Central Boiler Classic 6048 finally Up & Running.

[DR_Buck]

My Central Boiler Classic 6048 was delivered some months ago and I've been slowly working to get it installed and operating.   Today I reached a significant milestone.  I got it fired up!


Here's a shot of the unit with "first" smoke coming out of the top.

The open pit to the right is where I will continue digging the trench to the new garage/barn in the background.  I am putting under floor heat down before I have the slab poured.   That should happen sometime in December after I get all the cash accounted for.  The concrete work for the floor is almost $6000!   


This view is from the back porch out to where the unit sits.  It's about 85 feet.  The distance was limited by the cost of the Thermopex  tubing.  At $12 per foot I put it as close as I could and still be clear of smoke.

The thermopex is buried and goes under the porch where the two new looking deck boards are installed.  It then comes up and goes up the outside wall into the eves of the house.

My heat pump where I installed the the heat exchanger is in the middle of the house and is not easy to access from the outside. This was poor planning on my part 11 years ago when I remodeled the house.   We do not have a basement, so going up and over was the only choice.  I had to fight the pex tubing through the walls.  In one place I even had to take up the floor upstairs so I could route the tubing through the floor joists. 

Here is the "closet" where the heat pump is located showing how I installed and piped the heat exchanger.

We're testing it tonight.       I've run the thermostat up to 85° to see how long it takes to climb up from 70°.   In just over 2 1/2 hours we're up to 81°     The wife is starting to complain that it's hot in here.   

I still have to hook up the heat exchanger for the domestic hot water.  That will have to wait until I start the kitchen and downstairs bath remodel job later this winter.  The hot water heater is even harder to get the plumbing to than the air handler for the heat pump.

[thecfarm]

You will enjoy having the boiler.I did put a shut off in my heat exchanger so I could use the furnace to heat the hot water all summer without heating the house up too much.Worked real well for us.Kept it running for a year steady.Should of got one years ago as I say.

[OneWithWood]

Nice job, DR.
How difficult or easy was it to join the pieces of Thermopex tubing?
For the run to the greenhouse I laid the pex in 4" corrugated tile, split up the side and filled it with the foam insulation you buy in a can.  Pain in the patootie and I don't know if I saved all that much dinero.

[DR_Buck]

Nice job, DR.
How difficult or easy was it to join the pieces of Thermopex tubing?
For the run to the greenhouse I laid the pex in 4" corrugated tile, split up the side and filled it with the foam insulation you buy in a can.  Pain in the patootie and I don't know if I saved all that much dinero.

Joining the Thermopex wasn't an issue.  I put it in in one long section up to the eves of the house.   However, handling it was another issue.      It was kind of like trying to push a 2500 bull into the back seat of a PT cruiser.       The stuff does not want to bend.  Even the section bolted to the wall of the house had a serious curve from the roll.  I couldn't push it tight against the wall.  I used the bucket on the Kubota to hold it in place while I screwed the clamps into the brick.      

From the eves I connected with straight connectors and copper compression rings to "standard 1" pex lines.   I'm going to cover them with the split side slip-on foam sleeves to give them some insulation.

For the run to the new barn/garage I'm using a different method recommended by an installer.   He said for the customers he has that do not want to pay for the high price thermopex, he uses standard pex.  First he covers each run of the pex with the good quality neoprene style split-side insulation, then places both runs inside 4" sewer and drain PVC pipe gluing the joints to keep out water.    I've already purchased everything and the total cost was <$200.   If I used Thermopex, it would have been about $560.

[antos_ketcham]

FWIW - I've run a CB 5036 and am now running an E-Classic. My experience has been that chimney caps on OWB's creosote shut and before they do that they help keep smoke near the ground.

Nice set-up.

Pete

[DR_Buck]

My experience has been that chimney caps on OWB's creosote shut and before they do that they help keep smoke near the ground.

The sales guy told me the same thing.  So, I left the mesh screen out and just put the cap on to keep rain out during the summer as I will not be burning it then.   

[tonto]

Dr. Buck, nice set up. I just fired up my Central Boiler 5036 this past weekend. I've had it for 2 months now and am so glad to finally be blowing smoke. Had to wait on friends to help with digging trench and plumbing, but well worth the wait. It's going to be nice not having to pay oil bills. My wife called me today and told me we had turn down the heat and the hot water is to hot !!!!! I agree with the chimney caps, with out one, mine blows straight up. A friend of mine has an old Heatmore with a cap an creosote builds up bad. I love this forum, every question I had about OWB's has been answered with out having to ask. 

