Author Topic: Locust trees (Read 2168 times)

Raider Bill · « **on:** July 29, 2008, 10:56:50 am »

I have hundreds of them at various sizes.
What are they good for except poking holes in my tires and fence posts?

thedeeredude · « **Reply #1 on:** July 29, 2008, 04:25:36 pm »

Honey locust makes really pretty lumber. If the trees are big enough and of good enough quality. I think it would be a beautiful flooring wood.

tyb525 · « **Reply #2 on:** July 29, 2008, 04:51:47 pm »

Same here. Locust is durable and very rot-resistant. Very good for decks or other outdoor furniture. Watch out for post-borer beetles, I think they like locust alot. Also, it is much harder dry than green.

Raider Bill · « **Reply #3 on:** July 29, 2008, 05:14:04 pm »

The biggest ones I have are second genaration and I'd guess to be no bigger that 10" at chest height.
The 69 acres I bought was logged off in 82 replanted with loblolly which the pine bore beetles destroyed gining locust, poplar, some oak and maple a chance.

DR_Buck · « **Reply #4 on:** July 29, 2008, 05:34:55 pm »

I milled and kiln dried about 300 bf of it back in the spring. Most was 1x3 to 1x6 in 3-5 foot lengths. I planed it up to show off the cool color and grain. I sold every stick of it in the first 2 days of a 3 day woodworking show.

moonhill · « **Reply #5 on:** July 29, 2008, 10:35:18 pm »

22 years under a yurt, as post, and they were still green just a 1/2" in, I don't think you could force them to rot. Tim

Cedarman · « **Reply #6 on:** July 30, 2008, 07:49:48 am »

Honey locust, the one with all the thorns is not good for fence posts. It has the white heartwood. Black locust sapwood will rot, especially if the bark is left on. For posts, I cut the locust lay about 100 to 200 posts on the ground and drive over them with a tractor. For best debarking, have the posts about 2 layers deep. The driving on the posts will loosen the bark. Then you can use a screw driver and pull the bark off in long strips. This should be done the day they are cut. Debarking the posts will give the sapwood a chance to cure and make it more rot resistant.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #7 on:** July 30, 2008, 01:23:40 pm »

Cedarman,

You must be confusing Honey locust with another species. Honey locust has a pinkish heartwood and is well thought of as a pretty decent choice for fenceposts. I have not used them for it personally, but the .gov site and virtually everything I have ever read claims it is one of the better species for posts.

As to having white heartwood, I wish I had my camera I have a couple fresh whoppers out in the yard I drug in from the woods this weekend. The color is beautiful . . . one of my favoirtes.

Raider Bill · « **Reply #8 on:** July 30, 2008, 03:17:18 pm »

I'm not sure if my bigger trees have spines or not but the new ones that just start growing sure do. Triangle shaped spears heads that really tear up a tire.
They seem to sprout up over night in my clearings.

Cedarman · « **Reply #9 on:** July 30, 2008, 04:48:09 pm »

Honey locust has a lot of genetic variation over its range. The Texas variety is notably different from that in our area. Ours tends to be fast growing with a very big sap ring and small amount of the darkish heart. Sap ring is very light colored. When the tree dies it doesn't decay as fast as poplar and gum, but doesn't hang around like a locust, walnut or white oak log will. People around here will not use them for posts because they won't last too long in the ground compared to black locust and cedar. My guess is that the big regional differences in the species explains the difference in how the tree is used.

Raider Bill · « **Reply #10 on:** July 30, 2008, 08:13:56 pm »

When I get up there next week I'll take a pix so someone can tell me what I've got.

Handy Andy · « **Reply #11 on:** July 30, 2008, 10:54:19 pm »

The long thorned ones in Kansas are Black Locust, and the thornless are honey locust. Black locust makes a very pretty floor, lots more grain than oak. Jim

Toolman · « **Reply #12 on:** July 31, 2008, 06:49:11 am »

Honey locust in my area has the thorns sticking right out of trunk from ground on up. Very beautiful wood.

I bought my land from my great grandfather back in 1998 two days after his 103rd birthday. He passed away about a week after his 105th birthday!! Anyway, he had built a hunting cabin and utility shed on property back in 1949 using locust posts. The posts are about 6" diameter and debarked. A couple years ago I tore down utility shed and could'nt believe it when I cut posts off with chainsaw. The wood was still yellow/green in color and rock solid. These posts were`buried directly into ground. These posts would have lasted another 60 yrs. I threw sparks from chainsaw blade when I was cutting them. Pretty amazing!!

moonhill · « **Reply #13 on:** July 31, 2008, 06:59:15 am »

, That's three cheers for Black Locust. BL also has a small sap ring which means more heart. I wonder if wood in Texas rots as quick as it does here in Maine? Tim

Daren · « **Reply #14 on:** July 31, 2008, 07:58:30 am »

Honeylocust is very pretty lumber. One of my favorites, I have tossed around the idea of flooring myself (after I saw it for sale for $19 ft2

) It is not as decay resistant as black locust (few species are though). They are often confused. They both have thorns around here. Honeylocust has scalier bark and the seed pods are 6 to 8 inches long (and twisty), where as black locust the seed pods are only 2 to 4 inches long (and flat).
Honeylocust on the ground and the mill from a couple weeks ago. (and a couple small osage in the pile)

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #15 on:** July 31, 2008, 08:55:20 am »

Our variety of both here Texas can have thorns or not. Honleylocust is much more prolific than black locust here.

As to the decay resistance black is certainly one of the most durable species you can use. Honelylocust is not in the same genus as black.

