kevin cured me of the drop start method by showing me how to tuck the saw between by knees and pull starting it. Drop starting was killing my decrepit shoulders, and the method Kevin showed me is low impact and works well for me.

[Ed]

Depends on the saw.
A warm saw or one that fires up quick will get drop started, otherwise I'll set the saw on the ground. My feet are obviously smaller than Jeffs, I can put one in the handle. 

Ed

[Kevin]

There may have been accidents which caused the manufacturers to advise against drop starting, the bar usually gets tipped towards the left leg and the potential is there to have your leg cut when the saw starts.
Using the brake would reduce the hazard .
The safety groups advise against it.
My larger saws get started on the ground when cold, either with a knee on top of the saw or a boot on the handle.
Once warm the start easily locked between the legs as Jeff mentioned.

[John Mc]

I use the between the knees method Jeff mentioned. Actually, for me the rear handle area gets tucked under the inside/back of my right thigh with my right leg bent a bit at the knee, and held in place with the front of my left thigh. Left hand on the front handle, right hand pulls the starter cord. This makes a bit of "offset"... so if it's stiff or jams, it just pulls up against my right thigh, rather than other, more painful places.

This works for me for all but the most stubborn cases... for those, the saw gets put on the ground.

John Mc

[sprucebunny]

Maybe my smaller saws have smaller handles but my steel toe boots don't fit in them, so it's drop start for me.

The knee thing is awkward and awkward seems dangerous.( This might be because I'm shorter)
If I have a real problem getting a saw going, a piece of board thru the handle and stand on that works sometimes.

[Maineloggerkid]

When my saw is warm, I drop start it. When it is cold, I sometimes use the leg lock. With the chain brake on, I don't see too much danger in the drop start method.

[John Mc]

Maybe my smaller saws have smaller handles but my steel toe boots don't fit in them, so it's drop start for me.

My boots don't fit either... though some saws have a wide spot on the handle that I can step on if I'm standing on the clutch side of the saw.

The knee thing is awkward and awkward seems dangerous.( This might be because I'm shorter)
If I have a real problem getting a saw going, a piece of board thru the handle and stand on that works sometimes.

The knee thing is taught by various chainsaw safety courses, such as the "Game of Logging". Once you get used to it, it's pretty secure.

That board through the handle idea is a good one. One of those things I wonder why I never thought of.

[beenthere]

Drop start for me.

Drop start is easiest for me, and uses both arms to separate the saw from the starter rope handle.  i.e. less individual arm movement.
 
I use the toe in the handle when I am at the 'game-of'logging' class

[chevytaHOE5674]

When the saw's are cold I start them on the ground and let them warm up. Once warm I put the rear handle between the legs and start that way.

Watched a guy saw into his left leg while walking and doing a drop start. That was the end of drop starting for me.

Be safe.

[beenthere]

Walking while drop starting will add a new dimension to the game. 
 

[chevytaHOE5674]

I say walking, but it was more like just one step forward...start.... 10 steps to the truck and the hospital.

[ErikC]

  I drop start a lot, but with bigger saws would rather rest the bar on a log or stump. I think outright drop starting is kinda hard on the recoil. Especially when warm, one pull and off you go. I also use the brake most of the time.  As far as "approved methods" I prefer the between the knees hold to putting the saw on the ground with my foot in the handle.

[bandmiller2]

Anyone got a picture of that leg lock thing,all i can think of is the handle sliding up my leg with evil intentions.Frank C.

[Maineloggerkid]

^^^^^^^ Been known to happen, hehe.

One downfall to that start method.

[GASoline71]

Dropstart every saw I have ever run... with one exception... my Homelite 770G.

When I ran an 076 with a 41 inch bar way back when... I would just rest the bar on a stump or a log, and drop start it.

Gary

[beenthere]

Bandmiller
How often that happens depends on how fast a learner one is.   

[Al_Smith]

Behind the knee is a good way for a midsize saw .Bumblebees start easy on a drop .A large saw with a long bar is next to impossible to drop safely .

[OneWithWood]

For the first start of the day I place the saw on the ground and hold it with my foot.  Every start after that I hold it with my knees.  Holding it between your legs is actually quite confortable and stable.  The only drawback is when I am starting one of the saws without a compression release (038 and 440) and the pull handle gets ripped out of my hands when it coughs and doesn't start (rare but it happens).  That hard rubber handle can really hurt when it bounces off your jewelry 

[GASoline71]

The only drawback is when I am starting one of the saws without a compression release (038 and 440) and the pull handle gets ripped out of my hands when it coughs and doesn't start (rare but it happens).  That hard rubber handle can really hurt when it bounces off your jewelry 

Bring the saw up on the compression stroke, and then pull... you will find that it makes non-compression release saws a lot easier to start without the "kick" when it misses.

