Author Topic: Table Saw Recommendation (Read 5275 times)

Norm · « **on:** April 03, 2006, 07:16:09 pm »

I want to move up to a cabinet saw, been using a powermatic model 63 and would like to buy a model 66 to replace it with. Have heard some mixed reviews on them since they were bought by wmh and would like to hear what others think of them or any other model that would be in the same class.

I'm also going to buy a new shaper and wonder if you folks would have a suggestion on make and model for one.

Thanks,
Norm

woodbeard · « **Reply #1 on:** April 03, 2006, 07:35:37 pm »

IMHO, Powermatic sells mainly on it's name these days. A lot of their machines are made overseas, and are on a par with ones you can get for far less money. The 66 has been one of their flagship models, though, and they would really be shooting themselves in the foot to cheapen it. Personally, even if the quality of the 66 has remained the same, I would still opt for the Delta Unisaw, if it is still of the same quality. The price is better, and it is a fantastic machine, maybe not quite as tough as the 66, but plenty tough for anything I can imagine putting it through. My Unisaw was built in the mid 1940's, and still going strong. I replaced the original 1 horse motor with a 3 horse Baldor ( 3hp is standard issue these days )
I work the fire out of that saw, and it cuts true all the time.

ohsoloco · « **Reply #2 on:** April 03, 2006, 08:01:18 pm »

I was just reading some back issues of my woodworking magazines, and I remember looking over a review of cabinet saws. The article is probably a couple years old, but the powermatic came out at the top of the list if I remember correctly

bitternut · « **Reply #3 on:** April 03, 2006, 08:06:02 pm »

If I was you Norm I would opt for the General tablesaw and shaper. They make real high quality machines. I have their tablesaw and its a great machine. Their shaper and jointer are on my wish list.

Whatever saw you get put a Biesemeyer fence on it. It will make even a crapsman a good saw. My saw came with one and its been right on the money since the day I first set it up. Best fence on the market IMHO.

sawwood · « **Reply #4 on:** April 03, 2006, 08:29:00 pm »

Norm i like the pm 66 but for the what you pay you could git a cabinet
saw and shaper from Grizzly. I have looked at both at there Springfield
store and i think they are on par with Delta. Even the guy i know that
works for Delta repair center has said it was on the same quilty. I need
a 8" jointer and i know i am going to buy the Grizzly for sure.

Sawwood

Larry · « **Reply #5 on:** April 03, 2006, 08:32:11 pm »

First full time job was in a cabinet shop way back in ‘66. Got to run a General, PM-66, and a Uni. Never liked the 66. The General and Unisaw were a tossup. I preferred the Unisaw.

Update to 2005...got to run a Grizzly cabinet saw for 3 days of hard use. Really liked it and think it is the value leader. Really hard for me to say but...it is better than the ‘73 Unisaw that sits in my shop.

Think I bought my Delta 3 HP heavy duty shaper bout ‘95. It has been a workhorse with zero problems and I like it. Delta stretched the truth a little when they called it heavy duty...IMO a shaper is not heavy duty until your running 1-1/4 spindles. Never ran any other brands so I can’t rate it against other machines.

srt · « **Reply #6 on:** April 03, 2006, 08:39:58 pm »

Finally a post I feel qualified to reply to. I'm a cabinetmaker by trade. I own a wm mill I'll be learning to use soon. About the table saw.... I use a PM-66 with a biesmeyer fence and a unisaw with a unifence every day in a 2 man cabinet shop. Generally, the unisaw is used for ripping, and the pm has a sled on it for crosscutting. However, we'll often do just the opposite if the other fellow is using the other saw and I need to do the opposite operation. I honestly can't say I prefer one over the other. The unisaw is 40's vintage, the pm 70's. Both are 3 phase. I do have a preference for the unifence, because I find it more versatile. However, there are good cabinet makers who swear by the biesmeyer fence as the greatest. The pm feels like a more stout piece of equipment, but also seems to be louder. The unisaw seems to be a little smoother, but those observations may just be due to those individual saws (wear, play, slop etc.), and not due to them being a pm or a unisaw. If I needed another cabinet saw tomorrow, I'd give preference to the one that had the unifence and the one priced less. If I was going to use the saw for rough work, I'd buy the saw that weighed the most regardless of brand (like an old oliver, Northfield, or something like that) I also own an old darra james cabinet saw with a unifence on it, and it generally is just as nice as the unisaw, but only cost me a couple hundred bucks. The down side to the darra james is that the arbor is 3/4", where the standard today for 10" saws is 5/8", so I need to use a bushing. If you can afford the room, get the 52" fence. It will allow you to cut wider stuff, and the fence itself is longer, which is nice. Left or right tilt is an issue you may want to think about. Imagine pushing a stick through the saw with the blade tilted and figure out which you would be most comfortable with. Hope this helps!

