LL's Identification Games (Number 1) - (SOLVED???: pignut hickory)

[Lanier_Lurker]

Here is one that may provide a little bit of a challenge.

The shoe in the picture is a mens size 11.



 

[WDH]

I am on-to-ya, Mister Lanier Lurker, but I ain't saying .  All I can say is that I bet the stipular scars completely encircle the twig .

However,  I am having big trouble Id'ing the shoe .

[Lanier_Lurker]

Well, seeing as I don't know what stipular scars are, you may be on to me more than I know. 

I figured you would be all over this one.

[DanG]

Cheap knockoff of a Sperry Top-sider. 

[WDH]

Well, a stipule is a little leaf-like structure that form at the base of a leaf petiole as the leaf emerges from the bud.  In this family of plants, the stipules are quite large and showy, but they only last for a few days before falling off.  However, they leave scars from their presence.  In most species, the scars are not conspicuous. In a few they are prominent, and in a few more, the scars left from the stipule form a circle around the twig.  Sycamore is one species that has this characteristic, but this ain't sycamore!

And I ain't saying . 

[Lanier_Lurker]

I took a closer look and I think I may see the characteristic you describe - but I am not certain.

Lets see if we get any other guesses.  I'll wait another day or two before posting the next picture.

Yes DanG, you got it right - cheap Sperry Topsider imitations.  I use them for fishing and shuffling around in my redneck clothes. 

[WDH]

Toward the end of the twig as you approach the bud, look at the area at the base of the leaf petioles.  There should be a thin line that encircles the twig.  About the size as if you drew it on the twig with a fine-pointed pencil.

[Phorester]

You Georgia boys wear shoes?  And socks, too?? 

My first guess from this first picture is bigleaf magnolia, Magnolia macrophylla, although this would be a small leaf of that species.

[WDH]

You Georgia boys wear shoes?  And socks, too?? 

Lanier Lurker, we have been officially insulted .  Those Virginians are just jealous, that is all.  At least our family tree has branches .

The leaf base is not right for big leaf magnolia.  Big leaf has an auriculate base (that means ear-like  ).  The leaf in the pic is not auriculate.  It is either cucumber tree, Magnolia acuminata or umbrella magnolia, Magnolia tripetala.  Both have stipular scars that completely circle the twig .

The way to tell them apart is the leaf arrangement and the buds.  In cucumber tree, the leaves are arranged spaced along the twig, while in umbrella magnolia, the leaves are crowded terminally at the tip of the branch.  Also, cucumber tree has a fuzzy, silky bud and the twigs are pubescent (covered with short tiny hairs) while those in umbrella magnolia are not.

I am going with umbrella magnolia based on the size of the leaf.

[SwampDonkey]

............and some stipules become thorns. OUCH!!


Not to throw anyone off or anything. 

[SwampDonkey]

Am I looking at an entire leaf or a petiole. 

[Lanier_Lurker]

WDH, I thought you had me cornered.

It is not in the Magnoliaceae family.

It is in the Juglandaceae family.

I'll prepare and post another picture later today.

[WDH]

You are sneaky, LL .

A big Carya leaflet probably?  But, then again, that may be a miniature shoe so I better wait for another pic .

[beenthere]

Maybe like the Carya ovata  (shagbark hickory) ?

leaf photo

[Lanier_Lurker]

Yes, they are Carya shade leaves.  I figured the large size and my showing only one leaflet might make it a little bit of a challenge.

Carya glabra (pignut hickory) I'm pretty sure.



 

 

[SwampDonkey]

I planted some last fall from bitternut's seed collection.  Keeping my eyes open for some germination.

[Lanier_Lurker]

Upon a closer inspection, my entire yard (woods) looks like a nursery of hickory trees.  There are all sizes from two year old sprouts, to 30 year old juveniles, to probably 150 year old adults.  I have sprouts all over the place.  The only sprouts I seem to have more of than hickory are white oak and yellow poplar.  There are also a few northern red oaks sprouts.

Many of these sprouts are in places where they will have to be cut back or removed.

Therefore, anyone is welcome to come dig a few up for transplanting (especially the white oaks).

But, I may be a bit too far away for SD.   

[WDH]

You could send him some acorns and nuts .  Well, maybe next year if it rains next year .

[Lanier_Lurker]

As weird as this year has been with the spring freeze and spring drought, I may not have any nuts. 

Interestingly enough, this should be a nut crop year based on my near absence of nuts last year (with the 2 year cycles on various species).  Sadly, one of my large hickories whose crown covers part of my deck and driveway is already dropping green immature nuts that are smaller than the size of your pinky finger thumbnail.  I've blown many hundreds of them into the woods along with freeze-burnt leaves.

[WDH]

LL,

Over the last 4 days, the hickories near my house have begun aborting their nuts.  There are thousands on the ground, just like you said.  I am not optimistic for a good nut year.