Help a n00b choose a saw?

[GW]

Hey all, I'm looking for advise about a good "starter" chainsaw.

This will be a general use saw for maintaining 60 acres of hardwoods/pines and an old Pecan orchard.

I'm almost 50 years old and I've only used a chainsaw a few times. I know you'll need to warn me about the dangers of using a chainsaw and I don't mind if you do. I'm very safety conscious when I work with power tools. I have a decent amount of experience using general construction tools; circular saws, table saws, grinders, etc. I always wear hearing and eye protection when I use these types of tools. I understand that chainsaws are more potentially dangerous than the tools I've listed, but my point is that I use the recommend safety gear and procedures. I'll buy some chaps before I crank up the saw and I promise to keep the chain sharp.

50 might seem a bit old to learn new tricks, but I think I can handle it. Physically speaking I'm around 5'8"/155 lbs (162cm/70kg) and wiry. In other words I'm on the skinny side, but I'm not weak for my size.

I like tools in general and I never buy cheap ones. I know many people start out with cheap tools because they don't know if they'll get enough use to rationalize paying for a well made tool. I don't do that. I feel that if I buy a quality tool and end up not wanting to keep it I'll be able to easily find a buyer for it. Safety is another factor in wanting to start out with a good chainsaw. I assume that a saw with a higher power to weight ratio will be significantly safer to use. 

I figure that a good saw will cost over $500.

[sawguy21]

There has been a lot of discussion (and strong opinions  ) here regarding first time purchase of a saw. Are you planning to go online or spend time with a knowledgeable dealer? The latter will be there when you need service.
How big is the wood that you will be dealing with? Bar length required will largely determine the power needed to drive it. Given your physical stature, 55 to 60 cc saws such as the Husky 357XP, 359 or the Stihl MS361 with a 20" bar might be good choices, light weight with good power. Shopping for new tools is always fun. 

[Ianab]

How big are the trees you are going to be working with?

Your size isn't really a problem unless you are wanting to haul a 120cc beast around, my buddy is about your size and build and he swings his Dolmar 7900 around with ease.

Something like a Stihl 361 with 20" bar is probably a good all round saw, plenty of power and not too heavy. As long as you aren't trying to fell and break up BIG trees.

Cheers

Ian

[GW]

Thanks guys.

Eventually I would like to be able to fell the larger trees here, but that's in the more distant future. We have several trees over 18 inches dbh. I'm thinking a good size would be one that could handle up to that size as long as it could still be appropriate for small work.  If an all around saw would only be good for up to 16 inch trees I'll live with that. Someday I might get a larger saw as I pick up more skill.

For now I'm only thinking about cutting fallen trees into logs, not felling them myself.

[Ianab]

Trees that size, any good 50-60cc saw will be fine. It's relatively simple to fell trees of a diameter up to twice the length of your bar. So even an 18" bar wont limit you.

OK if you intend to fell 36"+ trees every day, go and get a ms660 and 36" bar. But if thats the biggest tree you can ever imagine coming across, a 20" bar on a 361 will handle it fine.

Sometimes it pays to pick the dealer you like first, then buy what he sells. A Stilh, a Husky or a Dolmar will all get the job done fine. 

Cheers

Ian

[Kevin]

GW;
Look into getting a course in your area.
It's well worth the money and you'll know how to care for your new saw and be aware of potential safety hazards.
Gauge the size of the saw on the size of the trees you'll be working with.

[GW]

Kevin, I will do just that. So far I'm thinking about the Husky 357xp with a 20 inch bar.

[DanG]

Hi Jerry.  You're gonna need a good chainsaw, for sure!  Stihl and Husky are both good choices.  They both make pro grade saws, as well as "homeowner" grade.  You'll be needing a pro saw.  Don't overlook Echo as another good choice.  All of the Echo saws are pro quality, too. There are several good dealers near you, and you definitely want to buy from a good dealer.  B&T Small Engines in Tallahassee is one of the best dealers around.  Tim, the owner, is a straight shooter, and he has an excellent service dept.  It is worth driving a few extra miles to me to deal with someone like him.

[jokers]

I`ll throw in my two cents for the 361 or the 357xp, the 359 or Jonsered 2159 are a distant second compared to the first two saws when they are all unmodified.

If however only a few of your trees are 18" or larger and the majority of stuff is much smaller, say 14" or under, I`d look at a Husky 353 or Dolmar 5100s.

[GW]

Thanks DanG, I'll check that shop out.

jokers, is the smaller saw better because of weight or maneuverability?  I was thinking that you would want a bar that could pass through the larger trunks in a straight cut. If it makes a difference I'm thinking about cutting a lot of firewood.

[GW]

Echo and Stihl have sales/service shops in the next town over. There's a Husky dealer/service 25 miles away and a Dolmar place 55 miles away. There's a place nearby that sells Dolmar but they don't do service. The Dolmar dealer (far) gave me a price of $425 for a PS 5100 (18 inch bar).