brdmkr · « **Reply #7 on:** April 03, 2006, 09:59:42 pm »

I recently purchased a Grizzly 1023. It was used, but I got a deal

. It will likely be the best buy I have ever gotten on a tool. I bought a mule cab fence and the fence cost more than the saw

. I haven't had it long, but it is a really sweet saw. It has plenty of power and runs smooth

. However, it is 8 or 9 years old and was made in Taiwan. New ones are made in China. I don't know if that really matters that much or not. I hear some people complain, but I have never seen any real proof that the Chinese machines were of any less quality.

GareyD · « **Reply #8 on:** April 03, 2006, 10:25:29 pm »

I've had a 5hp unisaw with 50" unifence and have used and abused it for the last 10 years....one of my best friends has a Grizzly with the beismeyer I've used a few times and it is a great saw also...

If ya are in the market for a couple of great stationary tools ya might check out the link below

Redmond Tools

They carry most all major brands and about anything ya might need New & Used....if ya see a used one on the website, PM me and I'll run over and take some pictures and check it out close for ya

They have a whole roomful of factory reconditioned Unisaws with unifence for $1,499

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #9 on:** April 03, 2006, 10:28:15 pm »

I had a G1023 with a sliding attachment. They are about the best bang for the buck I know of - you can't really go wrong. When they first introduced them some of the saws had some pretty crude defects like the cast wings not being flush with the table top when you attached them. I don't see any bad write ups in any of the WW mags anymore though. Most all of Grizzly's bigger stuff rates "Editors Choice" or "Best Buy" or real close to the top whenever it get reviewed any more. I don't think you can go wrong.
Having said all that, I've been hunting hard lately for an older big machine. I want a Oliver 260D and have found many but everyone wants an arm and a private part for one. Then the shipping would be another $500+. I'm trading emails with a retired boatbuilder who has an 18" JC that tickles my fancy. I was even looking at new stuff like the Lobo 16" machine but know nothing about it and can't find a single review online.
I found a 14" dual arbor but he wants too much for it. Dual arboirs are pretty much obsolete anymore anyhow with the kind of blade quality we now have. I don't have to have one immediatley so I can afford to wait for a super deal. Sounds like you have the itch too bad to do that.

I have to agree with the guys who say look at Grizzly. You can get both a saw and shaper for about the same price as a Unisaw. And I don't thnk the Unisaw offers anything noticably better for a cool Gee.

Norm · « **Reply #10 on:** April 04, 2006, 08:09:19 am »

I want to thank all of you folks for your thoughts, making up my mind on what to get has been tough. I looked at the grizzly's but had heard some poor reviews on their table saw when they first started selling them many years ago. When I got Patty's jointer from them I was pleasantly surprised by how well made it was but still have not seen one of their newer models of cabinet saws. That's the problem with being out in the middle of nowhere, you have to drive so far to see one in person so your stuck with reading the reviews in magazines. The same mags that carry their advertising so I'm never sure how unbiased they are.

Gary thanks for the link, they have factory reconditioned deltas for a good price. I'm going to call them today and see which models they have in stock.

On the shaper I'm leaning pretty hard towards the grizzly model. Boy what a jump in price between the 3hp and 5hp models, of course the 5hp has the 1 1/4 spindles. I'm leaning towards the 3hp so I can afford a power feeded to go with it but wonder if I'm better off with the 5hp.

I sold my extra pickup and told Patty I was going to spend the money on better woodworking tools. Darn money is burning a hole in my pocket.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #11 on:** April 04, 2006, 08:14:49 am »

Make sure and tell what you get,the minute you get it! I will too.