Gary

[Jeff]

Anyone got a picture of that leg lock thing,all i can think of is the handle sliding up my leg with evil intentions.Frank C.

[John Mc]

It may be hard to see from the angle of the video from Jeff's post, but I believe the saw handle is actually on the inside of his right thigh, rather than "right up the middle". Note also that the saw is tilted slightly to the right (as seen by the person holding the saw). This gives a better angle for the pull, and also seems to help keep the handle from sliding up (the bit of tilt makes the handle take up more space so it can't slide up as easily). Obviously, you want to keep your legs fairly close together...

[Kevin]

Here's more on that under Starting Tips ...

http://www.forestapps.com/tips/tips.htm

[Al_Smith]

  The only drawback is when I am starting one of the saws without a compression release (038 and 440) and the pull handle gets ripped out of my hands when it coughs and doesn't start (rare but it happens).  That hard rubber handle can really hurt when it bounces off your jewelry 

I have a ported 038 mag that can come back on you hard .The worst I've ever had in my life though is a 2100 Huskey that would nearly rip the fingers off your hand and it's bone stock  .That one now has a d handle on it . Cold start on that one is on the ground .

[madhatte]

I always use the knee lock method.  Works every time and doesn't risk either kickback or back strain. 

[GASoline71]

My 044... 

http://www.youtube.com/v/sy83qYFLwfw

Gary

[bandmiller2]

Jeff and the rest of you guys thanks I'll have to try all systems sure one will work best for me.Frank c.

[Rocky_J]

b-b-b-b-but Gary, you didn't have the chain brake set and you didn't have the rear handle wedged between your knees! Aren't you afraid of the saw flailing wildly about and cutting your leg off? 


But that's the way I've always done it as well. Total control and the chain is spinning in a plane that is NOT in line with my body. I dislike seeing guys start a big saw by holding the rear handle (and trigger) with their right hand and throwing the saw forward as they pull the rope with their left. The tip will end up hitting the ground at some point and they have no control over kickback if it strikes something and flies up and back at them at full throttle.

[beenthere]

.............. I dislike seeing guys start a big saw by holding the rear handle (and trigger) with their right hand and throwing the saw forward as they pull the rope with their left. The tip will end up hitting the ground at some point and they have no control over kickback if it strikes something and flies up and back at them at full throttle.

Probably helps explain why the "drop start" gets the bad rap.   

Like Rocky says and Gary showed, have not experienced any wild flailing with the drop start where the left hand holds the forward handle and the right hand pulls the start cord.

On another note, I find that there is a certain amount of danger (risk) when taking the brake off while the saw is running. Have to hold the rear handle while letting go of the forward handle and releasing the brake. That moment of time before gripping the forward handle again is when the saw can accidentaly be revved and injury happen because two hands are not in control. It is one reason I rarely flip the brake on after a cut. Occasionally I do, if I am in brush and do not have good footing. I always try to keep the the throttle finger away from the throttle/trigger.

[John Mc]

On another note, I find that there is a certain amount of danger (risk) when taking the brake off while the saw is running. Have to hold the rear handle while letting go of the forward handle and releasing the brake. That moment of time before gripping the forward handle again is when the saw can accidentally be revved and injury happen because two hands are not in control. It is one reason I rarely flip the brake on after a cut. Occasionally I do, if I am in brush and do not have good footing. I always try to keep the the throttle finger away from the throttle/trigger.

Good point, an done that is not always touched upon in the safety classes. On one of my saws, I can still at least keep my thumb hooked around the front handle and reach the break with my fingers. On the other, it's too much of a stretch for my thumb to have any kind of grip.

John Mc

[RSteiner]

I use the between the knees method Jeff mentioned. Actually, for me the rear handle area gets tucked under the inside/back of my right thigh with my right leg bent a bit at the knee, and held in place with the front of my left thigh. Left hand on the front handle, right hand pulls the starter cord. This makes a bit of "offset"... so if it's stiff or jams, it just pulls up against my right thigh, rather than other, more painful places.

This works for me for all but the most stubborn cases... for those, the saw gets put on the ground.

John Mc

Ditto for me.  I find this the best way to start a saw when some is standing near.  Drop starting seems to swing the saw around which could catch some one walking by that you don't see.

Randy

[GASoline71]

Like Rocky says and Gary showed, have not experienced any wild flailing with the drop start where the left hand holds the forward handle and the right hand pulls the start cord.

Being 6' 5" helps too...

Gary

[beenthere]

Being 6' 5" helps too...

