Least expensive way to increase sawmill production

[Bibbyman]

You've got a mill that the manufacture says should produce 500 BF/day or 1,500 BF/day or even 10,000 BF per day but you can't seem to get half that.

It may be you're not getting all the power to the blade or maybe you've not got just the right set, face angle, etc. on our blade for the application.  Maybe you're not pushing your mill to its limit.  Could be a lot of things.

But once the mechanical things are ironed out, then its time to look at other aspects of the operation.  For sure layout and material handling can often be improved.  But then what? Is that all there is?

Well, you may be able to double your sawing rate just by making decisions faster.  You may not be aware of how long it takes you to position a log, get the opening face in your target,  make the decision to turn to a new face and so on.

Once you get to thinking about it,  maybe you're spending half or more of your time deciding what to do next instead of going ahead and doing it.  I know when I first got our mill,  I was meticulous in placing a log on the mill, getting just the right face to make my first cut, etc.  Six months later I went back to saw for my brother-in-law and after a couple of hours he made the comment that I was sawing twice as fast as I did the first time.  A lot of that was learning curve but some was just thinking about how much time I was investing in analyzing and making decisions.

Here are a few ways I've found to increase the BF/Hour rate:

First thing I did was throw away the tape measure.  I began to trust my eye to level a log and make the fist cut.  On a Wood-Mizer, you can use the tops of the backstops as a visual guide for leveling.   You can judge the opening face depth by eye also.  If not deep enough,  back out and bump it down 1/2" and go at it again.  If the correction only take a second why spend a minute to measure and calculate and still could be wrong 30% of the time?

Anticipate and decide your next move while you are sawing.  For example, say you've got the log your are sawing squared out and are sawing it "through and through",  you'll have plenty  of "mental" time to look at the log coming up next on the skidblocks.   When it hits the deck of the mill,  it should only take seconds for the sawdust to start flying.  

With a perfect log, you should be able to position it any old way and it would make no difference to the outcome.  But I've yet to find the perfect log.  The classic method of log positioning is to review the log and look for sweep, knots, defects, cracks, etc. and then position the log accordingly to open the best face or the face with a major defect or the "hump up", etc.  But the way I figure it,  every log only has four faces 90 degrees from each other.  So in the step above,  I make a mental reference to the four faces.  When it hits the deck and backstops,  I only rotate it enough to get the next available face.  Unless there is some compelling reason, I saw any of the four faces first.  I figure you got to saw all of them anyway so why take time rotating the log?

I've seen a lot of sawyers from beginners to the hotdog factory demo guys and I'd say I'd rank about a 5 out of a scale from 1-10 sawing grade lumber. Mainly because I do take more time to grade the boards coming off and a lot of the logs we saw for grade have some major defects to deal with.  An error could change a $12 board into $4 board real quickly.  Three or four of them in a log and the extra few minutes are well spent.  But when sawing common farm lumber,  I speed up to maybe a 7 or an 8 on a good day.

The real trick to it is recognizing how much time your are spending making decisions then making a conscious effort to move that process forward while you are sawing so there is a minimum delay in execution of the next action.

[Geoff]

I'd agree with Mr. Bibbyman.  I went the equipment route by purchasing the forklift, live deck and edger, but as you-all know, it all comes down to the operator.  I liken it to doin' hay.  The fellow on the tractor sets the pace, and the baler spits out the bales to the wagon.  The folks on the wagon have NO CHOICE but build the load, otherwise there's a mess on their hands.

The sawmill needs a steady "push flow" to keep all the operators (even if you're working alone), to keep the numbers up.  My next project, taking the board return feature and designing a chute to guide the boards and slabs into a hopper for bundling or sorting.

Nothing beats a good operator and a sharp blade.

Geoff

PS.  Maybe I'm cheap, but we run a LT40 (non hydraulic), and regularily achieve good production numbers.  I am designing a power clamp that runs off a hydraulic pump on the edger.  It's on my "Honeydew" list beside the new bathroom.

[Frank_Pender]

Bibbyman, I like you analysis of time use.  It sort of reminds me of teaching 7th graders (12 @ 13 year olds)  for 30 years.  You hve to really get outside of the box when production and quality are concerned.  Always being a step or two ahead of the curve you are seeking is really what I have often called "value added" to what it is you are trying to accomplish.   You surely have given many of us a refresher course is the business of getting the job done well.  thank you for sharing.

[JoeyLowe]

Hey Bibbyman:

That's a good way of describing what plagues many an operator.  I offer my own limited experience here too.  Of course, the almighty learning curve will slow many a person down no matter their vocation.  After awhile though, the fidgiting for the right hydraulic handle to grab or remembering which switch moves the blade up or forward should go away, and then the sawyer can start to work on his production outputs.  Guess what I'm trying to say is "Sawyer, know thyself!" or more aptly put, learn your equipment if you plan to use it.