OneWithWood · « **Reply #12 on:** April 04, 2006, 09:33:04 am »

Norm, I would love to report on my new Grizzly 1023 and 8"planer. Unfortunately even though I ordered the machines in early Februaury neither has shown up. The latest word from Grizz is maybe the middle of this month. I am not sure what the hold up is. It could be because I ordered a left hand tilt with router table 1023. Who knows

The good part of all this is that I won't have the doors on the barn finished until mid April so when the machines do show up they can go right into the barn and not sit in the workshop waiting for me to finish the barn

Ga_Boy · « **Reply #13 on:** April 04, 2006, 11:23:04 am »

A few years back I had a Uni saw on order. I found Wilke Machainery and the Bridgewood line. I cancelled the Uni saw and bought the Bridgewood.

The trunion is cast iorn the all saw adjustments are built into the trunion and are made aginst cast iorn stops.

This is one heavy beast and works well. A selling factor for me was Wilke sold me the saw less the fence, I also bought the Incra 52" fence and installed it new on the Bridgewood.

Here is the link to Wilke:

http://www.wilkemachinery.com

my 2 cents......

Norwiscutter · « **Reply #14 on:** April 04, 2006, 06:31:25 pm »

I think that the extrema table saws might warrent a look as well, considering they are reputed to build their equipment pretty heavy duty as well.

ohsoloco · « **Reply #15 on:** April 04, 2006, 07:32:29 pm »

I took another peek at that article, just to see if I was correct...I wasn't

While the two people reviewing the saws said the powermatic was pretty heavy duty, one of the guys recommended the Delta Unisaw, while the other was in favor of the Jet

This article was written in 1999, however $:-\$

woodhick · « **Reply #16 on:** April 05, 2006, 11:45:07 pm »

I have a delta unisaw and their 3hp HD shaper. I bought them both new in 86 and have never had any problems with either one. I not say the others are not as good just most of my shop is delta or old iron. Good luck with whatever you buy.

scsmith42 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 06, 2006, 12:07:15 am »

I've got a 12" Grizzly table saw, and have not had any problems whatsoever with it.

Also have the 3hp Grizzly shaper. It works fine, but if I had it to do over again I'd get the 5hp model so I could go shape faster and with larger cutters.

Budget a power feeder for the shaper. The "baby power feeder" works fine with the 3hp shaper.

To me, Grizzly offers the most bang for your buck for new woodworking equipment (with the caveat being "new"). I have a lot of their bigger stuff for doing rough cut timber frame type work (20" spiral cutterhead planer, 16" spiral cutterhead jointer, 24" resaw bandsaw). I have not had any problems with any of it.

Scott

Norm · « **Reply #18 on:** April 06, 2006, 08:04:39 am »

Thanks again for the advice folks, I'm leaning towards the grizzly 5hp shaper with a good power feeder. I've got to remember to call the folks Gary mentioned for the reconditioned Deltas, otherwise I'll probably get a grizzly table saw too.

Norm · « **Reply #19 on:** April 06, 2006, 08:08:07 am »

Scott I just noticed you said that you had the 20" spiral head planer from grizzly. I'm thinking of selling my 15" jet and getting one. Which model do you have?

dewwood · « **Reply #20 on:** April 06, 2006, 12:42:37 pm »

Norm,

I think any of the brands mentioned would serve you well, the General is a very well made machine but there are not too many dealers, the Unisaw and PM are both historically good saws. The only one I do not have experience with is the Grizzly and that is because when I went to order two of their machines several years ago they told me they would charge my credit card immediately and when the items came in on the ship and were received by them they would then ship them to me. I cancelled my order and have not ordered from them since. Just my 2 cents but I would suggest checking with them if they have to be ordered.

Good luck with whatever you decide on, buying new toys or I mean tools is great fun!

Dewey

Modat22 · « **Reply #21 on:** April 06, 2006, 02:53:42 pm »

I don't have much trouble with powermatics, I recently bought a new 64a and after fine tuning it with the micrometer its a great saw. My only complaints are an underpowered motor 1.5 to 2 hp, too lite (contractor saw) and the fence is a little flemsy (again its a contractor saw).

