Author Topic: Slabbing 38" Walnut - Chainsaw Mill (Read 2062 times)

Sneed · « **on:** July 07, 2005, 04:04:50 pm »

Recently I was asked to slab up a 38" diameter Walnut log. The guy wants the slabs full width keeping the natural edges of the log. The problem is that my setup will only allow for a 31" cut. I power an Alaskan 36" mill with a Stihl 660.
Anybody out there have experience milling hardwood with the Stihl 660 using 40-50" bars? Seems like this may be a bit much for the saw. I'm wondering if I should go out and purchase the extra bars/mill or not.
Also, I plan on charging $45 per hour for these types of jobs. Does this seem reasonable??? Thanks.

GF · « **Reply #1 on:** July 07, 2005, 04:39:00 pm »

I recently cut up a 48" diameter Walnut for a customer. He also wanted to leave them full width. After talking with him a little and explaining to him as it dries that it will cup he began to understand why I would not recommend leaving them full width. Ended up quarter sawing it for him. I think he will be much more pleased with the end result after drying. If he insisted on leaving them full width I would have cut them that way.

Just my own opinion.

Wlecome to the Forum also!

GF

rebocardo · « **Reply #2 on:** July 07, 2005, 05:17:50 pm »

> Also, I plan on charging $45 per hour for these types of jobs. Does this seem reasonable???

Very.

Smakman · « **Reply #3 on:** July 07, 2005, 05:31:47 pm »

About what would be the maximum width one would want to cut a 4/4 before cupping would be a problem? Does it matter much from one species to another?

Ianab · « **Reply #4 on:** July 07, 2005, 05:54:41 pm »

Quote

Does it matter much from one species to another?

Yes

You can get an indication of the cupping by looking at the shrinkage values of the wood.

I cut slabs out of Monterey cypress which has very low shrinkage numbers ( 3.3 tang. x 1.6 rad. ) I can cut a 3' wide x 1" board, weigh it down on stickers and it will dry straight. Western Red Cedar and Californian Redwood have similar numbers and are good for slabbing too.

Oak shrinkage is more like 9 tang. x 2.9 rad. Much greater shrinkage and much bigger difference between the 2 dimensions. So as the grain of the slab goes through different orientations it shrinks different amounts and the slab cups.

Numbers for black walnut are 4.4 tang. x 2.4 rad. This is pretty low for a hardwood, so it's one of the better types for slabbing.

I'd still cut them a little oversize so I could machine out any cupping that did develop during drying.

Cheers

Ian

Sneed · « **Reply #5 on:** July 08, 2005, 06:48:02 pm »

Thanks for the input and warm welcome as well. However, I'm still concerned with the performance of the 660 powerhead with the 40-50 inch bars milling through hardwoods. I've done 25-30" hardwoods and it was slow going but capable.
Anybody have any experiences to tell about?.......

Thanks,
Sneed

KiwiCharlie · « **Reply #6 on:** July 08, 2005, 11:32:03 pm »

G'day Sneed,
I think that you would be ok using that setup for a one-off job. It is getting to the top end of what I would use a 66 for, but it should run that bar length alright, and is even better if the cut is 'only' 38in wide! I say this, because when cutting using this combination, you will have a length of bar sticking out the other side of the cut. This is very good as you can swing the bar tip end around ahead of the powerhead and lead into the cut that way, ie you are not cutting at 90deg to the log. This will make the chips more elongated as you are not cutting straight across the end of the grain, youre cutting on an angle now. This will be easier cutting for the powerhead. It will still take time, but I cant see why it wouldnt work fine for you. Keep an eye on the saw temp, make sure your rip chain is good and sharp, and maybe give the saw a spell during the cut, depending on how long the log is etc etc. Many variables I dont know for your situation, but it should be fine.
Cheers
Charlie.

Brad_S. · « **Reply #7 on:** July 09, 2005, 05:09:14 am »

Out of necessity, I slabbed a 48" oak with the 52" Granburg bar powered by a Stihl 046. Very slow going but got 'er done. If that little 046 could pull that cut off, you should be in fine shape with an 066 in walnut. Maybe not as fast as you'd want it to go, but doable I would think.