Gary

    Doesn't help me...they built the sidewalks too close to my rear end, and I only get up to 5'9"   

[timber tramp]

  I'll agree with Gary on his starting method. I run an 044 also, although I'm nowhere near 6'5" (5'8") .                  TT

[Dan_Shade]

i normally do the between the knees thing when it's cold, but will drop start like GASoline71 after it's warmed up, and very easy to start.  The saws I use now have compression releases on them, which makes starting much easier.

I always use the chainbrake.  I started that practice a few years ago, and think it's a good one.

[oldsaw]

I'll drop start all of my saws warm, the only exception is when I have the 42" on the 066.  Cold, I won't drop the 066 unless it's got the 24" on it, but I don't do it often since it has no compression release.  The rest, whatever.  Funny how I do it without really thinking about it, but I've got short bars on everything else.  Just run a 20" on the 372, and with comp release, that's an easier start than the Super XL, which starts easily when it has been used recently.

Please be aware that Gary is one of those overcompensating West Coast longbar guys.   

[Tom Sawyer]

I have gotten into the habit of setting the brake everytime I set the saw down, and checking it everytime before I start it.  So I always drop start.  I find that it is easier on my arms to let the weight of the saw help pull the cord.

Tom

[Hawkshoe]

Ummm...My name is Matt and.....ummm...I'm a drop starter.......
I will start using the brake, though.  Oh yeah, If the wife's watchin, I'm a ground starter!

[OneWithWood]

I always use the brake if the bar is not on the way to or in the cut.  On my Stihls it is not a problem to release the brake while controlling the saw.  If I have a long bar on the saw that makes it a bit nose heavy I rest the bar on a log and release the brake.

[DanG]

On another note, I find that there is a certain amount of danger (risk) when taking the brake off while the saw is running. Have to hold the rear handle while letting go of the forward handle and releasing the brake. That moment of time before gripping the forward handle again is when the saw can accidentaly be revved and injury happen because two hands are not in control. It is one reason I rarely flip the brake on after a cut. Occasionally I do, if I am in brush and do not have good footing. I always try to keep the the throttle finger away from the throttle/trigger.

I find it pretty easy to hold the saw with the left hand on the forward handle and release the brake with my throttle hand.  I've been using the brake more of late.  Guess I'm getting a little bit wiser in my old age.

I do think it is safer to walk with the saw running and the brake released than it is to try either operation in thick brush.  Both of my saws are tuned well enough that they will idle indefinitely without the chain moving, and I think that is an important safety point.  If your saw won't do that, and I've seen many that won't, it needs some work IMHO. 

[GASoline71]

Please be aware that Gary is one of those overcompensating West Coast longbar guys.   

Yes sir!  Imma proud to be a knuckledragger...

Gary

[SawTroll]

I'll drop start all of my saws warm, the only exception is when I have the 42" on the 066.  Cold, I won't drop the 066 unless it's got the 24" on it, but I don't do it often since it has no compression release.  The rest, whatever.  Funny how I do it without really thinking about it, but I've got short bars on everything else.  Just run a 20" on the 372, and with comp release, that's an easier start than the Super XL, which starts easily when it has been used recently.

Please be aware that Gary is one of those overcompensating West Coast longbar guys.   

I allways dropstart, with the left hand on the rope - but 372xpg/24" is my latgest saw.

And yes, I agree on Gary!   

[RSteiner]

The technique I have seen and associated with drop starting is where the left hand grips the starter cord and the right hand throws the saw down and around the front of the body.  This causes the saw to swing wildly around in front of the person staring it.  There was a logging crew working on land behind mine where I saw this method being used so not knowing any better at the time I copied the "pro's".

Once I was introduced to the between the knees method by Soren Erickson I changed my ways.  I will admit that when warm my two Huskys with compression release start so easy with one pull that I am able to hold the saw down with a stiff right arm and pull the starter cord with the left hand with a light short pull and it is running.

Randy

[nmurph]

not much going on here today, so i will reply. i'm a right hand-on-the-rear-handle drop-starter. i do it on everything from the 394 with a 24" down. i don't use the decomp most of the time, except on the 394. the 125 with a 60" is just a little too big. as to some the previous comments, i am not at tall as Gary, though 6'4" is pretty close, and that height does give you a little more distance to the ground. i do occasionally use the brake when starting. i use the brake more and more while i walking throught the woods. i guess it is more dangerous, but so is everything else in the woods. i think that for me, this is one of the safer things i do with a chainsaw. this is an inherently dangerous activity. you have to always be aware of the worst-case scenario possibilities.

[Ironwood]

Always drop start. Always use the safety brake immeadiately as my cuts end (just second nature now)


Ironwood

[Al_Smith]

I started doing this stuff long before chain brakes were ever even thought of .At this point in life I forget they are even there most of the time .

[bandmiller2]

I never set the chain brake,to me it dosen't seem right to start a saw on high idle with the brake set and wear the clutch.When I started we were lucky to have the hand guard.Have good footing and think before you do something.Frank C.