In the end it is a very workable saw if you do a few modifications, and it is a very affordable left tilting saw at 470.00 after rebates

Paschale · « **Reply #22 on:** April 07, 2006, 01:21:08 am »

Hey Norm,

What I'm really excited about these days is the new and improved Powermatic, the PM2000. They've revamped things and made the PM66 better and safer (the PM66 is still available though). I own a 5HP PM66 that I bought about two or three years ago, and it's a great machine, and I'm sure the new one will be just as good. Back then, I did tons of research, read all kinds of reviews online and on the forums, and it just seemed like PM came out on top in most of what I read. I'm not experienced much with Delta or Grizzly, but I'm sure that I would have been very pleased with them too, compared with what I had before. I still think that I made the best choice for me. On the negative side, what I DON'T like about the PM is the guard system. A lot of guys out there take that fence off the moment they have to do their first crosscut, and never put it back on. In my line of work, my fingers are way too important! Anyway, the guard is a token guard--pretty inconvenient, and moving the splitter in and out is very inconvenient, so much so that it's a royal PITA. There are some aftermarket options out there that work well. Delta has a slick new system with a retracting riving knife that I wish the PM had. If you buy a Delta, get that--it'll make your life much easier, and safer.

As to power, and accuracy, I'm very happy. Oh...and at least when I bought it, it was made in America with virgin steel from Tennessee. The machining is great, and I have a very stable and flat table top. The manufacturing is very impressive, and I know that it will last me the rest of my life. And I really like buying American. I'd check into whether or not they're made in Taiwan now. I think the factory is still based there in Tennessee, though it could be one of those deals where they're now "assembled in America." I just don't know.

I'd take a look at that new PM though. PM 2000

I'm also somewhat interested in the Sawstop table saw. I'm a big safety nut, and the fact that that blade will slam to a complete stop at the very moment of making contact with your skin is very impressive. I saw that puppy in action--they used a hotdog to stimulate your finger, and there really was hardly any noticeable impact from the blade. Very impressive stuff. From the reviews I've read, it's a decent saw.

General gets rave reviews too. What people tend to really like about the Canadian General saw is the strength and rigidity of their arbors...those puppys are beefy! Same thing with the Bridgewood. I've also heard good things about the Grizzly too, though I don't know anything about them.

All in all, I was very happy with my PM purchase. It'll be fun seeing what you end up buying. I'd get more than you think you need though.

There are some great online resources for reviews too.

American Woodworker Online Reviews

Fine Woodworking Reviews

Also, Fine Woodworking has their annual tools issue out on the newstands right now.

Oh...one more thing about PM. They often have sales through their dealers at different times of the year. I think April is one of those times, or maybe May. At least that's when the deals are around here. Before ordering, you may want to call around to see if they know when they'll be having their annual sales.

Norm · « **Reply #23 on:** April 07, 2006, 07:48:37 am »

Thanks for the review of your saw Dan.

I have called around trying to find any dealers that have the new PM2000 and keep being told it'll be available in 2-3 weeks for about 2-3 weeks.

The guard on my PM63 was like what you describe on the 66 and was taken off shortly after I bought it. My plan is to keep the pm63 set up with a dado head, that way I'm not changing the blade so often. If it doesn't work out I'll sell it.

The store Gary mentioned didn't have any reconditioned Deltas in stock so now I'm back at looking for a new one. I've narrowed my choice down to either delta or PM so most likely it will come down to where I can get one from without having to wait too long. As for the shaper I'm going to spend the extra and get the 5hp from grizzly if they have it in stock. The only problem I've had with grizzly is making sure they actually have them before ordering. They would most likely sell twice as much stuff if they'd stock the items they show, but are pretty good about responding to an email about availability. As to a power feeder I'm looking at both the PM and grizzly models. Again most likely go with the one they have in stock.

Thanks again for everyones help, I've got to get this cash out of my pocket before it burns a hole in it.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #24 on:** April 07, 2006, 08:06:46 am »

Norm I don't want you getting a blister on your thigh - FEDEX that cash to me and I'll hold it for you.
I also don't want you having to go nuts trying to decide what saw to get, I'll go ahead and handle that for you as well.
Now, you don't want to waste time fine-tuning the DanG thang I will do you a favor and have it shipped here and get the kinks worked out before sending you the saw a week fron some Tuesday.

