mixing two stroke oil in diesel

[arojay]

What does everybody think about mixing two stroke mix oil in ultra low sulphur diesel?  Any recommendations on mix ratios?

[Dale Hatfield]

I have read alot  about guys doing it. As with anything pros and cons. I have  done it a few times and couldnt notice any change in how things sounded or felt.
I however can hear and feel the differance when i have power service added. So thats what i use in both of our dodge trucks.
Dale

[LeeB]

Would either one of you care to elaborate a little more on the subject?

[Fla._Deadheader]

 Canola Oil would be much better, AND cheaper. Just gotta mix it well.

[cantcutter]

So what would the point of mixing oil into oil be? If you are trying to increase the sulfur just buy ag diesel. Either way when the DOT man runs a test strip on your exhaust pipe your getting a ticket

[Weekend_Sawyer]

 I run a little Diesel Kleen in my truck in the winter it has a cetane booster. I personally would not arbitrarily put anything in my tank that was not formulated for it.

[Dave Shepard]

I don't know if it is a state or federal thing, but there is no more ag diesel around here. You pay the tax and apply for a rebate for off road usage. That means there is no more "red" fuel. Adding anything to your fuel defeats the purpose of the super ultra low sulfur diesel. I would be very hesitant to add anything running the latest diesel particulate filters, they cost a lot of money when you plog them.


Dave

[Fla._Deadheader]

 Go http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve?cdra=Y&s=447609751 and then check out Blending Forum. Y'all might be surprised.

[Ed_K]

 I don't know Dave, I just got 300 gals of off road fuel two weeks ago and it has red dye in it. I add power service to it too.

[Dave Shepard]

Our off road comes from New York state, so that might have something to do with it. I guess I have to get some more details.

Dave

[thecfarm]

In my part of Maine off road diesel is not being delivered here anymore.There is a small store that has about 3000 gallons in his tank.Once that is gone I will have to start to pay the $3.25 price instead of the 2.77 price.I add some sort of stuff to it.It could be power service or something.

[Dale Hatfield]

I strongly belive the only differance between on road and off road is red dye and 44 .5cents per gallon tax in the state of ohio.
I have run both in skidders and trucks on and off road. I didnt find that either fuel had any more power than the other or did i get more hour/miles from either.
You will find that their are as many things  that have been dumped in a fuel tank to clean or improve milage  tranny fluid,motor oil,2storke mix are pretty common mixes.
Dale

[Fla._Deadheader]

  According to the guys on that Biodiesel Forum I linked to, the ULSD diesel is pretty "dry" meaning barely enough lubricity. A LOT of Injector Pumps are failing since this ULSD hit the market.

  Maybe that's what this thread is about

[arojay]

Yep, that is what this thread is about.  USLD is very dry and for Stanadyne pumps with a little vintage this is supposed to be a bad thing.  Also in my part of the world and many other Northern locations, winter diesel is formulated to pour at -52C which is about 60 below F.  It is pretty much straight kerosene.  Adding some TCW 3 mix oil is a solution that many owners use.  Modern
ATF doesn't burn well, niether does motor oil, but high quality two-stroke burns clean with little or no ash.  Ash is abrasive.  Canola is pretty stringy when cold, but is supposed to work well in warmer ambient temps.  I have not used two stroke in any of my diesels, but I'm planning to start.  From what I hear, later model diesel engines are engineered to run USLD, but the old pumps and injectors need more lube.  I'm wondering what kind of ratio is good to use.

[LeeB]

I see says the blind man.

[stonebroke]

The EPA considers all ulsd to be onroad so therefore everybody has to pay tax on it. Just another way for the government to get more of your dollars. Some people wil not file to get their money back. In NYS It is possible for the sellers not to charge tax but they have to pay it and file so it is easier for them to charge the buyer and not have to bother with it, also does not tie up their money. Farm bureau is trying to get an exemption for offroad but The government does not want to because their might actually have to keep track of something and that would be work. You would not want to have government employees work would you? It is much easier for the state just to screw the citizens ovwer on something like this.

Stonebroke

[OneWithWood]

Adding just 2% bio diesel will lubricate the engine and pumps.  B2 will not cause gelling problems and should be easy to find.

[Fla._Deadheader]

 Just got this from a guy in Alaska-Yukon Territory.

  The oil feedstock for biodiesel is critical for cold weather performance. Clear canola is the best choice. If the feedstock contains transfats, hydrogenated oil or animal fats, the biodiesel will likely precipitate and clog filters even as low % as B5.

  Winter diesel or #1 diesel is closer to kerosene [i.e. fewer additives] the further north one goes. Kerosene is clear to -37°C

I operate at those temperatures with a fuel mix of #1 ULSD + 5% canola, which does not gel.

  When mixed with ULSD winter diesel [-37°C], 20% clear canola oil begins to cloud at -27°C, and 10% canola CP is -31°C

  This guy is pretty adamant with his statements   I'm just trying to get some decent info posted to this thread

  Have you actually done any blending, to see the effects of Canola

[OneWithWood]

I use different feedstocks when making my bio diesel.  All are waste picked up from restaurants and processing facilities.  The best is 100% canola but that is getting harder to find.  One restaurant uses a mix of 50-50 canola and corn oil.  The donut shop is using a 50-50 mix of palm and cottonseed oils.  That is strictly boiler fuel due to the very high CP.
For the greater part of the year I run 100% bio diesel.  The truck runs quieter and cooler on bio diesel rather than dino diesel.  As the weaterh turns colder I start blending in dino diesel which is now all ULSD.  I use as great a percentage of bio diesel as I can get away with.
On the same site FDH posted you can do a search on ULSD and verify that many people take advantage of the much higher lubricity of bio diesel in its many forms to counter the dryness of ULSD.  Most of these folks are running older equipment that requires the lubrication.
Converting the oil to methel esters (bio diesel) eliminates the long chain molecules that can cause issues with injectors and other stuff. 
Blending works for many.  I chose to go a different route because of the potential for coking and injector pitting.

[Gary_C]

   The oil feedstock for biodiesel is critical for cold weather performance. Clear canola is the best choice. If the feedstock contains transfats, hydrogenated oil or animal fats, the biodiesel will likely precipitate and clog filters even as low % as B5.

I do not think it makes any difference what feedstock is used as long as the biodiesel is made according to ASTM specs. There sure have been some gelling problems in the past with B2 blends in Minnesota, but they were more related to improper manufacturing than the feedstock. But there is no doubt that the main problem facing biodiesel is the poor cold weather flow problems.

I know that in Minnesota they have had to blend the B2 only when the fuel is hot and have had to install heated tanks at the terminals.

It is not clear if that guy from Alaska is actually using canola oil or biodiesel made with canola. However I see that he is blending with straight #1 diesel.

The red dyed off road diesel was a program originally set up to allow higher sulfer content diesel to be used off road and to stop or make it very expensive to get caught with red dyed fuel in your highway vehicle. However all diesel now must be ULSD and so there is no difference between on road and off road diesel except for the red dye.

However a problem arose with the terminals and distributors setting up higher prices for off road fuel.  I found that I could buy clear on road fuel for less than ten cents more per gallon than red dyed off road fuel inspite of the fact there was 44 cents tax per gallon on on road fuel. So because of many complaints, the feds as of Oct 2006, now allow you to buy highway fuel with tax and then file for a refund of the federal tax. So even though I have not heard of no red dyed fuel being available in Minnesota, it does not surprise me that the distributors and terminals are dropping red dyed fuel to retaliate for loosing those higher profits. And on the one hand, the feds are happy to take your money and then giving it back later, but they also have lost the control they had with red dyed fuel.