I googled up something on it again because I wanted to see if I could find a source of information we all might be able to fairly agree is not a rehash of a rehash of a rehash. Something I believe happens on Mr. Gore's invention too often.

I stumbled across a document from the New Mexico Highway Department titled CORROSION RESISTANT FENCING MATERIALS FOR NM HIGHWAY 128 SALT PLAYAS. It's a .pdf and if you scroll down to page 19 it has a insightful table with 3 categories of durability ratings. The first is called Resistant or very resistant then the next is Moderately resistant and finally Slightly resistant or nonresistant.

Honey locust is in the middle category, containing the fewest species of trees. You would think that the most resistant category would have the fewest number but it's the moderate column, having only . There is a couple of typos I see in the very resistant category. "Oak" is listed in this column. Just "Oak". Further down the list you see the word "White" and then "Post" and also "Bur" beneath it. Obviously the compiler should have listed "White Oak" and "Post Oak" and "Bur Oak".

Anyway, it is settled at least in my mind pretty much right where it was to begin with as far as Honey locust. It is not the first choice, but certainly a satisfactory option when any of the other more desirtable species are not avaialble, unless you live in Indiana and have that lesser strain of Whiteheart Honey Locust. Stay away from that stuff.

I am not saying everyone will agree with the placement of some species in certain categories but I did notice some interesting entries.

The "Expected Lifespan" of Black locust is listed as "20+ Years" wheras Honey locust is listed as "15+ Years". Black locust is listed a distant second to Osage Orange which is listed as having a life expectancy of "35+ years". I questions the credibility of the report at least in part because of this. It is common knowledge Osage posts will last well over a hundred years. My dad has property with old fence lines of Osage posts that predate his dad's purchase of the land. Maybe the report just has to err on the side of extreme caution being a study on what species are suitable for the new highway they are/were building.

New Mexico Highway Department Paper on Specie Durability

DR_Buck · « **Reply #16 on:** August 13, 2008, 07:17:55 am »

Quote from: moonhill on July 29, 2008, 10:35:18 pm

22 years under a yurt, as post, and they were still green just a 1/2" in, I don't think you could force them to rot. Tim

What's a yurt anyway?

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #17 on:** August 13, 2008, 08:02:17 am »

Hey Doc I didn't catch that before either, so I googled it. Wiki says a yurt is . . .

A yurt is a portable, felt-covered, wood lattice-framed dwelling structure used by nomads in the steppes of Central Asia...

Look at the cool pics of yurts.

moonhill · « **Reply #18 on:** August 13, 2008, 10:00:09 pm »

Here is a link to some photos of yurts built by Bill Coperthwait here near my home. I have worked with Bill on a few yurt projects involving some crazy sawing, tapered and curved stock all on the same piece. The yurt I spoke of is in the pictures. Tim

http://www.shelterpub.com/_home_work/_coperthwaite/coper.htm

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #19 on:** August 13, 2008, 10:56:19 pm »

moon, you need to upload the pics to the gallery.

Dan_Shade · « **Reply #20 on:** August 14, 2008, 06:39:17 am »

try this: http://www.shelterpub.com/_home_work/_coperthwaite/coper.html

moonhill · « **Reply #21 on:** August 14, 2008, 09:54:41 pm »

Thanks Dan, it was late last night and I just gave up. The top center picture on that link was the yurt in reference. I have the Shelter book as well, lots of out of the ordinary buildings.

By the way, what is the proper sequence for posting pictures? I take it they have to be on the FF and not a host site. Tim

metalspinner · « **Reply #22 on:** August 14, 2008, 10:25:58 pm »

moonhill,
Here is the post to teach you the Forestry Forum way as far as posting pics is concerned. Let us know if you have questions.

http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,23851.0.html

moonhill · « **Reply #23 on:** August 15, 2008, 09:11:14 pm »

I have stumbled over that before but couldn't find it again. I have it saved now and will go through it in time. It seem a tad lengthy but I hope that is just for clarification. Thanks, Tim

dave7191 · « **Reply #24 on:** August 16, 2008, 05:27:42 pm »

Ive got some big honey locust that I had been wondering what to do with after seeing the grain i may use then for barn type vertical siding I know I've got several that are 36" or better at the butt I didn't realize that they were that good about not rotting

thecfarm · « **Reply #25 on:** August 16, 2008, 05:42:30 pm »

moonhill,it can also be found in "help" on the top of the page.All the down sizing is a big help for the people on dail up,like me.I have a cousin that just did it again for the last time.I told her once do not send us pictures unless you down size them.I will put her on my blocker list and stop the BS once and for all if she does it one more time.She will get told one last time.Than I will have to go in and choice what I want to recieve from her.It takes HOURS to get pictures from her.Than what ever she sends,after she ties everything up for hours,gets tied up until her pictures come through.She could print off any pictures she wants us to see.Yea,right.Everyone should learn how to down size pictures.If you don't need it,than don't use it.It does look like a lot at first,but do it a few times and it gets easy.We will all help you when you get stuck.

thedeeredude · « **Reply #26 on:** August 16, 2008, 07:58:42 pm »

Quote from: dave7191 on August 16, 2008, 05:27:42 pm

Ive got some big honey locust that I had been wondering what to do with after seeing the grain i may use then for barn type vertical siding I know I've got several that are 36" or better at the butt I didn't realize that they were that good about not rotting

Around here when locust is that big its pretty much a sure bet that its got heart rot.

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Author Topic: Locust trees (Read 2168 times)