[firefreak47]

new member here but have been reading the post on owf for a couple of days, i have a central boiler ordered i chose them out of the 20 or so i found on line because most of the people i know have a central boiler and one guy has had his 10 yrs with no problems, just wondering what you guys have used for the underground piping the stuff from cb is exspensive at 12 per foot also have you hooked them up direct or through an exchanger my hot water comes from coils in my furnace now but dont understand how the cb will heat it because it wont circulate through the furnace like it will for the heating zones thanks

[DR_Buck]

new member here but have been reading the post on owf for a couple of days, i have a central boiler ordered i chose them out of the 20 or so i found on line because most of the people i know have a central boiler and one guy has had his 10 yrs with no problems, just wondering what you guys have used for the underground piping the stuff from cb is exspensive at 12 per foot also have you hooked them up direct or through an exchanger my hot water comes from coils in my furnace now but dont understand how the cb will heat it because it wont circulate through the furnace like it will for the heating zones thanks

.....customers he has that do not want to pay for the high price thermopex, he uses standard pex.  First he covers each run of the pex with the good quality neoprene style split-side insulation, then places both runs inside 4" sewer and drain PVC pipe gluing the joints to keep out water. 

[sawdust]

I'm not sure what the insulation factor would be. Using 2 inch thick blue styro span sheet ripped in six inch wide strips. Two channels routed length wise and half the depth of the pex. The pipes were sandwiched in there and duct tape wrapped around to keep it closed. The resulting box was buried in the dry clay about 1.5 feet deep to the top of the box. Total run was about 150 feet. I have no idea how it works, Merv died.

sawdust

[DR_Buck]

I'm not sure what the insulation factor would be. Using 2 inch thick blue styro span sheet ripped in six inch wide strips. Two channels routed length wise and half the depth of the pex. The pipes were sandwiched in there and duct tape wrapped around to keep it closed. The resulting box was buried in the dry clay about 1.5 feet deep to the top of the box. Total run was about 150 feet. I have no idea how it works, Merv died.

sawdust

I've seen pre-cut foam insulation on ebay that is sized to go into pvc drain pipe.  However, I have not tried sing it.  The biggest issue is to keep the pipe dry.   If it lays in water or ground water gets into the insulation heat is "wicked" away into the ground.   

[firefreak47]

i plan on using 1 in pex with foaminsulation then put in 4 in drain pipe but was wondering if anyone has done this and how it works, also seams like there is alot of air space so i was wondering if i should try to fill that with some regular insulation and tape it before putting in 4 in pipe or would it be ok like that for 100 ft it has been less than $250 2 rolls 1 in pex roll of 4 in and enough foam insulation compared to $800 for 75 feet thermo pex that i would need

[thecfarm]

That's how I did mine.I do lose some heat this way.I only buried my lines about 18 inches.The snow will stay on top of where the lines are buried for 2-3 days than it's bare ground.I want to put a cold frame over the lines.     But it's kinda good that I do lose some heat.At least when the power goes out I don't have to run to start the generator up.The ground will keep the pipes warm for quite some time.I did spray a bunch of expandable foam on each end of the lines.Just to keep the cold air from coming into the house and the back of the furnace.I used all one piece of drain pipe.No seams to try to seal up.I have my own wood too.If you are buying wood how much more wood would it take the cheaper way?Would the more expensive PEX pipe pay for itself in 10 years?

[firefreak47]

thecfarm how  far away is your owf i work with a guy that did this also and said he only lost 1 degree in 50 feet, mine will be about 75 feet,  as of right now wood is free but that could change years down the road, also dont want to spend 12 a foot on the good stuff because eventually i will be putting an addition on because we had triplets  in jan. and this pipe will be dug out and half or more of this pipe will then be inside the new garage so then i might put the good stuff in for the underground,what coldd box are you talking about? thanks

[thecfarm]

I doubt it's 40 feet away.I may not lose much temp from the owf to the garage,but I lose heat from the pipe.That's why no snow on the ground.I'm heating the great outdoors one foot at a time.    It will work just fine,if you don't mind losing some heat and using more wood.In your case,it would be foolish to use the more expensive pipe from what you stated.I just wanted to make it clear that it would take more wood to use the cheap stuff.
Cold frame,just a box with a glass or plastic top angled to catch the sun rays in the early spring or late fall to extend the growing season.I think most are used for salads greens,spinach,cold crops.The ones I have seen are 2-3 feet by 4 feet long.People must use them around you in NY.

