Author Topic: Need Information on deal gone wrong!!!!!!!!! (Read 8359 times)

Phorester · « **Reply #20 on:** February 02, 2007, 08:32:46 pm »

SANDRA, This is not a forestry problem. It's a legal problem, and you need a lawyer as has already been recommended.

Not to say you shouldn't ask questions here. We can guide you somewhat, but a lawyer in your area will be familiar with your local laws and how the courts handle this type of case. He/she will tell you what you need. Hopefully with your involvement on this Board you will know where to go to get it. Talk to a lawyer, then let us know if we can help you further. Keep us appraised of how it's going.

WDH · « **Reply #21 on:** February 02, 2007, 11:23:45 pm »

Not only talk with a lawyer, make the contact with the Michigan Assoc. of Timbermen like Jeff suggested and definitely get the Michigan State Forestry Division to help you. You need these support organizations behind you. You will be amazed at the good they can do in support of you rather than you going it alone against this crook.

beenthere · « **Reply #22 on:** February 02, 2007, 11:29:56 pm »

I'd be talkin to the Sherriff right off, and at least have him aware of this guy in his jurisdiction (and then include the others that have been mentioned). And above all, I'd have it all written down with as much detail as can be remembered. Much easier to leave a paper trail, than to leave 'word of mouth' for others to interpret what actually happened and when and with who.
Wish you good luck and God's speed to get it resolved.

WDH · « **Reply #23 on:** February 02, 2007, 11:31:55 pm »

Also, take as many pictures as you can to document things for possible future reference.

Sandra Kay · « **Reply #24 on:** February 03, 2007, 01:58:06 pm »

I did speak to Ron and he was a wealth of information.

Received paperwork from the mill I knew about, and reviewing my notes I figured out who the second buyer was and contacted them also. That call may produce some real results.

The buyer called the logger and shortly after that the logger called me with a promise to send half on this upcoming Tuesday with the balance paid in full on Friday. He just has to take care of some banking business and I'll be paid. I'm hopefull, but I wont be surprised if its just more B.S. to stall me.

Then this morning the buyer also called, said he applied some heat to the logger, and informed him that if that was how he planned to do business, he didn't think they'd be doing further business together. He believes after the conversation they had last evening indicates I will definately get paid.

I did file a complaint with the Michigan Association of Timberman about this logger for questionable forestry practices and ethical behavior.

Hopefully this will all be resolved by this time next week. Regardless I'm still insisting upon the paperwork from the second buyer, and I still intend to warn others of this mans business practices.

So again, thanks to all who responded and the advice. Hopefully my next post here will be one with a positive outcome. Sandy

Ron Wenrich · « **Reply #25 on:** February 03, 2007, 04:29:18 pm »

Good news.

The buyers can put way more heat on him than any lawyer.

WDH · « **Reply #26 on:** February 03, 2007, 07:10:05 pm »

Yes, lawyers should be the last resort. It is amazing what the pressure of the honest people in the business can accomplish if we all work together.

Brian Beauchamp · « **Reply #27 on:** February 04, 2007, 06:03:16 pm »

Quote from: WDH on February 03, 2007, 07:10:05 pm

Yes, lawyers should be the last resort.

...or in order to avoid this sort of situation, the first.

Sandra Kay · « **Reply #28 on:** February 15, 2007, 09:35:16 pm »

Wish I was posting a good outcome, but here it is nearly two weeks later and all I've gotten is more B.S. and stall tactics.

Had a follow up call from Mr. Logger on Monday the 5th. States that he sending me two checks that will cover half of what he owes me and asks that I hold off a couple days, and then deposit one of the checks, and give him a couple days more for the second to clear before depositing. He also promises to send the balance of what he owes me the following week. He even followed up with a call on Weds and Thursday wondering if I'd received the payments. Of course I didn't, because I really doubt the payments were even sent.

He's again stalling for time and feeding me bull to buy a couple more days. The following Monday rolls around, so I call him and inform him that his so called priority document still hadn't arrived. He states that he's been to the post office to follow up on this so called document he mailed, and somehow it's become lost and untraceable. But he's put a stop payment of the rubber checks and he's mailing me new checks. He asks that I still hold off with depositing them, but ensures me that the money will be in the bank and all will be good.