Afterwards, things such as which face of the log to open become very important.  My LT 40 Super has been advertised to produce as much as 6500/BF a day.  Now, I have never hit that mark, bu then my blade isn't in the wood all day either.  Too many other things going on.  I've hit 3200/BF in a single day, and a job we start next week will require us to consistantly produce 3000/BF a day to stay on schedule.  Now that I have a trained, dependable crew, that goal is attainable to us, but it took a lot of practice.

I have adopted Bibbyman's suggestions about not depending on the tape measure and that alone has significantly increased my production without sacrificing quality.  Unfortunately, I know of one sawyer who will spend 20 minutes leveling a log, make his cut and then spend another 20 minutes taking thickness measurements along the face of the lumber to insure that his lumber is accurate.  He cuts an average of 300-500/BF a day on his Woodmizer LT40 Super.  To each his own!

[woodman]

 On the WM tape thay say K.S.I.W.  keep saw in wood if you do watch board feet go way up if the blade is not cutting your not working

                                  K.S.I.W.

  tape this to your saw and doit all day

[ElectricAl]

We used to use the tape measure trick when we were portable. But it was time consuming and not to accurate.
When we went stationary, and started to saw for grade for the green open market, we had to pick up the pace.
The first thing we did was add 2 heavy duty batteries. They sat under the hydraulic pump, and powered the pump regardless of the head position. The batteries were charged by a battery charger on a timer. This allowed a helper to load the next log. But the big speed was turning the log. When I broke out of the cut, the helper could release the clamp and start the turn as I pushed the flitch off to the bed rails. If the log or cant hangs up on the log stops I'm right there with a cant hook to help. On small stuff, the clamp can be moved back and I can back turn by hand faster the the turner can go.
Also, I can raise the head while the log is being positioned. Another big time saver.

The second thing we came up with was eliminating the tape trick ( not a good trick ). While the blade is not moving and as I am coming back ( we do all log movement with the saw head at the tail end ) I pick the low spot in the log and lower the blade until it touches the bark. At this point I raise slightly and continue the return back. With the number from the low spot I subtract 1" or 1 1/4" depending on the bark thickness and make the cut.
The goal is a 4-6" opening face board.

We also Full Taper saw. This gives you full length opening lumber. The highest valued lumber is on the outside. Full Taper sawing takes the taper out in the center of the log which is of lower quality. When sawing high value logs like Cherry there is a big price differance between Select/Better and  1 common. At one time the price difference between S&B and 1C was $1.20!!!  So the little extra time to Full Taper saw paid off with big benefits.

ElectricAl

[Ron Wenrich]

Here's what I have found to be productive on the circle end of things.  I do primarily grade sawing.

Limit carriage movement.  That would translate to head movement for you bandmillers.  I've seen a lot of guys who will run their carriage pretty far beyond the saw after the cut has been made.  They also run their carriage pretty far back when it isn't really necessary.

Multi-task whenever possible.  I will be pulling my headblocks back and downturning on the return.  Also setting my vertical edger on the return.

Don't become overly dependent on laser lights.  They are a good guideline, but you can go nuts with precision.  

Saw thicker lumber.  My production goes up when I can add 5/4, 6/4, or heavier to the mix.  Fewer cuts, more production, and quite often better grade yield.

Saw longer logs.  Cutting one 16' log is the same as cutting two 8' logs.  Half the turns on the log.  

Get rid of logs that are too small and too large for your mill.  Why cut logs that aren't profitable?  There is a breakeven point.  As a miller, you should know where that is.  It varies by length, grade and species of logs.  Find another market for those type of logs.

Get rid of crooked logs.  There isn't that much grade in a crooked log.  It takes too long to get them load and position.  They are hard to turn and they bust up equipment.  I've noticed they take more time to load and turn then they do to saw.  Production costs go up.

Saw for the biggest piece of blocking you can get.  Ties pay more than pallet stock.  Pallet blocking quite often pays more than 2 Common when handling and down boards are considered into the mix.  I've had bridge timbers that paid more than F1F red oak, when you consider your loss of yield into the mix.

My best production days are sawing long tulip poplar with multiple thickness.  It is a lot more interesting to saw than straight 4/4.  My worst days have been sawing fence post locust.

[ARKANSAWYER]

  If your are not making saw dust you are not making money!  I pay my help a percentage of what is sawn for the day.  After my kids learned that they could make $20 more a day just by doing things that kept the saw head moving production went way up.  All I had to do was saw.  We hit several 3000 bdft 8 hr days and that is good with a LT40HDG25.  But for a good day you have to look at your set up or you will be quickly covered up in piles.
  I guess Mary is getting more coffee in the mornings to get her up to speed
ARKANSAYWER

[Bro. Noble]

Ron mentioned limiting head movement on bandsaws.  I've seen people saw through the log, raise the head to clear the board, return and then have the board pulled.  