Norm · « **Reply #25 on:** April 07, 2006, 05:19:43 pm »

Hummm let me give that some lenghty consideration.............NO!

pigman · « **Reply #26 on:** April 07, 2006, 06:40:59 pm »

Norm, T B A (Tool Buyers Anonymous) meets once a month at different locations. Last month we met in Springfield, Mo. at the Grizzly sales center.

We were going to meet at a Delta dealer this month but had to cancel due to lack of funds.

ElectricAl · « **Reply #27 on:** April 07, 2006, 07:08:42 pm »

Norm,

Did you call the WoodSmith store in Des Moines?

www.woodsmithstorespecials.com

Norm · « **Reply #28 on:** April 08, 2006, 08:43:17 am »

You meet at grizzly's place and didn't call! I'm like a kid with the christmas catalogs when I get grizzlys catalog in the spring.....so many tools so little money.

I keep forgetting about the woodsmith store Al, that's where I bought my PM63 back in the late 80's. Sounds like a road trip is in order.

scsmith42 · « **Reply #29 on:** April 08, 2006, 08:54:03 am »

Norm, to answer your earlier question, my 20" planer is Grizzly's 20" Extreme Duty Planer, 7.5hp 3 phase spiral cutterhead G9740Z.

No issues with it other than snipe, and I can correct that based on the angle of the in/outfeed tables.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #30 on:** April 08, 2006, 09:39:23 am »

Norm I'm not trying to steal your thread - hopefully you have made your decision or close to it, if not maybe we'll get more info together. But I am having a heck of a time finding more 16"+ saws to look at. I need a max cut at 90° to be at least 6". I found the Lobo machine but it doesn't have a single phase option. I sent them a email asking if I could get the 5HP 1ph, but they will probably say "Yes but the saw will be under-powered....yada yada"
I found a huge, heavy, old 20" (intitally thought it was an 18") Jackson Cochrane & Co. located in Vancouver but shipping, refurbishing, phase converting, etc. would make it a project and as much as I'd like to have it I need a saw pretty much ready to go.
So does anyone know of any other manufacturers of 16"+ machines? A goolge doesn't yield much at all.

Norm · « **Reply #31 on:** April 08, 2006, 11:00:12 am »

Kevin the only ones I've ever seen to fit what you're looking for are the older delta ras' that you used to see in the lumber yards. They always scared the bejebbers out of me but boy would they ever cut. Problem is like most of this big heavy older stuff is it's so big shipping is a killer. Don't ever worry about stealing a thread with questions, I really think it is a natural way conversations go and is also fitting for on-line too.

Scott thanks for the info, I'd looked at that one myself. After using the spiral cutter head in our jointer I really would like one in a planer. That is the same model I've been drooling over. Pricey but well worth the money in time saved over some of the others.

solodan · « **Reply #32 on:** April 08, 2006, 11:10:55 am »

Kevin,
Just curious as to why you want a table saw that will give you a 6" cut.
Why not just put the big stuff on the mill? I have used my Lucas for this operation plenty of times.

shopteacher · « **Reply #33 on:** April 08, 2006, 11:24:08 am »

I have 4 unisaws, 2 at school, vintage late 80's and two at home vintage 60's and 70's. Haven't had a problem or complaint about any of them. I have also used the 66 and would like to have one for it's left tilt ability. I wouldn't buy a saw that wasn't left tilt. I also have a 3hp grizzly shaper at school, an old Delta 1.5 induction repulsion model shaper and a new tilt arbor, sliding table Bridgewood shaper at home. All have been excellent machines. The grizzly is used almost exclusively for cutting raised panels for student projects and has done very well. I have one of those baby feeders with it that has been broke for several years and would waste my money on another. I have a 1/4 hp grizzly power feeder at home and its worked very well. The old delta shaper and bridgewood are used mostly for interior-exterior doors and the sliding table is great for doing the end grain on panels and rails.
Just my opinion, I'd much rather have the older American equipment than the Taiwan or China stuff. I remember when I was a kid made in Japan meant real junk then Taiwan took their place and now that designation has been passed to China. I'd look for a good deal on Ebay. I've recently seen some nice Unisaws selling for around 700.00 and if you can get one of the older delta shapers for a good price I wouldn't pass it up for a second machine.
Good luck with whatever you get and happy woodworking.