Well here we are on Thursday the 16th and the checks are still lost in the mail. I mean come on.......... Priority mail should take 3 days max. So I called him after I checked the mail box, asked him to give me the tracking numbers so I could get online and see where they are. No return call. I call again and tell him how important this is, and that it's not too late in the day to track this document, USPS website is 24/7 and regardless of the hour, I could still take care of this task online.

No return call, no surprise. So also with this second phone call, I told him I was done with the stall tactics. My Lawyer is ready to spring into action. I'm so tired of this. I'll keep you posted. Sandy

SwampDonkey · « **Reply #29 on:** February 15, 2007, 09:42:33 pm »

Sounds to me like this guy is on the brink of extinction, or bankruptcy.

Phorester · « **Reply #30 on:** February 15, 2007, 09:49:41 pm »

So sorry to hear you're still having problems. What a jerk.

Too late for this now since you're done with him and are turning it over to your lawyer. But could you have gone to his home or place of business (if he has one) and got the checks in person?

Looks like putting your lawyer on to him is the best bet.

Riles · « **Reply #31 on:** February 15, 2007, 10:08:49 pm »

Somebody fill me in here. Why is this a civil matter and not a criminal one? Seems to me you should call the sheriff, not a lawyer. Save your money and let the system do it's job.

Ron Wenrich · « **Reply #32 on:** February 16, 2007, 05:52:49 am »

Its about contract compliance. They had a contract, the logger didn't hold up his end. Had he come in and cut timber via a trespass, then there may be some criminal action.

Riles · « **Reply #33 on:** February 16, 2007, 08:09:18 am »

Must be a state thing. In Louisiana, failure to pay after 30 days is a criminal offense, same as a bounced check.

Ron Scott · « **Reply #34 on:** February 16, 2007, 10:12:33 am »

Yes, I'd contact the sheriff also and go both routes criminal and civil. The continued lack of payment and poor excuses is becoming criminal especially if there are other such complaints involving this logger.

WDH · « **Reply #35 on:** February 16, 2007, 11:28:55 am »

In several cases that I am familiar with in the past, if it could be established that stolen wood was purchased by a mill, then the mill's inventory could be impounding pending resolution of the issue. As you can imagine, that is a severe penalty for a mill, and they usually try to cooperate and help to resolve the issue. Contacting the mills that purchased the wood and informing them that you will pursue litigation to recover your money might spur them to be more cooperative and to take action against the logger. You should not threaten the Mills, merely inform them that you are taking legal action as is your right.

Ron Scott · « **Reply #36 on:** February 17, 2007, 11:37:50 am »

Yes, that should be done also.

I was talking with a mill owner just this past Wednesday and he told me that he had purchased logs from a logger and then found out that the logger had not paid the landowner for the logs when the landowner drove up to the mill and asked the mill owner where "his logs" were.

The mill owner said that the logs were already cut and in the lumber pile. Even so, the mill owner ended up paying the landowner $10,000 for the "unpaid logs' his mill cut.

He said that he will no longer take logs from that logger and now watch closer from who he is buying logs from and where the logs are coming from.

Tom · « **Reply #37 on:** February 17, 2007, 02:26:05 pm »

That is what initiated the trend here that mills not buy from loggers. Mills only buy from Brokers and require proof of a million dollars of insurance before a log truck is allowed on the grounds.

Small mills would have a lot of trouble with paying for logs a second time, even though the law might be requiring it. A logger who puts a mill in that position deserves more than a reprimand and reimbursement.

I was told in the beginning to make sure I wasn't buying stolen logs and to get a signed Bill of Sale on every transaction. It's also a good idea to make sure that the logs you saw for others are owned by them and that you don't become a party to a theft.

As your service company matures, you will learn who your trusted suppliers are.

Phorester · « **Reply #38 on:** February 19, 2007, 11:54:51 am »

TOM, are you saying that in Florida only brokers can buy standing timber, not loggers? Or can a logger also be a broker?

What are the requirements for somebody being a timber broker?

Tom · « **Reply #39 on:** February 19, 2007, 03:41:01 pm »

Phorester,
I don't know the particulars other than the big mills work with brokers, not loggers. I suppose a logger could also be a broker.

What I do know is that I can't sell my trees to the mill and no logger I know of can sell my trees to big mill without the interceding of a Broker. The check is written to the Broker and he pays the logger, and the landowner.

News:

Author Topic: Need Information on deal gone wrong!!!!!!!!! (Read 8359 times)