[Jasperfield]

Dr_Buck,

I can tell you've spent a lot of time planning and arranging for a "clean and proper" if not "Bristol" installation. It looks good. As for the ditching...try not to think while you're doing it. Just focus on the digging and remember..."This is the job I've got now, and it'll soon pass."

Northern VA is beautiful country.

Jasperfield

[DR_Buck]

Dr_Buck,

I can tell you've spent a lot of time planning and arranging for a "clean and proper" if not "Bristol" installation. It looks good. As for the ditching...try not to think while you're doing it. Just focus on the digging and remember..."This is the job I've got now, and it'll soon pass."

Northern VA is beautiful country.

Jasperfield

Thanks for the complements.  The ditch digging is not going to be a problem.  I bought a backhoe for my Kubota. 

[firefreak47]

thecfarm how did you get the pex through the 4 in pipe? did it slide in easy also did you use 1/2 or 3/8 insulation on the pipes thanks

[thecfarm]

My pex pipe is kinda joined together with ¼ inch foam than that is wrapped up with something like aluminum foil wrap.All this is about 3½ inches wide.I did not run this through the 4" drain pipe.The dealer I bought the furnace from did it for me.

[DR_Buck]

Well after a little over a week of burning for what it's worth I've got some data on wood consumption.   It will all change when the barn/garage floor is poured and the heat loop is hooked up.

So far when temps are above 40° F  I get two fulls days of burn on one load of wood. The past couple days the temps have dropped into the low 30s at night and I'm filling the burner once each evening.   Wood is a mix of oak, poplar, cedar and pine from my slab pile.   Most of it is dry.  A lot of the red oak was cut down this past May and is still somewhat green.   

I still haven't removed any ash from the unit.  I does not appear to be to full and what is there contains a lot of hot coals.   Maybe this coming weekend I'll shovel some of them out.

[firefreak47]

just picked up my 5036 sunday plan on hooking up this weekend, but as it sat in my driveway on the trailer neighbor already bitching they are going to complain about hte smoke it causes because of all the negative things online about owb and how bad they smoke and the emissions they give off. the people i know that have central boilers said they dont smoke that bad so hoping not to have to much smoke but was wondering if there are any websites that have actual emission test on these boilers expecially the 5036 since any sites i found say they have really been any full testing or if they mention test it doesnt say what owb was tested i have a permit from town so not much they can do but i have seen some royal crown furnaces that smoke alot and the smoke just hangs there thank

[tonto]

Congrates firefreak47 on your purchase. I also have a 5036 and I don't run a cap on it and it doesn't smoke to bad. The dryness of the wood has alot to do with how much it smokes - mainly only when the damper opens. Where in NY are you, I'm near Kingston if you wanted to check it out.

[firefreak47]

tonto i am near middletown i dont plan on running it with a cap either how long have you had it? where did you purchace. i think the problem with the neighbor is just all the negativity online about owbs they pointed out the one from office of attorney general smoke gets in you lungs but even in there they say there hasnt been enough testing i have to tried to find positive test results expecially on this model to so them but havent found any, but hey cant please everyone

[tonto]

Firebreak47, I live in Kerhonkson just a bit north of Ellenville. My Neighbors where a little nervous at first also but once they have seen running now for 3 weeks it doesn't smoke much more than their wood stoves did. I placed it so the way the wind blows the most , it sends the smoke out into a corn field most of the time. It is only about 50 feet from all 3 houses. I bought mine from Halloran Farms in Callicoon Center - very nice people to deal with.

[firefreak47]

tonto that is where i purchaced mine as well, my owf will be about 250 feet away from there house and the wind will blow it to the back not the side towards them most of the time

[DR_Buck]

I'll try and get this thread back on topic. 


As of today, Im almost finished phase 2 of the CL6048 project.


Here is a shot of the new barn (garage) I recently had put up.  Tomorrow the concrete gets poured. 

This effort has been a long time coming and is completly funded by part-time custom milling. 


As you can see in these next two photos the garage is going to have under floor heat. 

 

These two shots show where everything comes together and goes goes under wall to the CL6048 and the power panel in the house.   

This last photo I refer to as "my thinking ahead photo"      The wider spacing between the pex runs is to give me a place to "safely" drill  holes to mount my tire changing machine without drilling through my heat tubing. 

This is going to be so great working with not only a concrete floor, but one with heat.    .   I'm not going to miss laying on gravel or wet grass.       If all goes as planned, I should be moving in by thanksgiving day.   