[Ironwood]

I grew up listening to Homelite xL's, heard a nieghbor fire one the other day, knew exactly what kinda saw it was. Amazing how far saws have come, quiet, safer, easier on our bods (vibration isolation). Makes you wander what will come next? Suppose that is what folks driving 1940's cars said

           Ironwood

[DanG]

Personally, I'm looking forward to electric start!

Like most other oldtimers, I use the brake sparingly.  I put the bigger saw on the ground for cold starting, and it does start on high idle.  However, I use the brake when doing this to protect the chain from striking the ground.  I pick the saw up immediately and release the brake as soon as it clears the ground.  Once I clear the high idle, the chain doesn't move at idle, so the brake doesn't seem important anyway.  When warm starting that same saw, I use the drop method.  It starts on first pull every time with no throttle, so here again the chain isn't moving and the brake isn't needed.

As Frank stated, having a good plan, which includes good footing, frees you up to concentrate on the saw and the cut itself when the saw is in the wood.  I would venture to guess that being in a hurry hurts more people than any other factor, including fatigue.

[Cut4fun]

I started doing this stuff long before chain brakes were ever even thought of .At this point in life I forget they are even there most of the time .

I haven't used saws that long, but the 4 I learned on didn't have chain brakes. Poulan 2000 305 3300 3750. So I never use the brakes either.
But one day while using a Poulan 220  I picked up dirt cheap like new  from Texas for $50. I hit a 1" solid metal rod in the center of a hand hewd beam and found out how a chain brake works when that puppy kicked back, shut off with brake engaged. Also cutting through a barn door and hit a metal slide on the opposite side and did the same thing and broke a few cutters off.
So I do see a use for the brakes, but only when they decide to be needed.

[Engineer]

I am 39 now, been cutting since age 14, so that makes 25 years worth of starting my saws exactly the same way Gary shows in his video.  I always thought that was considered "drop starting" - I'd think you were insane to start a chain saw with the right hand on the rear handle and the left hand pulling the rope.   When I took GOL training, I was taught the same way Jeff demonstrates in his video, but I don't like it much and especially not on a cold-start larger-displacement saw.  I have done the "boot-on-the-handle" start on the ground, but there's been a few times that I got a bar nose full of dirt from a failed start.  I can't say that I've started a chain saw with my left hand more than 20 times in my life, and it makes me nervous every time.  The 'gary' start, however, is what I'm used to, and from the way you have to hold the saw I can't see how it's any more dangerous that any other method.  I used that method successfully when I had a 25" bar on my old 066, and it worked fine when I din't feel like it wanted to dislocate my fingers.

[Dodgy Loner]

I've always started a chainsaw the way Gary does it, with the exception that I always use the chain brake when I start it.  I've never owned a saw without a chain brake (I started out with a Stihl 029 and now I have a 440).  I've also never seen or heard of someone drop-starting a chainsaw while holding their handle with their right and and pulling the rope with the left, until now.  I guess that's why the drop start gets a bad rap, because I honestly don't see where the risk is the way I do it.

[DanG]

Dodgy, the chainsaws of yore were cantankerous beasts.  They didn't have the choke-activated fast idle feature like we enjoy today.  On most of'em, you had to keep your finger on the trigger to get the thing going, and that left a feller one hand short for doing it any other way.  That's just another joy of life that better technology has taken away from us.

[bandmiller2]

Many times the smaller "limbing" saws are started by holding the handle and pulling over with the left hand especially in a bucket.Frank C.

[Dodgy Loner]

DanG, I guess I'm glad I missed out on that era.

Bandmiller, don't those limbing saws have a handle balanced in center of the saw, rather than on the end, so they can be used one-handed? (Like this).  That seems to be a lot safer than drop-starting your average chainsaw while holding the handle.

[Cut4fun]

Many times the smaller "limbing" saws are started by holding the handle and pulling over with the left hand especially in a bucket.Frank C.

I never thought about it, but when my little poulan 1800 and 2000 are already warmed up from trimming duties. I start them with the right hand on the throttle and pull start with the left hand, never realized that I was doing that till reading these posted and it sunk in. 

[GASoline71]

Yep... My little Power Mac 6 is the same way... hold handle with right hand, and pull with left.  It's only got a 12" bar on it.  Little feller...

Gary

[nmurph]

when i drop-start with the right hand on the rear, i do not have my finger on the throttle, so the kick-back argument is pretty much moot. besides, gunning the throttle while starting will only flood a saw. when i drop-start the saw moves down and away from me putting the bar farther away from my body than if i had it bw my legs. again, i do not argue with someone who wants to do it a different way, but with my height and arm length, i do not see it as a significant safety risk.