Sneed · « **Reply #8 on:** July 09, 2005, 08:32:20 am »

Thanks for the advise. So, perhaps I may as well go for the 47" bar as oppossed to the 42". Based on what you folks have added, sounds like the powerhead will handle a bar this size through hardwood. When you say keep an eye on the saw temp, what have you seen as tell-tale signs that the equipment is in need of cooling-down?
In the past I'v always just taken my time and made sure there's plenty of oil flowing! I don't think it would be a good idea to be making a 38" wide by 20 feet length cut without "stopping for air" a few times... maybe?

KiwiCharlie · « **Reply #9 on:** July 09, 2005, 07:50:47 pm »

G'day Sneed,
Yeah youre onto it. Get plenty of oil to the bar, keep cooling fins clear, air filter clean etc all helps. As for saw temp, its just something you get a feel for. Certainly on a 20' 38" hardwood cut I would stop a couple of times and let the saw idle for a minute or two. It will cool faster idling than turned off. Thing to remember is cutting at full power across the grain is something saws werent really designed for! Its very hard work on the engine. If you err on the conservative side, youll be fine.
Cheers
Charlie.

Sneed · « **Reply #10 on:** July 10, 2005, 10:59:51 am »

Thanks Charlie. I appreciate the input. I'v been doing this for a few years now as a hobby with smaller diameter logs. I'm mostly concerned with being able to walk away with a functional saw at the end of the day so-to-speak. The 660 I'm using now is pretty new and I would like to have it around for at least a few more years! (I hope) Also, I usually use 89 Octane gas. Seems to burn "cooler" from what I understand. I could be wrong though. I don't know if I get any extra power or not, but this seems like a pretty good "take-the-middle-road" approach.....
Thanks again,
Sneed

KiwiCharlie · « **Reply #11 on:** July 11, 2005, 03:28:06 am »

G'day Sneed,
Middle of the roads a good thing, especially with saws!
Let us know how you go - everyone here likes a good picture or two!...
Charlie.

maple flats · « **Reply #12 on:** July 12, 2005, 09:03:47 pm »

Most saws while idling pump too much oil on the bar. Maybe you would be better taking the saw from the log and let it idle so as not to oil stain too much wood. This doesn't seem to be a problem when you are cutting but can be if the saw stays in one spot and idles very long. However I have no experience with an 066.

Minnesota_boy · « **Reply #13 on:** July 12, 2005, 10:30:47 pm »

My Stihl drives the oil pump from a tang on the clutch. If the chain don't turn, it don't oil. Not a bit of slobber at idle.

rebocardo · « **Reply #14 on:** July 16, 2005, 06:05:22 am »

> When you say keep an eye on the saw temp, what have you seen as tell-tale
> signs that the equipment is in need of cooling-down?

When the dust starts sparking on the muffler or the oil caps start getting too hot to handle. Once a saw gets hot (dull chain) the cutting speed drops off and it starts to labor just like in a cross cut.

oldsaw · « **Reply #15 on:** July 16, 2005, 11:36:22 pm »

Although you always wish for more power, it does fine as long as the chain is sharp. I have maxed it out in oak and walnut, and as long as you keep the chain speed up, and the chain cutting, you will do fine. I give the thing a break for a few minutes every 2 or 3 slices, since I'm due for a break then too, and there is always some "housekeeping" issue that you need to do (tighten the chain, refuel, add oil, clean up saw, stack lumber, dress the chain, etc)

I'm very happy with the set-up, and don't think you will have any problem with 38" walnut.

Woodcarver · « **Reply #16 on:** July 18, 2005, 12:29:36 am »

Am I understanding the subject line on your reply correctly, Oldsaw: Do you run a 42" bar with a 36" mill?

I recently purchased a 36" Alaskan Mill for my 066 with the intention of cutting slabs for benches and tables. I haven't had an opportunity to put it to use yet. I'm interested in learning as much as I can from those who have had some experience with the mills.

Sneed · « **Reply #17 on:** August 09, 2005, 09:35:35 am »

Well I finally got a chance to start this job and things are going pretty well. I ended up throwing on a 42" Oregon guide bar along with the 48" Alaskan mill. As it turns out, the tree is not 36-38" diameter the whole way through. It's this wide at the crotches. The Stihl 660 power head has no problem ripping through this so far - just have to keep a slow steady pace, stay within the powerband, and just under full RPM to keep a relatively smooth cut.
The tree is a true Black Walnut and looks awsome inside.... Here is a pic after the first 3 slabs

fencerowphil (Phil L.) · « **Reply #18 on:** August 10, 2005, 11:42:16 pm »

Man, I can smell that tree from Georgia. Lookin' good. Gun stocks, table tops, chair seats!