When making a cut, if you stop before the blade completely exits the log(but the cut is complete) then give the board a shove over the blade.  The offbearer pulls the board while the head is returned.  Saves a bunch of time if working with two people.

Noble

[Tom]

That works on a mill where the blade has been stopped, like an older WM but I've found that it's faster and safer to have the off-bearer (I call them off-loaders) at the end of the mill where the blade enters the log.  A good off-loader will have the board moved almost before you can get the head of the mill stopped and it keeps him away from the blade too.  

It allows him to make the decision as to putting the board in the loader for trimming later or stacking it.(if you trim on the mill. He will shortly learn to bounce the board to the loader.

One thing I try to emphasize to fledgling off-loaders is to keep the slab pile neat and the board piles straight.  Don't put piles where you have to walk with the board, or at least as close as you can.

 Leave an open work area.  Move slab piles and board stacks frequently to get them out of the way of an industrious off-loader.

As a Sawyer, don't be afraid to take frequent breaks.  Off-bearing is difficult work and you can put one on the ground if you drive him too hard, especially in hot weather. If you find that you need a break then he probably needed one a long time ago.

I tell my customers, who provide the labor,  that if my saw stops, I'm working for free.  A little guilt helps when you can't always control the situation. They should realize that you are trying to make a buck as well as save them a few.  Helping to take a big slab or board off of the mill goes a long way in making the off-loader appreciate you, but you can't stop for every one because "your working for free"

My favorite layout                        


When working alone

[Tom]

While I'm at it, I want to mention this.

When you buy your mill don't get one where you need to take a mechanic with you to the job.  Some are terribly maintenance dependent and break frequently.   Your job is to saw wood, not turn wrenches.

I think that some manufacturers think that a sawyer likes to tinker and because they like to turn wrenches, so will the sawyer.  Wrong!

My favorite sawmill manufacturer told me several years ago that their aim was to make their saw pretty much maintenance free for a year.  That is a tough goal but one that would really be appreciated by a sawyer and one that would save the manufacturer warranty efforts as well.

Look for sealed bearings in nasty places, Grease zerks conveniently located and parts that have been manufactured for easy repair rather than fancy units purchased by the maker for easy manufacture.  The easier he makes it on himself, fabrication wise, the more expensive and time consuming you can expect your repairs to be.

Time on the job is money, your custom sawing customers won't like it either, especially if they are paying for the labor.

[Ron Wenrich]

Seeing your diagram reminded me of an Amish mill where I did a little cutting.  He was running a Meadows handmill and had dead rolls to take the material away.

He was setting up skids to make the material seperation.  I asked him how he was setting it up.

Off the end of the dead rolls, he said he was going to stack the 4x6 cants.  About 15' beyond that, he had another set of skids.  He told me that is where we were going to stack the ties beyond the rolls.

What do you mean "we"?  I explained you don't carry ties.  They had been for several weeks and he worked with boys, not men.

We found a good setup where there was a minimal amount of moving heavy material.  They carried the boards a little farther, though.

[ElectricAl]

Tom brings up a good point about getting the flitch or board off smoothly and quickly. Linda has developed a method that "flicks" ( for lack of a word ) the board off and onto the bed rails. When I approach the last foot of the cut she has the board in her hands with a slight amount of side pressure. When the blade breaks out I continue about 4"-6" while raising the head slightly. Linda swings the board to the right some then pushes down and pulls back some. The board jumps right out of my way. Normally she can remove the board from the saw as fast as I return. Unless it's real wide then she stands back so the saw head won't hit her. I very seldom have to stop, only when a flitch hangs up on the bark. Break out, raise up, back up. Smooth and quick. Also, we do not stop the blade while backing up. This also saves lots of time. Think about it --- break out, stop forward motion, Disengage clutch, raise up, back up, stop, lower the head, engage the clutch, start sawing. By the time you have fiddled around with that clutch arm, I have cut half way through my next cut.  
We spent 4 years clutching before going clutchless. It's a very hard habit to break not grabbing at the handle.
Did I hear someone say "your wasting Flex Life",  Well the increase in production per day off sets the little bit of lost flex life.
Try it and report back.

ElectricAL

[Jeff]

Al, In the few times that I have watched bandmills run, I have noticed that they stop the band once through the cut and engage it again only once they are ready to start the next cut. I noticed that immediatly. I never mentioned it, but it seemed like a big waste of motion.  I figure if I ever get one my band wont stop unless the logs run out.

[Bro. Noble]

I suggested to WM several years ago that a manual or video of different successful layouts would be very helpful to all of us, especially beginners.  We all have a little different set up depending on mill, labor, support equipment, and end product; but we could all pick up some good ideas from each other.

One factor in efficiency and safty is to keep things clean and uncluttered.

Another is not to try to go faster than you can perform the job well and safely.