 

[jokers]

jokers, is the smaller saw better because of weight or maneuverability?  I was thinking that you would want a bar that could pass through the larger trunks in a straight cut. If it makes a difference I'm thinking about cutting a lot of firewood.

Weight and manuverability if you are doing alot of pruning or limbing.

I agree that cuttting in a single pass will be much quicker than any alternative, and if you are primarily cutting downed trunks into firewood moreso than limbing or pruning, the weight of the saw is less significant than as much power as you can afford or handle. There is however a happy medium in that too large a saw will cut through the small stuff so quickly that you will find yourself slinging the saw more than letting it rest on the wood being cut and you may become too tired too quickly for the amount of production.

[GW]

Maybe 16 iinch is a good compromise...

I will also be cutting a fair amount of small and medium limbs on the ground.

[jokers]

GW,

You have more latitude in sizing your saw since you aren`t planning on alot of felling of larger trees. Being underpowered in a felling cut can be seriously risky, having a slightly less powerful saw for bucking just takes a little longer but the weight difference may allow you to work much longer, only you can decide how this applies to yourself.

The 361 and 357 are both outstanding all purpose "firewood" saws but the lighter saw may be more efficient for limbing, if you are doing alot of limbing.

Don`t worry, you can`t make a bad choice amongst the saws we are discussing.

[beenthere]

Maybe 16 iinch is a good compromise...

I will also be cutting a fair amount of small and medium limbs on the ground.

GW
From all that you've said, I'd go with the 20" bar on the MS361 (but at least the 20" bar).  I particularly like the length of the bar when bucking up the small and medium size limbs on the ground, as I don't have to bend my back to reach them (but then I'm 5'9"). I stick my toe under the limbs on the ground and raise them up so the bar doesn't get into the dirt, and saw through them with the top of the bar. No wood chips flying in my face, and the force pushes the limb down onto the toe of my boot.
It is a good all-around length for all my cutting.
Just my 2 cents.

[GW]

jokers, which did you mean when you said "the lighter saw"?

What would I give up by getting a ligher saw like a MS 260 Pro or a 353, or a ps5100? 

Thanks beenthere, I was just gettin used to the idea of a 16 or 18 inch bar.


Is anyone going to back up good 'ol DanG about Echo?

[jokers]

jokers, which did you mean when you said "the lighter saw"?

The 353 or 5100s

What would I give up by getting a ligher saw like a MS 260 Pro or a 353, or a ps5100? 

I specifically did not mention the 260 or 346xp in my earlier post to you because I have enough experience with those models to feel that they are light on torque(if unmodified), and as a new user I would expect you to be testing the limits of any saw`s torque.

The 5100 is the strongest 3 cube saw out of the box so you wouldn`t be giving up alot, infact, the 5100 needs to be pushed somewhat to get all of it`s potential. Comparing between the 353 and the 361 or 357 you will be giving up a noticable amount of horsepower and torque which equates to cut speed, the comparison is even more dramatic if comparing stock 260s and 346s to the 361 or 357.

We have to be conservative in this discussion because I have no idea how you may run a saw. A skilled operator can take a smaller saw and outproduce a hamfisted operator with a very powerful saw. Some people come by their ability to operate efficiently, quite naturally, and others never seem to get it. You have to find a balance between operating at maximum rpm while taking a good bite. Obviously this is easier with a more powerful saw.

Is anyone going to back up good 'ol DanG about Echo?

No

[GW]

MS 361

MS 361 C-B (quick chain adjuster) is this just a bell/whistle?

MS 361 (with a secondary chain braking system. This saw also features the ElastoStart™ shock-absorbing starter handle.) more bells?

357 XP

PS 5100S - redheaded stepchild or better for my needs?

leaning towards an 18 inch bar...

[jokers]

I have to admit that I like the 361 the best of those three and the 5100 the least.

I would definitely stick with 3/8 chain, the 5100 may be outfitted with .325 depending on which version you were to get. If i`m not mistaken the 5100 without heated handle bars and carb is .325 and the heated version is 3/8.

16,18,20" bar? Whatever you feel comfortable with. I find a 16" best for cutting logs in a pile but the 20 definitely has advantages when the wood is on the ground.

[DanG]

Is anyone going to back up good 'ol DanG about Echo?

No

   We have a cat named Joker.  He doesn't seem to think much of my opinions, either.

GW, Jokers is a saw expert, and I respect his knowledge.  I also know that Echo is a top-notch saw, but the reason I use them is the dealer.  If Tim was selling one of the other brands, that's what I'd be using.  The dealer is the most important feature on any of the top tier saws.

It looks like I'll have a chance to talk to my logger friend tomorrow.  He is through with his latest round of chemo and feeling better.  I'll pick his brain about the dealers close to you.