Paschale · « **Reply #34 on:** April 08, 2006, 11:38:30 am »

Say hello to Max for us, Shopteach.

How old is the little guy?

wiam · « **Reply #35 on:** April 08, 2006, 01:09:53 pm »

I understand the difference between left or right tilt. Why is one better than the other?

Will

Minnesota_boy · « **Reply #36 on:** April 08, 2006, 01:23:22 pm »

Wiam, My table saw has right tilt only and the fence can only be used on the right too. When I want to cut a bevel on the edge of a wide panel so I can't move the fence far enough away, then I have to cut with the cuto-off piece trapped between the fence and the angled blade. This is not a safe operation. The cut off peice is likely to be launched out the end at a rapid rate. I don't want to be in line with that.

wiam · « **Reply #37 on:** April 08, 2006, 01:37:16 pm »

Minnesota_boy Thank you I have not used a table saw a lot and just wondered.

Will

tnlogger · « **Reply #38 on:** April 09, 2006, 08:19:59 am »

the collage i buy my computors from has a Rockwell 10" unisaw model #34-450 and a
Oliver model #270-D table saw up for bid
if anyone is interested pm me and I'll send you the link they look almost new
pics being copy righted I wont post them here.

Paschale · « **Reply #39 on:** April 11, 2006, 10:20:22 pm »

This is slightly off topic, though I raised the issue in my earlier post about the guards and riving knives on the Powermatic. I think that for the most part, American saw manufacturers have really inept guard systems. The Europeans have us beat, hands down. Anyway, I've been doing research on aftermarket guards for quite some time, and about a year ago, I stumbled on the one I'm 90% sure I'm going to buy. It's one guy in a shop who makes his own, and it looks like it really does the job well.

Check it out. It's called the Shark Guard. It reminds me of all the guys here on the forum who see a problem, and fix it themselves.

Norm · « **Reply #40 on:** April 12, 2006, 07:22:29 am »

That does look like it would work well Paschale, thanks for the link.

Well I ordered a new PM2000 and PM power feeder, called company and said do you have this particular model in stock (I want one that has a router lift built into the table). Sure show two of em in stock, so I says here's my CC send me one while thinking how lucky I was to find one of the new models. Got off the phone after 10 minutes of giving all the info and am like a kid waiting for Christmas. 30 minutes later the same company calls back and says you'll never believe what happened, they must have sold those two while we were taking the order but I can leave the order for when more come in. I informed him no I didn't believe it and have them cancel the order. Pretty pithed and disapointed so now back to the drawing board.

OneWithWood · « **Reply #41 on:** April 12, 2006, 08:13:18 am »

Norm,
I ran into that with every outfit that I asked to verify their stock. I did get lucky yesterday and found a dealer in Indianapolis who had a PM2000K on the showroom floor. I bailed out of work, drove up to Indy, and now it is sitting in my barn

. I too wanted the router lift and cabinet accessory. Unfortunately this one did not have those but I can add them on at a later date. I do however have the saw!!

I was told that an outfit on the web, www.7corners.com does have saws in stock. I have not checked them out so you might give it a whirl.

Getting that beastie out of the back of the truck and into the barn was a real workout (insert smiley with a sweatdrop here)

There are a number of places that have the Unisaw in stock and it appears to be a very good machine also.

beenthere · « **Reply #42 on:** April 12, 2006, 10:22:35 am »

That 7corners store is a sight to behold. Like walking into an old hardware store with two floors of everything imaginable. Also have what seems like a complete line of different brands of tools and shop equipment. I try to find the time to ~~stop~~ shop there every time I am in St. Paul.
Norm,
Hope you find your table saw. I get really upset when told that 'have them in stock' and then drive there to find out it isn't. Or worse, be at the store and find the item on sale, in stock, but then to find out after the cash register transaction and at the pick-up window that 'its not in stock'. Made a real scene at Best Buy once when that happened for the 3rd or 4th time. Have not been back in BB since either.

dewwood · « **Reply #43 on:** April 12, 2006, 01:41:55 pm »

Norm

Sorry about not getting your new saw right away, that is surely a disappointment. It will just make it all the better when you do find one.

OWW

Sounds like you gave up on the Griz, I don't think you will be dissappointed at all with the PM.

