Quarter Sawing small log

[Tom]

I say neigh-h-h---h...hee hee

I saw it Jeff.  I love stuff like that.  The big cottonwood I sawed had some crotchs but they weren't special.  The thing was shook pretty bad too and I had a heck of a time getting anything out of it.  It was a lot of work.  

Did you notice the tiger on the oak?  That's what quarter sawing is all about.  I love it.

[Jeff]

Barb, I just read your philosophy on use of wide boards page. http://www.velvitoil.com/Wideboard.htm Excellent Material. Yes, even this board has had its threads on shrinkage and stability. (Wood Science thread in edu forum).

I love wide Boards, and I am glad you are using them.

[Ron Wenrich]

Barbara

Nice floors!  I see you are using wood species that many others don't.  Black locust is one.  I've seen birch, hard maple, soft maple, oak and cherry.  I've been told that the Japanese were using quarter sawn beech for bowling alleys, since it was lower in price.

I was wondering if there are other species you have used and what type of kiln are you using.

I saw in a circle mill, but we don't pull too much wood.  Get the logs in, and put the lumber out.  No time for specialty products.

[marc]

I would saw it right down the center and get 2 or 4 quarter-sawn boards out of it depending on if you cut out the hart wood and then flat saw the rest and tell him that is all the quarter-sawn wood you could get out of it. :-/

[Barbara_Gill]

Thanks Ron. We have used cherry, walnut, red and whit oak, hickory, SYP, black locust and  holly for accents in our house. Other jobs have been a little more traditional except for some teak and thick pecan (ugg) for a timber frame second floor . A flooring company ordered some Eastern red cedar strips the other day. They had a customer who wanted it. It was not available through normal suppliers, go figure.  

We use a solar kiln for the first drying then solid pack the wood till needed. Then it is stacked in a homemade dehumidification kiln and brought down to about 6% before milling. If necessary, we will buy wood from a supplier whom we trust to produce a quality kiln dried product.  We are very small and specialized.

[DanJ]

I am no expert on sawmilling, but with the smaller logs there is usually more stress and warp that come from these boards than mature wood. I find that if I cut the log in half, then cut the halves into quarters giving you four triangle pieces. The next thing I do is to lay the quarters (one at a time) bark side down on the mill and proceed to take off the boards until the entire quarter is sawn! You get the first piece as a triangle, but the rest of the boards come out as rift sawn boards (I hope that's the correct term, for a board that is half flat grain and half vertical grain). They all come out as 45 degree bevelled boards, but I use them for numerous things anyway! Hey that is value-added right there isn't it? This works awesome with bandmills, but the alaskan mill wastes one or two boards from each quarter! Just an idea if any of you are bored and want to try something with those smaller logs that I'm sure many of you have laying around!

DJ

[Tom]

I usually cook steaks, hamburgers and hotdogs on them Dan.  A pot of coffee on an open fire is better than one out of the kitchen too.

[whitepe]

Okay, all you quarter sawyers, I think I've found
the right place. I saw J.B. quarter saw some poplar
at the woodmizer 20th. It is a given that
quarter sawing red oak will give you some of the
finest looking lumber that the almighty ever gave
us the privilege of sawing. I also hear that
quarter sawing will make lumber that is more
stable and less prone to warping.
So my question is, What are species should I quarter
saw instead of flat saw?  I've got some ash, blackwalnut,
mulberry, osage orange and of course red and white oak.
My best log is the black walnut.  18 feet by 22 inches
at the non butt end.  I had to cut it into a 10 footer and
8 footer to haul it home.  
Please keep in mind that I'm a rookie at this since
I just bought my LT15 in March 2002.

Bib, chime in here please cause I know you'll have some
excellent and welcome advice.

[Bro. Noble]

The white oak will make the extra effort worthwhile quartersawing.  The red oak less so.  The rest I wouldn't bother q' sawing myself.  Try q' sawing some sycamore sometime,  you'll really be pleased.

Noble

[Bibbyman]

Sorry to disappoint you WhitePe but a guy just can't be an expert at everything.  I'm more of a jack of all trades and master of none.  That little log was my one and only attempt at quarter sawing.  