I knew a headsawyer on a big circle mill who set the dog (he only used one) on the move , just before the log hit the saw.  He could do this really fast and hold a Bud at the same time.
You have to be willing to send a log over the saw once in a while operating this way ,however.  He had trouble keeping an edgdrman.

Noble

[Tom]

Wood Mizer taught me to run  my band only when cutting.  There were several reasons given, all of them valid at the time.  Band life was one of them. Not letting the band hit something on the way back was another. Nothing holds the band on in reverse.

It was also a means of returning the head of the mill without having to raise the head above the boards.  If you stop the band as the teeth exit the cant then you can return the head of the mill as you drag the blade back through the kerf you just cut.  It makes operation a lot faster because you can pull the first board as you cut the second one and the mill never stops.  Drag Backs, the fingers behind the blades today, have pretty much made that procedure obsolete on newer mills.

My shoulders have suffered tremendously from pulling the clutch handle.  If I knew then what I know today, I would not have operated the saw in that manner.  Torn Rotor cuffs and serious Tendonitis have led me to therapy and potential surgery.  Repetitive Injury is a common place ailment today which reflects our ignorance over the past years. Hopefully next generations will pay attention to things like this and sun exposure and proper lifting techniques, etc.  Good boots and protecting ones feet is a commonly ignored safety item. Youth doesn't last forever.

Folks that do manual labor tend to do things that, years later, they wish they hadn't.  They will lift heavy objects rather than wait for help or equipment, work without breaks, pride themselves in starting before dawn and finishing after dark, stack too high, not eat dinner (lunch), ignore associates, complain about another's slowness when it doesn't exist, etc.

"All work and no play makes jack a dull boy", I'm told. When we get older, we realize the things we've missed and the fellowship we could have had if we had just slowed down enough to smell the roses.  If I cut 2000 ft in a day at 20 cents a foot or 83 cents a minute,  what does a five minute break on the off hour and two 15 minute breaks a day cost, $41.50?  There are only four 5 minute breaks and two 15 minute breaks in a day if you eat dinner.

That's cheap insurance to make sure everybody comes back tomorrow and it doesn't come out of your 2000 ft day.

I try to remind myself, "who are you trying to impress?"  

Want to add it back in?  Cut 210 more feet.

[CHARLIE]

Tom says,  
"As a Sawyer, don't be afraid to take frequent breaks.  Off-bearing is difficult work and you can put one on the ground if you drive him too hard, especially in hot weather. If you find that you need a break then he probably needed one a long time ago."

I say...." "  

[Bibbyman]

On our new WM Super with the 25hp 3ph motor and Accuset setworks,  we don’t stop the blade either.  But the return speed of the sawhead and the drop to new board thickness is much quicker than with the older mills we had.  On and 8’ log,  you’d probably spend more time stopping the blade,  return and then starting the blade again.  It may be a tradeoff of blade life vs. drive belt life, etc.

AutoClutch is a great option too!  Mary’s right arm was starting to look like Popeye’s after running the 96 Super for a couple of years.

[ARKANSAWYER]

  I throw the clutch lever up just as the blade clears the end of the log, bump up the head and start back.  Since I have to walk with mine I am there to push the slab/ flitching/board to the load arms.  Back up, drop to next cut start the head and pull the clutch lever, then walk around and get the slab and meet the saw head as the blade clears the log.  I saw alone most of the time and try to put in 1500 bdft days.  If you do not bump up on hickory you are going to lose a blade or two as the cant will bow up on you.  
 As for those who work hard and have injuries they will live longer.  I see old loggers, cotton pickers, farm hands, ect all the time in their 90's and still getting around.  I know not of one banker over 70.  My Granny had sit around the last 15 years and her health was getting bad and she was falling apart.  At 82 she started pulling slabs and getting in the way around the mill.  She has worked several 12 hr days and in the heat in the high 90's.  Doc says she is getting in good shape and may live a few more years.  All will have some health problems and there are ways to prevent most but do not shy away from work.  Last summer this grandpa worked 3 teenage boys into the ground 4 days a week and then I came home and mowed the yard with a push mower.  I am for working smarter not harder but do not shy away from hard work.
ARKANSAWYER

[Tom]

If you already heard this then...........

A newpaper reporter was in "the hills" to interview folks on their longivity because he had heard that "high landers" lived a long time. Finding an old fella rocking on the front porch of his mountain cabin he asked him what he attributed his longivity too.

"I don't know, never gave it much thought", said the highlander.  "I eat lots of salt cured pork, sweet tea, smoke a box of cigars a week, smoke a pipe in town, smoke cigarettes at work, dip snuff, chew tobacco and don't let a day go by without a quart of liquor".  I been chasing women all my life and don't sleep more'n about 2 maybe 3 hours a night.

"My God !, Just how old are you", asked the reporter".

"Be, nineteen next month".

I like it.