Paschale · « **Reply #44 on:** April 12, 2006, 04:36:41 pm »

Man...I think you guys are gonna love that PM2000! I've got a little envy, though I shouldn't, since I have a great saw myself already. Just bought about three years too soon, that's all!

Mine has the rout-r-lift built into the extension table. It's nice, though I think there are times when I wish I would have a dedicated router table. I guess the reason I say that is that in looking at other router tables, there are some features that I like more than the ones that come on the Rout-R-Lift available with the PM. I mean, it's nice, but I bought my PM66 for the table saw, and thought having a built in router table into the extension table made good sense from a space usage standpoint, rather than shopping around for the best router table I could find.

Since then, I've seen some router tables on the market that would have been what I would want to buy, if I was only in the market for a router table. The only option you have for the built in router table is the one that comes with the PM. It's good, made by Jessum, but it's not the equivalent of the PM2000 in it's class, if you catch my meaning. Plus, I've seen some DanG good designs out there for shop built router tables.

I think it works well if you're really concerned for space, but if you want the best router table on the market, there are better router table options available to you than the Rout-R-Lift. But, it will do the job for me regardless, since it's what I have.

Norm · « **Reply #45 on:** April 12, 2006, 06:25:44 pm »

Robert I owe you a cold one!

Called up 7corners and have a new pm2000 on it's way, now it doesn't have a router lift built in but kind of wondered about if I really wouldn't rather have one separate.

Thanks for the advice Paschale, is there one or two router tables that you liked? I know nothing about them so any help would be appreciated.

You know it was almost comical, I was mopping around about not getting one and during a slow time came on and read the replies. Ordered one and feel like I just got my first bb-gun. The old saying about kids and the price of toys sure applies to me.

Larry · « **Reply #46 on:** April 12, 2006, 07:14:42 pm »

Glad ya found a saw...suppose its gonna be like the night before Christmas till it shows up.

Seven Corners, before the internet used to run 2 page ads every month in Fine WoodWorking...sometimes I read there ad before the magazine. Bought a bunch of stuff from em and customer service was always top notch.

So...while were talking table saws does anybody have a recommendation for a sliding table attachment?

Paschale · « **Reply #47 on:** April 12, 2006, 08:57:54 pm »

Quote from: Norm on April 12, 2006, 06:25:44 pm

Thanks for the advice Paschale, is there one or two router tables that you liked? I know nothing about them so any help would be appreciated.

Hey Norm, glad you have that saw on the way!

I'm anxious to hear what you think about it. I really think they've made some nice improvements over the PM66. Hope you post some pics on delivery day!

I'll dig out some of my old woodworking mags...saw several reviews of router tables that made me drool, but I can't remember the names now. I'll see what I can dig up for you.

metalspinner · « **Reply #48 on:** April 14, 2006, 09:38:07 pm »

Norm, congrats on the new saw!

I'm jumping in a little late on this thread, but I think you can build yourself a router table just as nice if not nicer than anything you can buy. Put the money you save into a great dedicated router for your router table and a nice lift.
The problem with sharing the tablesaw fence and table is if you have the saw or router set up for something , then you need the other for a "quick" cut. Not to mention the first (or second

) time you forget to lower the router bit below table hieght and slide the fence into a new bit. That is frustrating.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #49 on:** April 16, 2006, 06:20:22 pm »

Norm, glad you made your decision and finally pulled the trigger.

I did to. I won the bid on the Oliver 270D that tnlogger tipped us off about in his post above. It was quite a thrill with some last second - literally - typing . Somehow I ended up getting it and for about 1/4 less than what comparable conditioned saws are going for anywhere else on the internet including ebay WITH ONE SECOND TO SPARE

I had called the Professor in charge of it and he said the saw was in great shape and had quite a few extra goodies, blades, and the tapered dual micro adjustment fence that wasn't listed in the auction. tnlogger had also put his eyes on it for me before I started bidding on it. So the bottom line is I got more than my money's worth in just extras not even counting the saw.

tnlogger - I checked shipping on it and got a quote for as low as $550 and as high as $2000 (more than what it is going to cost me to transport the osage from illinois!), but me and the missus decided to take a mini-vacation and come get it instead. We'll be in your neck of the woods next week. Gonna take a few days off and goof around in TN and then come get the saw on the back end.