[OneWithWood]

So now I have to build another building . . .

[DR_Buck]

So now I have to build another building . . .

             With heat . 

[OneWithWood]

check, with heat 

It will be my new bio diesel processing facility - with no flame heat 

[farmerdoug]

DR Buck,

Did you put foam insulation under the gravel?

[DR_Buck]

DR Buck,

Did you put foam insulation under the gravel?

No....This is Virginia,  not Michigan. 

[farmerdoug]

I know.

But you will be suprised at the heat loss to the ground even in your area.

[tonto]

Dr Buck, I am so jealous, This is the type and size of building that I would like to build someday and also heat with my Central Boiler. What size is it and what do you think you will have invested in it if you don't mind me asking?

[beenthere]

farmerdoug
That VA ground is gonna be warmer soon...

[DR_Buck]

Dr Buck, I am so jealous, This is the type and size of building that I would like to build someday and also heat with my Central Boiler. What size is it and what do you think you will have invested in it if you don't mind me asking?

Building is 30 x 40 x 10     Cost ~21k including under floor heat (not the boiler).

[farmerdoug]

Beenthere,

Then they will be turning on  their airconditioners back on.

[rowerwet]

That's how I did mine.I do lose some heat this way.I only buried my lines about 18 inches.The snow will stay on top of where the lines are buried for 2-3 days than it's bare ground. Would the more expensive PEX pipe pay for itself in 10 years?

I got the thermopex, I have 85', not cheap but I loose no heat and the ground in my backyard is frozen solid over the pipe run. I also see no heat loss from one end to the other. The claim is 1* for every 100'.

[terra8186]

I purchased a central boiler 6048 3 years ago.  I run it just during the winter months.  I get real tired of burning at the end of winter and don't want to worry about it until October.  I burn
20-30 cords of wood during this time period.  2/3 of this is for my 2 outbuildings:  40x60 and a 30x30.

Don't get to anxious about empting your ashes.  My salesman told me you would lose a lot of heat if you didn't leave a lot of ash.  I didn't really believe him, but I have noticed a huge difference for 2-3 days after I empty.  I do this once/month.  I leave a lot of ash still in the box.

I also had a draft inducer installed on my when it was new.  I don't recommend one.  I took it off this year and reduced my wood consumption by 1/3.

You should love your new boiler.

[DR_Buck]

I'm getting ready for the coming heating season.    The slab pile is in good shape and should carry me for some time.   I also have a number of downed oaks back in the woods to haul out.    I expect it will be sometime mid to late October when I fire it up.

I also think I fixed one of the issues I had last winter.   The smoke from the CB would hang low around the back yard and you could smell it in the house when there wasn't any wind blowing.   I added two additional sections of smoke stack to get it up clear of all obstructions.  It wasn't cheap, but it was necessary.   The top of the stack is now 20' off the ground.    Besides the two chimney sections, I had to buy the brace kit, bottom brace ring and reinforcing band clamps for each section.   

I still need to get the propane line connected for the backup burner.  I haven't used it at all yet.   But if I plan on being gone 3 days or so I will need it.   However, it takes a while for the fire to burn out and for the water to cool down.  Last year when I shut it down, it took 7 days for the coals to cool down and the water temp to drop below 100°.   

[tonto]

Dr Buck, I ran mine all summer just to see how much of a pain it would be to run. Not that bad, only burned about a cord and a half of scrap wood since April. Smoke can be a little tricky as the wind can be very still sometimes - not going were it normally does. When it would not cooperate I would just lower the temp so it wouldn't come on and wait for the wind to pick up and then raise the temp - never had to re-light the stove, sometimes even 3-4 days later. I am so happy with this stove I just can't believe I didn't do it sooner. Have not burned a drop of oil since Nov 08. Tonto.

[DR_Buck]

I'm about a month into burning this year and all is well.  I have made one change this summer that has help immensely.  I added two more sections of chimney for a total of 4.   I then put the cap back on top (screen removed) to keep the rain out.    So far this year I have not had any problems with ground level smoke.  Last year we had a lot of smoke oder getting into the house because it was hanging low to the ground.   Now the top is 20 above ground and the smoke drifts away.       On the down side, I no longer get those spectacular flames shooting out of the chimney when I open the door to feed the fire.   

[JJ]

I buy the thermoplex from CB, and it runs mostly 3' under ground, but there is place it is only 6" to 8" and snow doesn't melt.
I think the thermoplex is worth the $.

             JJ