[Eggsander]

It would be interesting to see how others set up their work site for different conditions. As I saw mainly by myself I find that's one of the major problems, keeping stacks, slab piles, logs close enough to save steps and be efficient in motion, but yet not end up hemmed in by them when you're half done so that you can't move. I keep coming up with improvements, but I still don't have it totally right. This is definately a topic where experience shows.
The only time my blade is ever shut down is when I'm loading another log or have a problem. But then that swinger saws in both directions, so there's no dead travel time.  
True Story: An older fella with a fondness for drinkin' was at the doctor's office. The doc tells him that if he don't quit drinkin' like that he ain't gonna live too long. The old boy looks at him and says, "thanks for the advice Doc, but I've seen a lot more old drunks than I have old doctors"  

[Bibbyman]

I have made an effort to "cook" this topic down and put it out on the Knowledge Base. I tried to cut and paste from our origional comments and orginize it.

Please review it and give me you're feedback by instant message. I'll try to update it.  I can already see I screwed up some links to Tom diagrams.

How to increase band sawmill production

[Frank_Pender]

One of the things I have had happen around  here  is some of my "friends have often asked me why I do some things in a  certain way and not in another.   With this kind of analitical questioning occuring from time to time it keeps me thinking and questioning the why of my operation.  I have  found that a good listening ear makes for some "productive changes" from time to time.  And, if, in the long I find that it is not working, I can always change.

[FeltzE]

Increasing Production,

Teach your help to sawmill (as much as possible) The better the offbearer understands what you are doing and more importantly what you are going to do next they will be able to prepare that step keeping the sawmill sawing instead of waiting for a board to clear or waiting on the cant to be turned.


Eric

[Gilman]

I added a pump power strip to the tail end of my LT70 with command control.  New LT70's come with this feature. Being able to run the hydraulics with the head at the far end has been a great time saver. Not having the saw head in your way is nice too. I use the 70 mostly by myself, except when Kathy helps me. 

The 40 Super I use for mobile and for beams over 26', I do take the 70 out on accasion. After having dual power stips on the 70 less than a month I'm going to invest in a 2nd power strip for the 40.  Be careful raising you backstops though...   I changed my default [reference] height to clear the backstops.  If I raise the backstops, I use [reference] and automatically raise the head.

The cost for adding a 2nd power strip is about $250.00

[Bibbyman]

This topic was started some seven years ago.  And added to two years ago. 

I thought maybe some new memebers may find something usefull in it and maybe even be able to add to it.   

[bandmiller2]

Many times we can't see the forest for the trees,and get stuck in one way of doing things.Invite anouther sawyer over let him just sit and watch for a wile,many times anouther set of eyes can pick up bottle necks and wasted motion.Frank C.

[Banjo picker]

Good post Bibby....I read it all ....had not seen it before.....I believe you been watching me with that tape measure....But it seems that a lot of the logs i get exp for ties are JUST barely big enough ....not much room for error...   Tim

[brdmkr]

Bibby,
Thanks for bringing this back up.  I don't think I have read it before.  Even though I only saw occaisionally, I think about my lack of efficiency all the time.  I really think I could increase my production a good bit with a decent saw shed and a more rigid setup for the Lucas.  I would like to have a deck that fed bunks that are about a foot higher than what I currently use.  I think that may cause me have the carriage a little too high when first cutting, but it would save my back a great deal when off-loading.  I need to jack up a log on about 20" bunks (currently my bunks hold the log about 10" off the ground) anmd just see what that is like.  The bottom line is that sawing 1x stuff is pretty time consuming and hard on the back (I'd rather move fewer heavy pieces than many lighter ones).  I like one of the earlier suggestions about having another sawyer look at how you do things.  I have done that and it really does help.  Trouble is that I have not had time to implement some of their ideas.

[backwoods sawyer]

One of the things that I have found that helps, especially on larger jobs, is to keep a neat, tight stack of tailings. I stack the tailings parallel to the mill on the sawdust side, and a tight stack means that they will have to be moved a shorter distance. If you keep the face of the stack at a gradual taper then you can walk right up the stack making it as high as you like. I had one job where space was tight and I ended up with a tailing stack that was 8’ high, it took no more effort then walking up a gradual set of stairs to stack it that way.

The less distractions that you have during the day the more you can stay focused on the task at hand, so turn off the cell phone.

With the auto clutch the there is no reason to keep the blade spinning all the time. As the saw is lowering to the next cut flick the switch and the blade is up to speed when the saw is at the right height.

Minimizing head travel and head raise and set time, goes a long way toward increasing production, as does having the next log at the ready. I still spin the log 360* with the chain turner just to get the best view of all sides of the log, but do not waist a lot of time deciding which face to open up. I still keep my tape measure as sometimes I have a crooked eye, but only use it when needed. The more steps that you can save the better, keep the small end of the log toward the operator.

