Butternut Seedlings

[Lanier_Lurker]

Umm, yes - to WDH, you listen.

[Dodgy Loner]

How seedstock from Canada would perform in North Georgia I wonder.  Worth a try it is .

[Lanier_Lurker]

Interestingly enough, according to the Virginia Tech dendrology site they range naturally into Rabun County, GA.   

[Dodgy Loner]

Right, that's why I'm so surprised I've never seen any before, and I've spent lots of time walking around the north GA mountains and the Smokies.  I read somewhere that you should collect seedstock for forestry plantations from no further than 50 miles north or 200 miles south, or the leaves will not come out at a time that allows them to be competitive with the native vegetation.  Landscape trees have more leeway, since they don't face as much competition, but Canada to Georgia might be pushing it.

[Mooseherder]

How seedstock from Canada would perform in North Georgia I wonder.  Worth a try it is .

I brought a Spruce from Maine on the way back to Fl. to some friends in Sautee Georgia, probably just a couple hollers from you. 
Yep, It's still growing.
To boot, she found an arrowhead under the DanG tree when she replanted on their property.
I had dug deep to get alladaroot.
Our place in Maine is an hour north of SwampDonkey and it ain't in Canada.   

[SwampDonkey]

When I was traveling one time from Virginia and on down through, TN, northern Georgia and NC I  found butternuts grew mainly along small streams with riparian vegetation on farms and in well drained moist gullies often with small streams. Won't find them too often on dry soils of oak forest, but in the moist gullies. They do grow here in our sugar maple forest , but the moist rich sites that also contain yellow birch, basswood and white ash. Find some white ash-basswood ground and keep your eyes wide open. Similar to walnuts I found in the south. Butternut are a short lived tree and healthy aspen generally live longer. I suspect in ideal locations they live longer, like anything else.   I have a book that says it grows on dry rocky ground sometimes, but I have never once seen that situation around here or in travels. I always find it in moist firm soils with low course fragment content.

[Dodgy Loner]

I will keep my eyes peeled the next time I'm in a location that fits the bill.  I've probably passed some before and just thought it was walnut without paying much attention to it.

[slowzuki]

Our pair butternuts aren't doing so well, only about 1/2 the branches grew leaves this year and the squirels took every single blessed nut last year.  Our septic contractor damaged the root structure of both of them and the power pole contractor drove over the only seedling in the area.

I hope to get some started off this years crop because I'm not sure the tree will produce next year.

[SwampDonkey]

Yeah doing major damage to tree lateral roots will cause great damage either to the crown or bole or both. That is why a lot of yard trees planted by ditches of roads get a lot of rot or tops die. The ditches often get cleaned out destroying the roots. Sometimes the damage was done years ago when a lot of rural trees grew along the roads bordering not so well manicured ditches and lawns. A whack along side the trunk with a huge snow plow doesn't improve life for a tree either.


Once you get your butternuts germinated, it will take a long time for them to get growing in height. It will seem they are doing nothing for 5 years, but they are growing their roots. I transplanted one seedling this spring and it was doing real good getting it's new leaves, then I went out a week later and it had turned black. I think they are very delicate until they have a good root system down. This was a new seedling and had a very small root. I planted it in good, soft, moist soil and I was surprised to see it die.

[SwampDonkey]

The squirrel never quite made it to the barn last fall with this one. 




One other got planted under my red maple on the lawn and 4 others germinated under the butternut tree.

[slowzuki]

Unfortunately ours have not produced any nuts this year.  I expect they will be dead by next year.  Very disappointed and wish I had kept my eye on the contractor better as he was told not to dig so close.

I can't spot any that have germinated, only ash seedlings growing below the butternuts now.

[SwampDonkey]

Are there any butternuts left down on the islands, or have the silver maples pretty much taken over? Those islands used to have tons of butternut trees as did the city. They don't live long, so they have probably almost all died out of the city streets.  And once they start they get messy dropping limbs, so they would be long gone in town. There was some on Saunders street where I lived once and the squirrels where forever busy. Might find some up along the Nashwaak in St Mary's. Up at Moody Clark's farm he had some in the pasture, but I think they dug so much loam out of the bank that the trees fell over into the river. I was just eyeing one of my older seedlings I started for mother and it has doubled in height this year and has it's first limbs. I tell dad he'll have butternuts before he'll have apples.

[slowzuki]

I haven't spent much time on the islands in the last 10 years.  Last I was there most of the trees I noticed were elm and some type of willow type thing that I don't see anywhere else but on the islands or the banks of the lower SJ river.  I wasn't really looking at trees then, only hay.

Ken

[SwampDonkey]

Yeah, I think now you'll mostly find silver maples and ash out on the banks.

[rocksnstumps]

I noticed today the butternuts have started dropping in NE Wisconsin, at least on the one big old tree I have that is still hanging in there even with some canker evident. A few more on the property are still hanging in as well but may be shaded too much to produce anything. Probably 3/4 of the trees have already cashed in due to the canker so maybe I'm wasting my time, but who knows. Should be lots of opportunity this fall to get some sunny spots picked out since the ongoing salvage from Dutch Elm Disease and TSI cut has opened up quite a few areas. I guess I'll take the advice above and stomp 'em in husks and all. Is 1"- 2" a good depth?

[SwampDonkey]

Yes, sounds fine. They even germinate laying in the grass over winter and pop up by July. In other words, you don't have to work too hard at it.

[rocksnstumps]

Thanks SD,

Well, went out and put a couple dozen butternut seeds in the ground and the rest of the 5 gal bucket got thrown out amongst the slash from the recent logging in a few areas. Might have to try some acorns as well if I get a chance to collect some from a friend's land about 5 miles away. They should be dropping soon as well I'm guessing. No oak on this ridge at present but I'm told the soil has a good site index for such. May as well try to jump start something besides elm and ironwood which I still have plenty of saplings around in pockets.

Did look underneath several other large butternuts still hanging in there and no seeds this year again, just like no production the last several years I've checked. Wonder why that is? They're plenty big and the crowns get some sun. Do butternuts come in male/female varieties like boxelder or do only the lower branches produce anything so they need to get sun as well?

[SwampDonkey]

Separate male and female flowers on the same tree. The male pollen looks like white birch or alder catkins hanging in spring. The female flower is red with feather-like pistols and a small ovary. There are pictures in one of these butternut threads or the "Tree Sex" thread (use the forum search).

My lawn tree has been in low production the last couple of years, I can still find about a couple gallons each fall though. Usually the flowers emerge the same time. I don't notice a preference for crown position on my lawn tree, but in most trees pollen is on lower limbs and female nut flowers are in the upper crown.

[SwampDonkey]

Butternut Flowers

[slowzuki]

As an update, my butternuts are still alive, barely.  No nut crop again this year.  About 40% foliage left in the summer.