Stumpage price

[farmerdoug]

Hi,

     I have located the stumpage prices for the more valuable woods(ie. oak, ash, maple, cherry).  What I am wondering what is the stumpage value of woods like cottonwood, popular, elm, etc?  I am located in the Thumb of Michigan if that helps.

Thanks

[footer]

You could call some local loggers and ask what they are paying.

[Barkman]

You should also find out what the mills are paying for this wood in your area right now.  The woods you mention may or may not have much of a "log" market in your area.  They may mostly be used for pulp.  For example, in my area you can pretty much only sell Poplar (either Balsam or Balm of Gilead) to the nearby IP mill.  I think they sort out some of their better stuff to sell for logs.  But, I don't know anyone around here that will buy popple logs.  You should definitely check though, since the quality of species varies so much from one area to another etc.

[Hoop]

Loggers seem to be fighting each other around here to see who can go bankrupt the soonest.  They do it by bidding ridiculous stumpage prices so high they can't even think about making a profit, much less breaking even.

I've seen popple pulp being bid at $60/cord for stumpage.  Its insane.

Naturally, as a landowner, one wants to benefit from the brain dead activity taking place in the bidding wars.  It truly is a double edged sword.  The landowner may indeed benefit handsomely when bidding wars over stumpage take place.  However, a logger usually goes bankrupt when they throw reason out the window.  Bankrupt loggers NEVER pay stumpage.

DO YOUR HOMEWORK!

Talk to your banker to see if the logger you're thinking about is on solid financial footing.  If not, look elsewhere.

[SwampDonkey]

Hi Barkman,

Some folks are cutting some of their better aspen trees for veneer. It's nothing like hardwood veneer , price-wise. The marketing board here has been buying small quantities to ship the Miramichi/Nelson, NB to a plywood plant.

farmerdoug , if you want some US$ prices for your pulpwoods check our marketing board site. The softwood pulp prices are CAN$

www.cvwpa.ca

and search by species or mill under the Markets link. I can't see that prices in Michegan would be that much different than in Maine pulp mills. Stumpage is usually 20-30 % of mill delivered price.

[farmerdoug]

Thanks for the info so far.  I am checking out the site you listed SwampDonkey.
I do not think there is a pulp mill close enough to me to make hauling it there worth it.  Most of it is left in the woods to take over after they cut out the good trees.  I burn alot of it now but when I get a mill I hope to make it more useful.  I am thinking that I could buy it from the owners reasonably but I am trying to price it so I know where I can start at.  I hope that is clear as mud.

Around here the loggers are trying to get rich buying cheap as they can.  I seen a 4 acre tract of 60% red oak single stem and 40 hard maple, all nice trees go for $1500.00 on a sealed bid.

[SwampDonkey]

Well, I pay for my firewood in 100 inch or treelength at same mill delivered price for pulpwood. Maybe that helps. I don't know how you could get it any cheaper. If the logger has to do all the bucking to sell it as 20 inch for instance, than it can be worth more than pulpwood price. The neighbor next door paid $360 a cord cut to length and delivered. I suspenct he got stung buying it by the face cord. He paid $1800 for 5 cords of wood. I paid $1680 for 14.5 cords, treelength. I got mine all cut up in 5 days and piled. Looks like I can buck wood cheeper than the stovewood cutter, even at $15/hr = $600 for 40 hrs work. Only thing is, my time was free. Hmm 

[Hoop]

http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/land/forestry/Private/Harvest/NR_46.htm

Shows all the stumpage prices for the native woods of Wisconsin in various areas throughout the state.

Of course, the prices will vary from your location in Michigan....but they shouldn't vary THAT MUCH.

[Barkman]

Hi Barkman,

Some folks are cutting some of their better aspen trees for veneer. It's nothing like hardwood veneer , price-wise. The marketing board here has been buying small quantities to ship the Miramichi/Nelson, NB to a plywood plant.

farmerdoug , if you want some US$ prices for your pulpwoods check our marketing board site. The softwood pulp prices are CAN$

www.cvwpa.ca

and search by species or mill under the Markets link. I can't see that prices in Michegan would be that much different than in Maine pulp mills. Stumpage is usually 20-30 % of mill delivered price.

SwampDonkey,

You're right, there are people buying Popple for veneer or log grade.  I see the end product at Home Cheapo and others.  I guess I don't consider it very viable because, with the quality of Popple wood the way it is around here, you'd have to have an awful lot of it to make a load.  In this area, they tend to have bad spots half way up the tree, so its hard to make a veneer log out of them. 

[Woodcarver]

I suspect the bad spots you refer to are hpoxylon canker, Barkman. It's commonplace in the aspen around here,too.  I'm finding canker and just about every other fungus know to infect aspen in the trees I've been cutting in my woodlot this winter. 

I had hoped to sell some of what I cut as sawlogs, but more than 90% of the logs I've cut shows some degree of discoloration (fungal staining).  It would take a long time (and more acreage than I own) to accumulate a load of sawlogs. 

[farmerdoug]

Thanks for you answers.  They helped alot and give me a place to start.  It seems most of the low grade wood I was asking about in this area is either left standing or laying in the woods here.  If it has to be removed it is chipped and sent to the Flint biomass power plant.  This about pays for the hauling I have been told so it costs the owner to remove it.  When I get my mill i think I will have no problem getting the logs real reasonable.

[SwampDonkey]

Yes Barkman, to the south of me in the lowlands the poplar is not that healthy looking, alot of false-tinder conk as well as hypoxylin and target cankers. It does fairly well around my area if not too wet or too dry a soil and can get up to 40 inches before dying. I've gotta go up the Tobique to get some photos this summer. I didn't get up there last summer.

Elsewhere on this forum is a thread of or Marketing Board yard with some poplar veneer stacked behind the office.

Link

[Ron Scott]

Farmerdoug,

The Stumpage Price Reports published by the Michigan DNR Forest Management Division should be of help. Use the prices for the Forest Management  Area nearest to you.

See
http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10368_22594-81536--,00.html

[farmerdoug]

Thanks Ron,

It is a good indicator for the area.  Ash sure has bottomed out though.  The softwoods are worth more than the hardwoods except red oak, cherry and sugar maple for the most part.