Do your maintenance before you take the mill out to the job site, keep it well lubed as per the manuals recommendations. Make a mental note of maintenance issues that are starting to develop and take care of them in a timely manor as a well maintained machine will perform much better then one that is not. 

Safety and quality always over rides production, but efficiency keeps production high, and always look for ways to improve

Thanks for bringing this one back up to the top, good read.

[Bibbyman]

Many times we can't see the forest for the trees,and get stuck in one way of doing things.Invite anouther sawyer over let him just sit and watch for a wile,many times anouther set of eyes can pick up bottle necks and wasted motion.Frank C.

Another version of that idea would be to watch other sawyers saw.  As many as you can.  There is always a little something you can pick up from watching someone saw and see how they have things set up.

[spencerhenry]

this may sound like a smart ass idea, but cutting bigger pieces helps alot. i recently took on a job cutting 17,000 bdft of pine for fence rails and posts, i priced the posts at 60 cents/ft figuring that a 7' log, and post is easy to handle, and with small logs to get a 6x6 the logs are easy to come by. (then all the logs i get are on the bigger side) while i am making money, if i had added another nickel a foot, i would be doing alot better. while milling i think about how to up my production, increase efficiency, and the like. if i had been cutting 8' logs i would be producing the 6x6 in virtually the same amount of time, but adding another 3 bdft per post, now that post is worth $1.80 more! same price per foot, but $1.80 more per piece makes the bottom line grow nicely. obviously cutting 2x means double the bdft vs 1x per cut, cutting heavy timbers and the bdft goes up huge, and you get way more money for big timbers.
 a good day last week was 110 -2x6x16, and 12 6x6x7, that was with a helper, and working about 7hrs. after that much time, i am bored, tired and hot. the sun is brutal here, maybe someday i will build a mill shed.

[backwoods sawyer]

Each site is different but I like to keep the truck close by so every thing I need is handy, and thru out the day I look for ways of saving unproductive steps, not only because I am a bit gimpy, but because less steps translates into more time sawing.

[Warren]

Watching other sawyers is a good suggestion.  A tip I picked up from Custom Sawyer was to get a set of what I call "tail gate toolboxes".  The kind that fit between the wheel well and the tail gate.  Put all of the small tools and parts in those.  Two benefits.  First, it saves rooting around in the big box to find the small tool that worked it's way to the bottom of the heap.  Second, no climbing up in the truck.  The "no climbing" is VERY important for an Ole Fart like myself....

Now when I need to work on something, I back the truck up to it and most of the tools are right there within easy reach, and I have the tail gate to lay stuff out on...   I resisted buying them for a couple years because I didn't want to spend the money.  But, now that I have 'em, wouldn't be without 'em.

-w-

[ladylake]

this may sound like a smart ass idea, but cutting bigger pieces helps alot. i recently took on a job cutting 17,000 bdft of pine for fence rails and posts, i priced the posts at 60 cents/ft figuring that a 7' log, and post is easy to handle, and with small logs to get a 6x6 the logs are easy to come by. (then all the logs i get are on the bigger side) while i am making money, if i had added another nickel a foot, i would be doing alot better. while milling i think about how to up my production, increase efficiency, and the like. if i had been cutting 8' logs i would be producing the 6x6 in virtually the same amount of time, but adding another 3 bdft per post, now that post is worth $1.80 more! same price per foot, but $1.80 more per piece makes the bottom line grow nicely. obviously cutting 2x means double the bdft vs 1x per cut, cutting heavy timbers and the bdft goes up huge, and you get way more money for big timbers.
 a good day last week was 110 -2x6x16, and 12 6x6x7, that was with a helper, and working about 7hrs. after that much time, i am bored, tired and hot. the sun is brutal here, maybe someday i will build a mill shed.

 I mounted a umbrella on my mill, really helps on sunny days.   Steve

[Shamus]

Keep falling wedges handy to prop up the beam or board you are sawing to prevent the blades from getting pinched/ heating up, especially in wonky wood with lots of tension. Probably more of an issue with twin saw circle mills (?).

[jim blodgett]

One thing we recently started doing is milling several cants, one after the other. 

Previous to that we would mill cants out of one log until we got to the last cant (in that log).  Then we would stand that cant up and start slicing boards off of it. 

Things would go okay, but at some point we'd be milling cants and the blade would need changing - it usually happened while we were cutting cants, because those are the hardest cuts on the blade - widest and usually have bark on 2 faces.

But somehow we stumbled onto the fact that when a blade doesn't want to cut cants anymore, it will still slice 2x6s or 2x4s nicely off those cants.  And once the blade starts balking at 2x6s and 2x4s it is still good for edging flitches.

Not sure if it really speeds up production, but we get more life out of blades, and so change them less often.  I think that's more productive use of time, if nothing else.