Norm · « **Reply #50 on:** April 17, 2006, 07:36:12 am »

Great to hear you got it Kevin, those Olivers are a workhorse. Mine came in Friday afternoon, started putting it together on Saturday. One small setback, no instruction manual. Not a big deal but it seems to be missing some hardware for the blade cover so I'll have to call up Powermatic today during a slow time to see what's up.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #51 on:** April 17, 2006, 08:01:10 am »

It'll be plenty good enough for me. Still, nothing like a brand spanking new one.

Make sure your first cut is something meaningful.

woodbeard · « **Reply #52 on:** April 17, 2006, 07:08:45 pm »

Nice score, Kev!

I fixed up an old 270-d at the cabinet shop I used to work at. We got it in rather neglected condition, but didn't take much to put it back right. Not to much you can do to hurt those things, built like battleships!

Y'all are more than welcome to stop by here, if your meanderings bring you this way.

Bring Gene with ya- he needs to get out more.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #53 on:** April 17, 2006, 09:25:40 pm »

I didn't realize I had made a typo until I read your post. I bought a 260 D not a 270. Slight difference there!

I think the 260 is even more sought after. I know I wasn't expecting to get into to one at this price.

Norm · « **Reply #54 on:** April 18, 2006, 07:22:25 am »

Powermatic e-mailed me the manual after I called them in the morning. I'll have to figure out some kind of a extension cord for it, the stock one is only 5' long. Only had to cuss a little getting it put together, the fence is tough to get set up correctly.

The happy new owners.

TexasTimbers · « **Reply #55 on:** April 18, 2006, 07:34:15 am »

Get busy Norm!

DoubleD · « **Reply #56 on:** April 18, 2006, 07:38:36 am »

Congrats Norm

now get it done

OneWithWood · « **Reply #57 on:** April 18, 2006, 08:17:35 am »

Yep, that is what mine looks like! I even have a Griz G0490 jointer sitting next to it!

What do you think about the extension table? I think it is pretty cheesy given the quality of the saw it is attached to.

I am actually glad I did not find a unit with a router lift. There are some third party router tables that are cast iron. Just need to figure out if those will bolt up to the PM with the 52" fence extension. Not really a top priority at the moment.

I am thinking of running power to it via flexible conduit attached to the dust collecting duct coming down from above. It took some doing to organize the tablesaw, jointer, planer/molder and SCM so that I would have 16' of working space for each machine as well as enough room to maneuver a 4x8 sheet of plywood accross the saw. Sure wish all the machines were at the same working height. I will post some pics on the 'wannabe' thread when I get it all hooked up here in a week or so.

brdmkr · « **Reply #58 on:** April 18, 2006, 09:04:23 am »

Norm,

The saw looks great. However, given that I am in the very begining phase of building my shop, I really noticed the fine looking shop.

It looks like you have a good thing going on there. BTW, I have one of those grizzly joiners as well. It is still on the pallet... Awaiting the shop

Norm · « **Reply #59 on:** April 18, 2006, 09:19:55 am »

I thought the extension table was kind of cheesy too Robert, the reason I had trouble was it was not level or square to begin with. It's still a little high in the center but I'll live with it for now. I'm interested to see how you hook up the dust collection and wiring when you get to it.

brdmkr, I haven't had a shop for a couple of years so I'm real lucky to have so much room to manuver in. Thanks for the compliments folks, I am looking forward to getting juice to it and butchering some wood.

Paschale · « **Reply #60 on:** April 18, 2006, 08:59:17 pm »

Quote from: Norm on April 18, 2006, 09:19:55 am

I thought the extension table was kind of cheesy too Robert, the reason I had trouble was it was not level or square to begin with. It's still a little high in the center but I'll live with it for now. I'm interested to see how you hook up the dust collection and wiring when you get to it.

I'm with you both on the PM extension table. What was irritating to me is that the very bottom of the leg bases that came with the table, (the screw in feet), it caused the table to be too high to allow the extension table to be level with the surface of the saw.

Had to go to HD and buy some different ones in order to make it work. Getting everything level and straight was a frustrating proposition too, but it works OK for me now.

That saw looks great, and so does the shop! Have fun with that puppy!

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Author Topic: Table Saw Recommendation (Read 5275 times)