How long (time) per slice? Hope you installed an aux. oiler. They are cheap and worth it if you get
hooked and want to do more of this sort of cutting.
Phil L.

Sneed · « **Reply #19 on:** August 12, 2005, 02:15:40 pm »

About 20-25 min. per slice. That includes a couple of stops along the way to let the rig and myself cool down. I am using the aux oiler and for the most part it's working well. The only problem I had so far was that the oil hole inside the bar groove had to be cleaned out a couple of times. My fault though, for letting too much sawdust into the bar groove. Loose chain.......

fencerowphil (Phil L.) · « **Reply #20 on:** August 13, 2005, 01:09:13 pm »

Hey Sneed,

I broke the original fitting for my oiler, so I drilled my own version out of a pretty hard bolt.
(Three marks on the bolt head - grade six or five?)
Drilled a single hole down through the bolt to core it out,
then drilled one carefully-spaced hole horizontally to meet this oil passage.

My replacement only has one oil hole, but that single hole is larger.
I spaced the hole, so that I could use a lock ring above and below the bar.
On top of the bolt I filed an indicator notch, so that I could always check the alignment.
(The original has multiple holes so this alignment issue is less critical. With my 'homie,'
however, alignment IS critical.)

This clogs less easily, but I do have to fight my tendency to be cheep,
cheep, cheap and run too little oil:
It is better to run too much oil, waste a tad, but keep that hole clear.
Running the oil a little heavy seems to prevent that oil port/hole from clogging.
It never fails that, if I run too little, or if I forget to open the valve back before
the beginning of the next cut, that it will clog up.

In other words, a good out-flow of oil seems to be the best prevention of clogs.

Phil L.

Kevin · « **Reply #21 on:** August 13, 2005, 02:06:37 pm »

Thinning the oil may help as well.

fencerowphil (Phil L.) · « **Reply #22 on:** August 14, 2005, 03:28:57 pm »

Good point Kevin,

Malloff used #10 hydraulic oil for his milling.
Now that is THIN! I have never done it.

Phil L.

Sneed · « **Reply #23 on:** August 16, 2005, 11:59:56 am »

I like the idea of a larger oil hole on the "bolt". Thinning is a great idea as well... especially in colder weather where the aux tank is sittin' way up there on top of the mill. It can get pretty cold up here in the northeastern USA.
On a slightly different note, I would like to redrill another oiler hole on the other side of my bar so that I can flip it over. What goes on with the original hole? Leave it be? Plug it up? Common sense tells me to plug it up somehow.

oldschoolmiller · « **Reply #24 on:** August 16, 2005, 01:41:58 pm »

The longer the bar, the longer it will take to cut through the log. You are in for a work out with a bar that size, it will work, just be a little slower then usual, good luck

oldsaw · « **Reply #25 on:** August 18, 2005, 09:20:10 pm »

I've gone "full slab", just shy of 36" with both oak and walnut. It's not fast, but, when you see the amount of sawdust coming out, you know it isn't going to get much faster either...without more revs.

Cutting wide slabs will get you mountains of sawdust, which is a good thing when you finish up on your knees.

fencerowphil (Phil L.) · « **Reply #26 on:** August 20, 2005, 05:58:14 pm »

Sneed,
I have never worried about the open hole left on the other side of the bar when the bar is flipped.
As a matter of fact I have one bar with three holes, thanks to the fact that I drilled one hole wrong.
$:-\$
When you thiMk about it, the aux. oiler hole which is in use is sending its supply of oil directly down the "working edge" of the bar. The unused hole is way round the bar groove. Whatever tiny bit of oil you might lose won't really matter.

(Of course Adrian Monk would plug it, but also Adrian Monk would not be using a chain saw!)

Phil L. P.S. to OldSaw: It's so hot in Georgia today, that I need some sawdust to kneel in to
Pray - Pray for cooler weather. The only sawing I can do when it's
over 100 Deg. like this is to watch video down-loads of the Granberg
mill demos. Yuk, yuk!

Air-conditioned comfort!

News:

Author Topic: Slabbing 38" Walnut - Chainsaw Mill (Read 2062 times)