[backwoods sawyer]

Watching other sawyers is a good suggestion.  A tip I picked up from Custom Sawyer was to get a set of what I call "tail gate toolboxes".  The kind that fit between the wheel well and the tail gate.  Put all of the small tools and parts in those.  Two benefits.  First, it saves rooting around in the big box to find the small tool that worked it's way to the bottom of the heap.  Second, no climbing up in the truck.  The "no climbing" is VERY important for an Ole Fart like myself....

Now when I need to work on something, I back the truck up to it and most of the tools are right there within easy reach, and I have the tail gate to lay stuff out on...   I resisted buying them for a couple years because I didn't want to spend the money.  But, now that I have 'em, wouldn't be without 'em.

-w-

Keeping the back of the truck organized so that you can reach every thing from the ground is a big help. I do not have the built in tool boxes, but carry 2 well stocked tool boxes, one has all the standard shop tools, the other has all the Chainsaw, electrical and odd tools in it. To keep the tow chains organized and handy they go in an old milk crate, oil, grease gun and other lubricants go in another one. I load the truck before each job so that the truck is packed tightly (to prevent movement) and correctly to start with. At the end of the job, everything has its place in a small 4x8 shed that is near where the mill is set up when at home.
Keeping a neat and organized work site not only helps production but safety as well. I watched one sawyer trip over the same tool more then a dozen times and still kept putting it back in the same spot.

[Bibbyman]

We don’t saw mobile so packing and hauling stuff to the site is not a problem.  But we have many nails in the walls and along the shelves that hold common combination wrenches and other useful tools.

We do have duplicate of much needed tools so we can station them at the locations where we need them most.  The best example is the four Log-Rite cant hooks.  We keep a short mill special behind the mill for those cants that just can’t quite turn right.  Even though we have a live deck and hydraulic mill,  we still sometimes need a cant hook on the front side so we have two – one 60”er for big logs with flats or lumps, and a 30” mill special for smaller stuff that sometimes hang up or if we’re resawing some cants and need to roll them down the loading arms.  The forth cant kind of floats.  It’s on the big Terex right now.  Sometimes I need it on the lot or to control dumping RR ties or beams.  Other times we used it on the firewood processor. 

We also have had a large inventory of Sears tape measures.  We had four but we’re down to two right now.  One is lost and another needs some work or traded in on another new one.

[Tom]

Well, it all depends.  Kind of an age thing.

If you're a real young fellow and your new wife has to leave town for a week,  you saw a lot of lumber.
If your a old feller and your wife returns from vacation in the mountains, your production goes up.

[LeeB]

       

[kderby]

I have a big umbrella on my mill as well.  It makes things easier to see (less squinting)  It reduces the fatigue caused by baking in the sun.  I want to work longer with fewer mistakes. 

I have been given the advice, "A hogger is a mills best friend."  The message is that junk is junk!  Fighting with undersized crooked logs is a recipe for poor production.  If you care about being efficient you will not bother producing junk.

I keep a cut sheet on the mill. That helps keep me focused on the order of the day.  I work pretty hard to keep the blade in the log.  Anyone who works with me knows that is the second priority of the day.  First priority is safety, of course.  Not much production can occur if some one is hurt or if the machinery is damaged.

Finally, try to cut with your back to the wind.  Blowing sawdust is an distraction and a discomfort for the eyes.

These are simple things but they work for me.

[StorminN]

Keep falling wedges handy to prop up the beam or board you are sawing to prevent the blades from getting pinched/ heating up, especially in wonky wood with lots of tension. Probably more of an issue with twin saw circle mills (?).

I use this one, all the time. I've got a plastic felling wedge that came with my mill... a previous owner took a regular wedge and drilled and tapped the head of it, and put about a 36" piece of all-thread in the head, and a handle at the other end, so it's a wedge on a long handle... which means I can stick it in the kerf from the operator's position, where it resides.

It sure is easy to use, and came in handy a couple of weeks ago when I milled some 3"x10"x18' red cedar beams... some of those logs had some stresses in them.

-N.

[Jaylord]

If you are working on a large order and aren't looking for more work at the time put up a gate or closed sign. My mill site is along a highway and this works for me. 90% of my visitors are just lookers or want to BS. If it's really important they will phone and leave a message.

[Bibbyman]

Welcome to the Forum!

You must have been reading long and deep to make your first post on this old topic. 

[northwoods1]

Welcome to the Forum!

You must have been reading long and deep to make your first post on this old topic. 

One of the first things I noticed after beginning to read this forum is that a very easy way to learn a lot is to simply go back and read all of your posts! 

[Chuck White]

When I first joined this forum, the first thing I did was to go to the first post in each section that I was interested in and just started reading.

[Jeff]

Used to be, someone would say that they went back and read the entire forum before deciding to register. We don't see that to much anymore, and if I did, I'd seriously doubt it to be possible. I can't even keep up with current postings.

[red oaks lumber]

i started by reading old posts and started wondering if this forum was really a food forum. i have since figured it out ,everyone is just hungry.