Mary bought a lot of white oak logs this spring and I've saved out some to try some quarter sawing.  I thought if I added a couple hundred bf to my shed, someone would eventually want it.

I meant to get to the demo on quarter sawing at the WM party but was visiting too much.  Did you take notes and or pictures of how they did it?

[whitepe]

Bib,

I did take one picture of J.B. and his off bearer quarter sawing the poplar.
Basically cut about 20% of the top and bottom of the log.
Cut the center pith section out and then flat saw the two remaining cants
which will yield a lot of q-sawn lumber.  J.B. said that this method
required less handling of everything.



Noble,

I have updated my biography and as you can see I also work for the
big yellow worm.  Been there since jan 1976.

[woodmills1]

that woodmizer method sounds more like the modified quartering that they spell out in the manuel that comes with the saw. I do some true quartersawing for one customer who makes barrels for movies, museums, and the booze trades.  he doesnt need the figure but wants lumber that will not fail when it gets bent.  He takes both white and red oak and boy is that stuff pretty.  I cut the log in half using the bed levels to saw right down the pith,  then cut each half again the same way.  the quarter sections are then clamped so that the growth rings are as near to vertical as possible.  every board gets edged due to bark on one side and bevel on the other.  but hey at $2.00/ bd ft green I take all the time i need.  and those triangle slabs are great for building worm fence.

[Tom]

Hey Whitepe, a most gracious welcome.

We don't do too much quartersawing way down here except for flooring and by request, but I have had to learn how to get vertical grain.  There are several procedures you can use and the way WoodMizer teaches is the easiest on a bandsaw. Check out our knowledge base.

This is a manual I go to frequently http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr113/fplgtr113.htm
It is in our link directory and has all kinds of good info.

Check out chapter 3 for stuff about quarter-sawing. The chart 3-2 gives decorative value to flat sawn and quarter sawn woods by species. You have to take it with a grain of salt because every tree is different.

I have noticed that many sawyers, especially the new ones, put too much emphasis on quarter sawing.  It isn't the panacea of the industry as some would have you believe.  If you will read in between the lines in articles about gluing, nailing and stuff like that, you will determine that there are a lot of uses for flat sawn wood.  It isn't just the ease of sawing that makes it popular.  While Vertical Grain is pretty in some woods, it doesn't have the strength to hold a fastener. A nail or screw in vertical grain is separating the rings.  Water tends to soak in whereas flat sawn tends to shed it.  Vertical Grain doesn't cup like flat sawn but it sure does Bow.

So, while quartersawing is a good procedure to learn, don't think that it is the right product for every job.  I think that some folks get hung up on "Buzz Words" in their quest for knowledge and end up only skimming the surface of deep subjects.  

[whitepe]

Thanks Tom,

I am downloading PDF files from the FPL site right now.
I think that I will stick to q-sawing red and white oak
and sycamore for now.  I sure like some of the old
furniture made with q-sawn oak.  

[ARKANSAWYER]

 Sycamore is pretty Q sawn but you should see Dogwood,  it is the prettiest pink and has nice rays.  
 Bibby, you should have done that job by the hour.  I bet them boards bow.
 Welcome to the newbies and enjoy for what we do not know we will make up something that sounds good.

 And a 30 inch log should have made some 1x12 boards Q sawn.
ARKANSAWYER

[lamar]

ARKANSAWER thanks thats what I thought

[Gilman]

Tom,
Could you fix the link you posted a couple of years ago?  I'm curious as to its contents.

Thanks

[Tom]

http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr113/fplgtr113.htm

We have it in the knowledge base too.  Lots of man-hours went into this manual and I've read it from cover to cover more than once.   I have a paper-backed copy that I found in a used book store one time.  It's a sterling press "Encyclopedia of Wood".  There are some other books named this but none with the content.

It is one of the few technical manuals I've ever seen that makes entertaining reading.  It is easily accessible on the INTERNET , put "wood handbook" into google.   

The information is provided by the Forest Products Laboratory in Madison Wis.   Our member, beenthere, was an employee and can tell you a tale or two about the place.  When you come to the next Piggy Roast, corner him.