[paul case]

yup i am hungry but its close to supper time and we are having anita's special surprise and it smells wonderful.
thanks for bringing this thread back up. my biggest thing here lately is to shut the gate at the mill when i am there so i can get something done. pc

[Magicman]

Welcome Jaylord.  I like to be set up and visible from the road, street, or highway.

My customer this week is a 4 time repeater that simply stopped one day last year to watch me saw.  I sawed Cherry, Sassafras, and Cypress today.  We'll finish the Cypress in a couple of days, and then work on his huge White Oaks.  I haven't measured them yet, but they are mid 30's.

[pyrocasto]

Reading old posts is a way I've learned lots of little and big things. I dont post much yet, but I'm up to page 117 of the Sawmill forums. Havent got too far into the others yet. I dont expect to make it through all 800 something though! That's a heck of a lot of reading!

[porcupine]

I suppose this is a good time for me to come out of the shadows and rid myself of virgin posting status. I too have spent many hours reviewing the old posts and reading a high percentage of them.
As I learned more I narrowed down my wants and desires of the mill I was to purchase. After a month or so I registered as a member and have continued to log on and read the new posts and review old threads as I dug deeper into questions I had and yes, look at your pictures. They are so beneficial and as everyone says "pictures". Please post them it really helps.
The photos of the forum's member’s mills were very helpful in comparing them to the videos and promotional material that the sawmill manufactures put out. Their marketing departments use photos that present best “side” of their product and that’s ok but I want to look closer and in more detail. There is a reason for that because I am out of the country and am unable to see "hands on" the machines I was comparing. Your forum provided the tactile inspection that I could not do first hand. I was able to make my decision.
On a second note; because I absorbed the discussions from the members, I was able to grasp a tiny bit of personality of each of them. Great group you got here.

[Magicman]

Welcome porcupine, to The Foresrty Forum and your first post.   I too lurked for several years before I finally joined.  There is a wealth of information (and opinions) here.   

[paul case]

welcome to you jaylord and porcupine.    pc


 i have been trying to wear more paint off but that stuff must be industrial strength.  matches my new logrite though.  pc

[Okrafarmer]

This is an excellent thread, I'm glad it got brought back up. Thanks for leading us through this, Bibby.

I would be one of the closest resemblers to your remarks. I tend to be perfectionist (within my realm of understanding). However, I retail and direct market my lumber, so maybe I have more excuse. Let's see. Saturday, I spent about 3 hours from start to finish (including cleanup) and milled only two small logs, around 100 bd ft or so. One was walnut, one was chestnut. I had the walnut preordered and half prepaid, and it was $126, at $2 / bf. The chestnut I have an interested buyer who may or may not buy some of it, but if I sell all of it I should have $90-130 out of it, whether now or over time. $200 of wood milled in 3 hours is not too bad for me. Had I been sawing tulip poplar or oak or sweet gum or pine, I would have gone a lot faster and not been very painstaking.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Welcome to The Forum Jaylord & Porcupine  With reading alot of posts before joining I never bothered as I joined the first night I found this great place and Jeff im with you on not beeing able to keep up with all the goings on around here sometimes on a daily basis too Mate  There is an awesome amount of info atm but it will grow even further just think of what will be on here in 2o/30 or 50 years time 

Regards Chris

[weisyboy]

i went away on a job for 3 days and there has been to many posts to read them all.

[Okrafarmer]

i went away on a job for 3 days and there has been to many posts to read them all.

Happens to all of us, mate. 

[ARKANSAWYER]

" I was able to grasp a tiny bit of personality of each of them. Great group you got here."

    What an understatement! Porcupine if you ever get to come to a Piggy Roast you will know "Personality" and find "tiny bit" is not part of anything with this group.  Welcome aboard!

  I have tried closing the gate, it does not work any more here. 

[KyTreeFarmer]

I spend so much time "catching up" on posts that I hardly ever post anymore.......ahhh where does the time go?
KTF

[park ranger]

I just read that ElectricAl loads the new log while the saw is on the tail end of the mill.  I have for the last 10 or 15 years brought the head back and then loaded the new log on.  Then  I'd get the tape out and measure the end of the log to check for the first cut.  I am all excited! I can bring the blade up and watch it on the end of the new log instead of measuring with the tape.  This little tip is going to save lots of trips back and forth, thanks!

[paul case]

My favorite layout                        
(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

When working alone
(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

tom,
i cant help but notice that your favorite layout dont make ANY sawdust?? :Dwhat do you do eat it all and then ?

pc

[terrifictimbersllc]

The "favorite layout"  also keeps the helpers off of the danger side of the saw in case a blade fragments and goes shooting out.  Don't have this safety distraction and can keep working faster.

This the one I used yesterday, with the board return only a very short wait while the guys picked up the board and cleared the end nearest the saw.  Happened just because of the circumstances, sorry hard to remember what I read google is making me stupid.